I just love it when I come to tv.com and scroll down directly to the comments to find realistic and so spot on reviews of the show I love like this one! Good job Fringefanatic, keep it coming!
That's so nice of you to say! You must have had to scroll WAY down. Thanks, man.
Also has anyone mentioned the ending? The flashback voiceover of Carol talking about change. Felt like the message was Lizzie and Mika did change her, for the better.. somewhat.
Oh damn FringeFanatic, you basically did Tim's job for him! XD
Fantastic episode, strongest of the season even.
I was not expecting Lizzie to be killed off so quickly, but I knew it had to come eventually. Of course Carol the realist brought that little plot point straight home so we could have a fully emotionally charged then spent episode.
No loose ends, everything came to a head and that was just such a relief.
Good to have you back FF, comments like this add to the site!
Thank you! Coming from a super contributor like you that means a lot.
Lizzie had to go. Plain & simple. I was just questioning if the show would have the balls to shoot such a scene. They did. And I was genuinely shocked....
Go Carol btw. MVP of said episode. I was getting restless, I admit it...but the last 10 minutes were iveting!!
Glad to have you back @FringeFanatic, we missed you dearly!
Excellent point about The Walking Dead's ability to raise thought-provoking questions. Many have recently voiced their concern about 'where' the show is headed plot-wise (myself included), but the writers have always been adamant, like you mentioned, that the series it about the characters and what they do to survive and how it may or may not change them for better or worse. While I personally prefer plot-driven stories, I think episodes like this prove that the series can be excellent without the need to focus on plot - as long as they continue to raise introspective questions for its characters, and therefore it's audiences, because they really have the profound ability to suck you into the show and really make you think.
Interestingly enough, the biggest question for me this episode wasn't would I have killed Lizzie, because I know I would have, and I probably would have done it as soon as I had the gun out of her hands to (none of that anxious and painful waiting). Maybe I'm heartless, but I think that's what I'd do in that situation. Anyway, my biggest question would have been: Would I want to stay at the grove, or continue on to Terminus? That would be a much tougher decision for me because the house offered them a lot of things that could have lead to a stable future, something that they may not be able to find again, but the allure of a larger and stronger group, with possibly an even more provisions and shelter would seriously make me think long and hard about whether I would decide to stay or not.
Anyway, you raised all these philosophical questions @FringeFanatic, but you sneakily never answered them yourself... So would you have killed Lizzie?
Hey, thanks Slayerette! It seems like every time I return from a TV.com hiatus you're right there to welcome me back. You're awesome.
As for the show, and the question of killing Lizzie or not, I believe it had to be done. Lizzie would have killed Judith if she had more time and would have been an ongoing danger to Carol and Tyreese, as well. Her particular kind of mental illness almost made it inevitable she was not long for this world, and I think Carol did the right and humane thing (just leaving here alone would have only served as a longer more painful death sentence).
One interesting point another commenter brought up was that if Carol and Tyreese were true survivalists, they would have killed Judith and kept Lizzie for her headshot skills. Even though I disagree (as Carol pointed out, Lizzie could kill them in their sleep) it's these kind of morally repugnant decisions that make this show a continually fascinating take on how far people would go to survive.
Now onto The Grove vs. Terminus debate, I've always been of the mind in the zombie apocalypse that there is strength in numbers. The Grove had several attractive qualities and I'm quite sure it could have supported them, but so did The Farm, and The Prison. What if a horde came through? What if a marauding band of rapists and murderers (a la Darryl's current group) showed up? If any problems arose two adults and a finite amount of ammo probably wouldn't be adequate for survival.
I mean, look at what the Governor did in Woodbury. He had created a bonafide civilization and they were going strong until his psychopathic ways and Rick's group fucked it all up. I think TWD has demonstrated that the more people you can surround yourself with the better chance you have at surviving the perils of this apocalypse.
(P.S. If you've ever read World War Z, READ, not watched the movie, because that was a pile of crap, then you'd look at TWD in a completely different light. First of all, I don't think the entire structures of civilization would have broken down with zombies so slow and meandering. Humanity would have won out. Also, if these people would just plan better they could beat back the apocalypse with a vengeance. Ah well, I guess it's easy to be a Monday morning apocalypse survivor.)
As you I like to believe there still is a possible future humankind, although it maybe some time until they reach that point. Too many think they're just doomed and it's only a matter of time. See my short comment discussion with fujin_mage a few comments above.
Hey, slayerette, my dark-souled-friend. I was looking for your reaction. I knew you would have put her down without thinking about it, since you earlier were in favor of smothering the baby.
The house did have a lot to offer, but it also served as a reminder of what they had to do. Most families choose to not stay in the same house if one of their kids die, this was the same thing.
I also think Tyreese didn't want to be alone with Carol anymore, not because he was afraid of her. I think he just wants to be away from her
I wouldn't blame him, either. Getting hit with the news that you're trekking with the one person responsible for the death of your girlfriend has gotta be hard to take. I wouldn't be surprised if he hasn't fully forgiven her yet, he just said that he did because everyone needed a moment of civility.
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