6 Reasons Why Networks Are Trimming Orders Instead of Canceling Shows

Remember the good old days when networks would swiftly drop the axe on a show's neck, the body would run around for a few hours, and then we'd never hear from the show again? It would be yanked from existence forever? Those days are GONE. Now networks are "trimming orders" instead of throwing shows in the dumpster effective immediately (however, there should be no dispute that these shows are effectively canceled, they just get to hang out a little while longer). 

Fox's Minority Report, ABC's Blood & Oil, and NBC's The Player and Truth Be Told have all seen their initial 13-episode orders cut down to 10 episodes (except The Player, which was shortened to nine) rather than scooted off the network to never be heard from again. Are networks nicer? Maybe. But the real answers involve a few more factors. 

I have six theories for why we're seeing "trims" instead of lopping the whole head off. Read 'em, and then pick 'em apart or agree wholeheartedly in the comments. 


1. Face Saving for Networks

Networks aren't just places to go watch TV shows, they're brands. And image is everything when it comes to creating a successful brand. Do you think NBC wants to admit failure with The Player and Truth Be Told? Heck no! So why not just say it's "trimming the order" instead of using the C-word? And think about that phrase "trimming"—which I don't know if it originated with the media or the networks—it has such a pleasant ring to it. It's like, "No, we're not sending this show to Hell, we're just giving it a haircut." Or, "All these people who work on this who won't be fired, we're just pruning the show, you know, for its own good." Networks have long used euphemisms for "canceled," such as, "We're still in discussions about the future of the show" and hope the press stops asking questions, trimming and cutting an order are just the latest nice-guy nomenclature.


2. Shows Finish on Their Own Terms

There's something to be said about letting a show get to the finish line on its own terms, and this season, most shows that have had their orders trimmed (Truth Be Told was in production on its tenth episode, but it's a comedy so it can essentially end whenever) will have enough time to whip up a series finale rather than end in the middle of a story. Weren't we all dying to know what happened on We Are Men? The idea of finishing what it started goes back to our first item on the list, in that it looks better for networks to have a complete season in the history books instead of a partial season dangling and staining reputation. But letting a show finish also means big things for items 3 and 4 in the list! 



3. The Bridges Remain Unburnt

Before cable started eating away at the market share of television, the big networks had all the power. If you wanted to get into TV production, you had to kiss the asses of CBS, NBC, ABC, etc. But with so many options out there as every single network begins to offer original programming, big names on the creative side of things are finding work and freedom in basic and premium cable. Networks don't know who the next big showrunner will be, so they have to be extra careful with who they kick to the curb. Look at someone like Fargo creator Noah Hawley, who's now hot hot hot and in demand by everyone. He had two shows at ABC—The Unusuals and  My Generation—the second of which was canceled after two episodes. You think he's interested in giving ABC and network television another shot? There's a power shift going on between networks and creators simply because networks aren't the only game in town. Playing nice makes more sense for networks now, because you never know who will be worthy of a second chance.


4. Life (and Money) After Death in Streaming

There once was a time when a show got canceled, it was never heard from again. Ask your grandparents or older sister! But now, the internet finely preserves failed series over streaming sources like Amazon, Netflix, and whatever other sites out there come up with funny names and pay exorbitant amounts of money for streaming rights to shows. However, no one buys half a product. You don't go to a car dealership and buy just the left half of a car. Ditto for shows. A series will be more appealing—even if it's just a throw-in as part of a larger deal—if it's a full season. You can bet your butt that Minority Report will show up somewhere online when it's done. But Work It, which was canceled and disappeared after two episodes? NOWHERE TO BE FOUND! And trust me, I've looked far and wide. Networks may as well try to recoup some money from a failure, if it's possible. And let's say another outlet wants to save a show from cancellation (and also pay to have the first season in their library); that won't happen with a partial season. 


5. The Bench Is Shallow

TV used to be full of workhorses and almost every series ran standard 22-episode seasons, but shows these day are lazy. We're seeing more and more shows adopting 13-episode seasons to mimic the strategy of cable (Scream QueensAmerican CrimeWicked City, etc.) meaning there's more scheduling real estate to occupy. This puts a strain on shows picked up that don't get fall launches and are expected to take over in the midseason as other series finish up their runs. The networks need their Lucifers and their Heartbreakers to fill in the blanks, rather than as backup for shows that fail. We used to have a term for these shows: "mid-season replacement." There really isn't such a thing anymore, as midseason shows aren't replacing fall failures, they're depended on to take up a spot that would already be vacant due to shorter runs of new shows. And networks are ordering less new shows at Upfronts nowadays. In 2014, ABC announced 13 new series for the upcoming season. In 2015, it announced just 10. It's easier to quickly come up with a Boom or a 500 Questions—dumb reality shows that can go into production fast and cheaply—to fill holes. 


6. Networks Have Accepted the Grim Realities of Their Futures

Like a single man approaching his 40s and eating Hot Pockets for dinner for the third night in a row, sometimes it's easier for networks to accept that things are just how they are and it's pointless to try harder. This is the new paradigm, and networks understand they're dinosaurs and the chances of getting a huge hit that can float a network are slimmer and slimmer with each day that passes. Yeah, this is a pessimistic view of things, but it's also the truth. You can only throw so much shit at a wall to see if it sticks before you run out of shit and your arm gets tired. More important for networks right now is to try to devise alternate ways of competing with the expanding TV market rather than spending all the money it takes to find the next Empire

Why do you think networks aren't canceling shows as readily as before?

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Dec 01, 2015
I think its cool that this article have been sticky on front page with Wesley Snipes for awhile now, as it was good while it lasted. Its sad that the series is gone. :(
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Nov 28, 2015
You pretty much summed up all the reasons here, Tim. Your contributions are always a delight to read.
There may be another factor that may have triggered this "new" proceeding, though: foreign sales.
I'm from Germany, and I remember a day a few years ago, when one of the major German networks proudly announced their run of the second season of PUSHING DAISIES - whereas I just had read that the show had been canned. And I thought: that's funny - I wonder what German fans of the show think when they get all excited and hyped up... only to find out that the daisies really HAD been pushed.
(There were of course other shows that didn't even make a second season...)
I am not sure how the development in the past few years have influenced the networks' behaviour in regards to buying new programming, but here, the German networks sometimes seem to have learned from this and pushed their dubbing process and release rather close to the start date in the U.S. - so that they can also swim on the promotion wave of the original release.
Of course, an international buyed wouldn't be happy to acquire a new series and pay quite a lot of money for it - only to see it canceled after a few episodes. Which also effects additional media sales, like DVD (yes, they still exist! ;) ).
I guess what we encounter at the moment is a quite radical swift from classic network TV to internet based players - as their concept is more international. And they hold all the threads, organize their own dubbing (and therefore keep all the profit that is generated from their original programming). No wonder that the established "old" players try to catch up and build their own distribution and platforms...
Still, I'm rather grateful that this proceeding of the networks allows at least SOME stories to be told decently - instead of just chopping it to pieces and not giving a shirt. Even though with some shows, I would prefer a rather quick and silent death. ;)
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Nov 24, 2015
Don't cancel The Player. We love that show !!!
NBC ... listen up already.
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Nov 22, 2015
Show cancellations are the only reason I dont watch new TV shows anymore. I have moved on to to other entertainment avenues like YT and older shows that did complete.
Now, whenever we see a new show launched we all say this Ïts gonna get cancelled anyway so lets just wait and see before investing any time".

Trimmign shows might be better instead of droning long shows that do nothign but add side drama totally OT in order to occupy air time and move to a second season. Fact is most shows have only 79 minutes of actual content. Now you gotta fill in gaps with dialogues and characters that will be introduced and killed for no reason.

TV is sucking, few reboots might just make it, other than that TV is dead. Long live the TV
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Nov 16, 2015
I need Minority Report and The Player to get picked up. If hipsters or whoever aren't keen enough to pick up on good shows, then lets let REAL audiences have a go at it.
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Nov 14, 2015
Looking at Minority Report, a show that is about as bad as it could be considering the premise it build on ( or messed with ), I think Fox know it will be easy to sell because of the film connection, but only with a completee season.
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Nov 22, 2015
That's the thing. It won't be replaced with another sci-fi. Sci-fi on network TV is already scarce.

What's wrong with the show anyway? I hear a lot of "this show sucks" and nothing behind it.

As the show has gone on, background of Vega, Dash, and Arthur are getting fleshed out. An overall arc with Agatha is going on and she has a plan.
Even Will is getting fleshed.

Sci-fi on network TV is dead because no one has patience. That's why idiots in programming feel they have to air episodes out of order to grab impatient audiences.

I even wonder why a show like Blindspot is a hit yet The Player is getting axed. Sexy star?

Audiences are fickle, fickle OR the right folk don't have Nielsen boxes.
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Nov 22, 2015
Every show given the green light takes the place of another. Fox will want some percentage of sci-fi / thrillers, so if one goes there is without question space made for another.

Audiences being fickle is likely what got Minority Report the green light. The end of the film really didn't leave any obvious story, Yu have to assume it was the name that got network interest more than any super premise.

Loads has been said, just in this forum alone about why Minority Report is bad and failing.

The main issue is the characters. The following is my take on it. The main cop is not a believable cop of any great skill or standing, nor a particularly interesting person. The pre-cog has nothing but 'social issues' which come out in an almost light-hearted way. This makes little sense given the nature of his previous completely restricted life of a pre-cog.

The secondary issue was not particularly interesting or engaging cases of the week in the first few episodes. There is enough choice on TV and enough potential out there that this does not deserve a place on the schedule.

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Nov 22, 2015
Yeah that restricted life is translated in the show with how they act now. In a later episode, it even shows their release and what they had to go through (backstory).

Sci-fi doesn't get replaced with sci-fi that often if at all. There are clumps of seasons with none whatsoever on network TV. We consistently have to look to Canada and Syfy for that, where sci-fi buffs congregate. All the sci-fi there is not necessarily any better (especially considering HOW MUCH there is) but there's breathing room for shows to run before getting the axe.

12 Monkeys wouldn't have made it past 3 episodes.

On this very forum, Blindspot got crap reviews yet is a hit otherwise. I've heard folk on here say that the first 2 TWD episodes weren't good due to no "exposition of the characters" or some foolishness.

This is also why Netflix flourishes. It gets REAL data on who watches and not the sample size of Nielsen.
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Nov 16, 2015
I just finished Minority Report (up till now) and the show is great. Lots of mysteries and ways it can go from here.

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Nov 19, 2015
Glad you enjoyed it. For me the first 4 episodes were awful, even I had not imagined it possible to take a concept like that and do so badly with it.
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Nov 22, 2015
I just dunno what people want nowadays. Just like I thought too, the show got better and now it's about done.

Yay for sci-fi on network TV. We never knew ye.


To go all in on sci-fi, you have to buy into the world. This show has it. Then, it must do something different. This show does it.
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Nov 22, 2015
As a sci-fi fan myself, shows like Minority Report are exactly what I don't want. Sci-fi should never be an excuse for poorly written characters or stories. Even worse when they had a good premise to start with. The quicker this is gone and space for a new sci-fi show is made, the better
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Nov 13, 2015
All of these are interesting theories, but I think number 5 is the only one that really holds any weight. Too much of this seasons TV is weak, if they start cutting these shows, they have no replacements.

A network is not going to keep hemorrhaging money to "save face". Much better shows (that I'm sure cost less than some of the ones treading water right now ) were cancelled last season, and the season before. They're holding out judgement on these shows till a strategy can be created for next year.

I'm sure many of these shows will eventually be cancelled, but not until they can find replacements.
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Nov 12, 2015
This idea was covered a year ago by Tom Shaw and rejected most of this article's reasons:

http://www.tvgrimreaper.com/2015/11/08/a-brief-history-of-tv-failure/692/
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Nov 11, 2015
Good read. Pretty much on point.
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Nov 11, 2015
Great article, written by someone who knows enough to bolster insights with credibility.

Honestly, Tim, for a man of such clear knowledge and intelligence, I have no idea why you have such terrible taste in television shows ;)
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Nov 09, 2015
more shows should have the opportunity to end on their own terms if they want to. There are several cases where that would have been nice...
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Nov 09, 2015
All shows should be able to round out their season arcs. Especially now like you say there are streaming services out there which may pick them up or at least show them in their original format. There were so many shows that I felt were just getting into their groove n then boom gone. Either way I'm a massive fan of streaming sites as there are plenty of shows which I don't get to catch from the US or I just can't make sure I'm free to watch/record on a weekly basis. I know eventually it'll turn up somewhere lol. Prime example, Dexter, I started watching that show just after uni got into the second season but then couldn't keep up on a weekly basis. Now I'm just finishing season 4 n about to hit season 5 all in a few weeks. Ace innit I would never have gone out n bought the box set.
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Nov 07, 2015
Many good shows have been axed simply because they compete against other good shows. Those 'mediocre' shows which do not compete, often last longer, and sometimes, get better with time as they find their groove.

The fight for the perfect time-slot is becoming moot point. Any drama, serial, sitcom show will have a hard time against shows which deliver live content such as sports or competition(s). Very good shows have died for no good reason when all that is required is to just find a decent time slot where competition isn't so hot.

The advertising model for online streaming and ondemand shows can greatly help ensure the longevity of a new show, help it get its groove.

Not all stories and shows can be instant hit, but they can get more interesting and attract new viewers, who often will binge watch previous shows to catch up.

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Oct 30, 2015
There is only 1 reason
1. networks are trimming their shows because they suck and cannot complete with cable shows.
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Nov 11, 2015
Wow, you read like a Republican Presidential Debate.
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Oct 29, 2015
I remember when Numb3rs received its order cut from the 22 slated for the season to 16, and I've always felt that Numb3rs' final season felt rushed as a result of the order cut (The cut resulted from the series' ratings for the third episode, which featured several games of Russian roulette; the ratings rebounded immediately after that episode.) There were so many storylines that had been introduced in seasons five and six, yet they had to be quickly resolved so that the writers could create an episode that could and eventually did serve as the series finale. At the time of the announcement, the cast and crew likely was in the middle of producing episode 11 or 12. That gave everyone 4-5 episodes to wrap up the series in case of cancellation. That is not a lot of time to explore wedding plans, the effects of being the victim of a violent crime, responsibilities related to promotions, discover how one can contribute to the community, being a working senior, and just trying to find romance. Numb3rs was written in such a way that those topics, with the exception of wedding plans, needed at least two seasons to explore, not the one allotted to them.

In addition, a part of me has always wondered if politics played a role in Numb3rs' cancellation after its order cut. Keep in mind that all of this occurred about the time Charlie Sheen was arrested for attempting to murder his then-wife Brooke Mueller and right before his meltdown. The entire Charlie Sheen situation never sat right with me, and I've always wondered if CBS wanted to appease him instead of attempting to give Numb3rs another chance. Then again, there is a possibility of me being wrong about that.
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Oct 28, 2015
Firefly. Fox crapped all over it and then cancelled it, but, unfinished it still sold a zillion DVD's. Even today the exec's lament at how much better the post-cancellation revenue stream might have been if they just given it an ending...
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Nov 11, 2015
*hack, wheeze, sob* No, I ... I can't... I can't EVEN. It's too soon; the wounds are still fresh.

*stumbles off, humming "Hero of Canton" till the tears dry*
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Oct 28, 2015
I'm still not used to Tim writing insightful articles about industry insider stuff, guess I'll have to get on the trolley. At least Tim's sense of humor is still here.

Good article overall, but you left out #7 - the networks invest so much in these things, and are seeing such weaker returns on the majority of their so-called "successful" content, that it's now less a risk to just let the whole thing play out since there's still money to recoup. Writing off an entire series is expensive and wasteful when the product you replace it with costs the same and only makes 10% better ratings.
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Oct 28, 2015
The "good old days" actually had networks give a show a chance - even trying it on a different night to see if it works there. Didn't shows like Seinfeld get low ratings at first? Parent companies that own the networks also own cable stations and/or are partnered in some way with another company in that ownership. Take a look at Hulu for instance. These companies are basically shooting themselves in the foot by creating their own competition.

Points 1 thru 3 make little sense to me. The shows are not coming back, so what difference does it make to the network, the shows, and creators/producers if the series is immediately canceled or their deaths are dragged out? The only good thing is, maybe, getting to finish their stories in some satisfactory way.

Point 4 is not exactly working for shows like The Secret Circle or that NBC show, Camp (remember that?). What other series with completed seasons have yet to be on DVD or available for streaming?
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Nov 11, 2015
Shows have been moved around since forever. There was no "good old days" where networks were benevolent and did all they could to give new shows a chance: If they didn't think a show would make them money, it was dropped---fast, and with little warning or concern for the fans and crew.

The fact that you don't understand points 1-3 explains your confusion: Today, networks care about more than making money. Today, networks are trying to preserve talent---because it's become a seller's market, with so many cable and online options available to draw that talent away. Networks can't afford to kick another Joss Whedon or Noah Hawley to the curb on the basis of a few episodes of low ratings like they used to, because they have to worry about handing unrealized potential over to competitors that simply didn't exist a decade ago.
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Oct 28, 2015
Oh also forgot to mention that "smart" networks would pick up a whole season at a time like netflix does. Although "Fear The Walking Dead" started very slow it did pick up and I see good things for the already greenlit season 2.

The best show I've seen in awhile is on netflix called Sense8. Released all at once and was given massive freedom. Also contained stunning visuals.
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Nov 11, 2015
I read your first paragraph, and your mention of Netflix made me think of Sense8... and then you mention it specifically in the second. I agree, Sense8 is fantastic; I can't wait for the second season.

(Have you checked out Orphan Black? It's one of those shows I find fans of Sense8 tend to like, and vice versa.)
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Oct 28, 2015
I've said for years now who cares about regular network shows as they almost always disappoint or are canceled just as I get into them. To me only the premium channels allow the budget (better visuals/landscapes), give the freedom (sex or violence as they wish), and don't cancel shows fast. This is the case for shows like Homeland, Game of Thrones, Walking Dead and Spartacus(finished on its on terms)

2 new shows this year I have really found interesting and hope they keep are Limitless and Quantico. Very unique shows IMO. The other 2 shows I am really looking forward to next year are Chronicles of Shannara and The Coloney.

As for the article in my view more people are waiting to see if a show is cancelled before they jump on board and stream the show later in a few sittings.
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Oct 28, 2015
A little extension on point 4. Besides streaming, international sales of network shows. You can sell a season a episode or two not so much. (also wouldn't be surprised if they have to shoot a compleet season because they have already sold the show internationally.)
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Oct 28, 2015
I think I have made the above point somewhere before also the point that the network shows themselves are advertisement for said international and streaming sales.
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Oct 28, 2015
As a qualifier to #5, the bench is sometimes deliberately shallow. The CW has more shows than they know what to do with, but only 10 hours of primetime programming time on their network. They have to cut some shows off at 13 episodes so they can squeeze the next batch in, in January.
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Oct 28, 2015
This is a pretty good article. I agree with a lot of the stuff here.
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Oct 28, 2015
#2 and #4 are huge for me. Give closure to a show, even if it is trimmed/cancelled and it will have some value in the aftermarket.
I would use the analogy of a book rather than a car...a half written book has no value.
If there was a way back machine then I would bring closure to Terminator (Sarah Conners Chronicles), Space Above and Beyond, Dark Skies, etc. I might even spend money for that. I think the Networks are finally learning that series like 666 Park Ave that was trimmed AND yanked from the schedule but still managed to give closure.
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Oct 28, 2015
Well, it is a step forward which I didn't understand why they weren't doing this in the first place. Was it too logical? But now they need to renew more on the bubble shows for shortened seasons and see how their new pilots fare against them.
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Oct 28, 2015
Nice one, sir, and serious at that!
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Oct 28, 2015
More importantly....what does this mean to the way TV.com handles the Dead Pool contest? :-)
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Oct 28, 2015
Trump will fix these television woes.
#makeamericagreat
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Oct 28, 2015
Maybe he can make my socks stay up too...
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Oct 28, 2015
the solution to that is the only other sock option: get socks that look like they have been cutting off your circulation when you take them off.
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Oct 30, 2015
I was joking, Trump calls people losers all the time, I hate him.
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Oct 30, 2015
i know, that's why the 5yr old comeback.
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Oct 29, 2015
People who have bad socks are total losers.
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Oct 29, 2015
:( that's like all i got. meano.
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Oct 28, 2015
I love this ! The shorter season length 13 episode usually and if cancelled let it play out at least 10 episodes. thats great news
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Oct 28, 2015
i agree - as governments step in a regulate internet more and more we will see a massive shift to Netflix or people dumping the entire system and returning to free / the public library.

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Nov 11, 2015
(psst, the public library is a government institution)
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Nov 12, 2015
i know - i'll be reading books not using the internet - can easily revise books

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Oct 28, 2015
Great article, thanks.
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Oct 28, 2015
I only wish The Playboy Club, Lone Star and Lucky 7 all had the same treatment in their days. Those are the first recently cancelled I recall that I was sad seeing cancelled, if only they'd been trimmed!
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Oct 28, 2015
Oh ya, the Playboy Club was good. For me also Almost Human, Surviving Jack and Forever come to mind.Miss them.
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Oct 28, 2015
I really hope networks realize that people are staying away from them shows due to their routine of canceling shows unfinished. Why should we invest time in a new series when half of them are going to be cancelled after 5 episodes?

I will watch cable shows before anything on a network because they rarely cancel a show mid season. Sometimes it is better to wait and find out if it is going to last.

If enough people decide that it isn't worth watching new network shows then they won't get a read on the numbers they could really achieve. The only thing networks can do to change this trend is to start treating its viewers better and giving some closure even to shows that don't pan out.
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Nov 11, 2015
This is exactly right, and I have no doubt it's been discussed in those very terms around many a network's conference table---it likely deserves a spot on Tim's list.
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Oct 28, 2015
My thoughts exactly. Very well said
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Oct 28, 2015
Great points, great article!
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Oct 28, 2015
I think 4's a little off base. There are so many shows that are vying to be saved by cable/streaming but they're never shows that were cancelled after a few episodes.
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Oct 28, 2015
You can only throw so much shit at a wall to see if it sticks before you run out of shit and your arm gets tired.

I couldn't have said it better myself...
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Oct 28, 2015
You forgot 7. Because it screws up TV.com's Dead Pool. If the Dead Pool is suppose to be for actual cancellations, then reduced seasons don't count. It's when the official cancellation is announced that counts. And to get five shows could take until the spring.

I think not just streaming but DVD releases are having an effect. If a show airs only three or four episodes it's hard to get people to buy a DVD of it, but if it airs 10 episodes people might just buy it.

There's also the factor of viewer loyalty. If a network cancels shows quickly then viewers are more hesitant to invest in a new show. If they know the show will at least run a few months, they're more likely to check them out.

It also helps keep viewers watching the network. If a show is cancelled then viewers are going to go elsewhere to find something to watch. And if the show they switch to gets picked up then it's less likely viewers will check out new shows that replace the cancelled shows in that time slot.

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Oct 28, 2015
Echo Stelamon and TesserT: The Unusuals was great! In the current climate, its fate would probably be a little different. The 6 reasons pretty much say it all.
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Oct 28, 2015
These theories are pretty spot on and make sense. I dig it.
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Oct 28, 2015
I used to get invested pretty easily on network shows before early cancellation. Now, I'm only invested on cable shows - some of them whose premises I'm genuinely not that attracted to - because at least I know I'll get a satsfying development and/or closure.

Granted, Wayward Pines or The Whispers weren't necessarily ratings hits, but I coluld afford to be truly invested because I knew beforehand the story would end and I would get closure.
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Oct 28, 2015
That's what got me into Under the Dome, and we all know how that turned out.
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Oct 28, 2015
Yes, that is an example of a series that should have been an event rather than a stretched out series. I guess it is hard to walk away from ratings (at least the first season).
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Oct 28, 2015
Even then, it got closure. It didn't end abruptly before they could take Timmy out of the cave or another form of cliffhanger.
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Oct 28, 2015
I agree it didn't end abruptly, but still an unresolved ending IMO.
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Oct 28, 2015
Ooh, so of the 4 people who included these 4 "trimmed" shows in their dead pools, 3 chose a 5th show that has already gotten its full season order, and one is probably praying hope-against-hope that Crazy Ex-Girlfriend also gets its episodes "trimmed".
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Oct 28, 2015
'Crazy Ex-Girlfriend' is the best new comedy of the season. Rachel Bloom is this year's Gina Rodriguez for the CW. 'Glee' was never as entertaining as 'Crazy Ex-Girlfriend'. For a network comedy, especially an hour long comedy, to come out of the gate this polished and ready to go with a cast of mostly unknowns, except for maybe Pete Gardner, is quite extraordinary. The CW has two fun hour long comedies back to back with female leads. None of the big four can say that. Maybe I'm crazy too but I love the show. Great cast that becomes more endearing each week, fun musical numbers that you can't get out of your head, hilarious stories being written and executed by its wonderful lead, My early season candidates for best actress comedy are Rachel Bloom and Aya Cash, who has just been destroying it on 'You're the Worse' this entire season. Why isn't anyone watching this show? Everyone is always searching for originality and this is one of the most original comedies I've come across.

It really is too bad that the ratings for this gem are so miserable but hopefully word of mouth will start to get out. CW seems to keep good shows and not fall whim to ratings worries - see 'Jane the Virgin' and 'Reign' - and I hope they do the same here.
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Oct 28, 2015
Preach, sister/brother, preach! I'm fully on-board with this Crazy Ex-Girlfriend as well.

Unfortunately the TV-watching "adults 18-49" are largely soulless individuals who are reminded of their emptiness whenever they observe song and dance. :-) Or at least that's one theory that might account for this series' ratings being about half of Jane The Virgin's during its early first season. Sadly, even Jane's ratings this season are below even its lowest from last year, even though it's easily as good as its season one.

And, yeah, Aya has been really great this year, probably because the writing seems to have improved a lot. (It certainly has for Edgar (Desmin Borges). Yuck for his writing last year...)
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Nov 07, 2015
I love song and dance, but I was initially a bit turned off by the name, and then I watched the trailer and was even more turned off. Just. . . I figured that the name was kind of a joke and the girl wouldn't actually be tooo crazy, but in the trailer she really, really came off as a stalker, and very pathetic choosing some dude over her real life and career. As I say, I only saw the trailer, but when I hear "musical" I think "Yes!", but this made me think "ewww, no."
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Oct 28, 2015
There's still the possibility of many of the full season shows not getting a second season. It could take until Spring to determine the Dead Pool winners. Of course the fifth show cancelled may be something that doesn't air until the new year and wasn't on the list.


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Oct 28, 2015
True. Last year the ones "trimmed" didn't count as cancels, either. Still, it's sort of a "soft" victory, at least temporarily. Unfortunately some of the "mid-season replacements" could be real stinkers and get mercy-canceled before these "trimmed" ones get their last rites.
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Oct 28, 2015
good one
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Oct 28, 2015
The bench is so shallow, as is the first team in most cases.
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Oct 27, 2015
Still bummed that The Unusuals got canceled.
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Nov 07, 2015
I really liked it, too!
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Oct 28, 2015
I really enjoyed The Unusuals - so much I bought the DVD when it was released.
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Oct 27, 2015
It's a combination of #4 and #5. People are going to be more apt to want to stream a 10 episode show if it has some sort of a finite ending. But also, that golden age of television was really short. Don't get me wrong, there are great shows out there, but they're few and far between and those cheap to produce reality shows are like Steve Urkel. They're terrible and annoying, anyone in the industry knows it, but easy to embrace into your family if you need to.

Personally, I would love to see US television shows only ever get 10-13 episodes each season. It would get rid of all those filler episodes that exist solely because they have to kill time between turning point episodes. Get in, get out, leave them wanting more. PT Barnum was 100% right
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Oct 27, 2015
I get it. A failed series can be marked as a limited series if it has a finale instead of a permanently unresolved cliffhanger. With Netflux and Amazon Prime the networks can at least get some of their money back by streaming the limited show instead of trashing it completely.
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Oct 27, 2015
The biggest reason is #4. I have no doubt that a Space Above & Beyond, John Doe, Firefly, or Daybreak would have been picked up by Amazon or NF.
I still don't get why Amazon didn't pick up Hannibal (that show was art) but Longmire did get picked up (up in the air for another renewal tho').

Another reason not mentioned tho'....what would the replacement be on network TV?


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Nov 12, 2015
I just caught up with all of Minority Report and, yes, it has to be that audience just can't follow sci-fi.

I have heard the show is some of run-of-mill police procedural set in the future and it's anything but that.

The show has a nice budget behind it, has a TON of ways it can go with the precogs, and has a pretty good universe.

People just aren't that smart to stay with the show, it seems. I just hate that the effort is going to waste.

Pleassssse Netflix pick this up....



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Oct 28, 2015
Hmmmmm of those show choices I'd save the first 2. And I'm kinda feeling more 1 over 2. I'm sick of everyone comparing everything to FIrefly when there is a space ship involved- ragtag space crews have existed since the concept of a space ship came about, and before that they were just posses that walked or rode horses. And I miss the nipplenecks.

Now i haven't seen Hannibal yet, but it has come recommended to me from trusted sources. But Longmire and The KIlling are both slowpaced shows so maybe its that? Plus, there isn't much western shows like Longmire about there is cops and serial killers. Hmmmm Longmire is technically a cop show but they got cowboy hats and Indians. Hmmmmm you know, both The KIlling and Longmire have a strong Native American presence; maybe it's that? Plus I'd think its much cheaper.
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Nov 11, 2015
I'm sorry: Did you just rip on Firefly as if it were some tired, generic throwback to Star Trek and Westerns? Because we are going to have to throw down.
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Nov 01, 2015
The Killing sucked mainly due to it's incessant red herrings in seasons 1 and 2. 2 seasons for 1 murder? Weak. The following seasons were better.
The atmosphere was great, however. The shows first seasons were just....unsatisfying.

I like Longmire's different setting similar to why I liked Justified. Everything is always set in a big city so it was refreshing to see these shows set what, Iowa and Kentucky?
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Nov 02, 2015
Yes to the Killing atmosphere. That's what made the show awesome.
Yes, the attraction to Longmire is not being located in the usual places.
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Nov 03, 2015
i'm one of those viewers who like the long journey. so i like the two season mystery: killing is good, twin peakis is good, veronica mars is good..
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Nov 03, 2015
Yeah but 2 seasons for 1 murder and 15 red herrings? Bleh.

I had my wife start The Killing but warned her that the first 2 seasons are slogs.
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Oct 27, 2015
So glad I'm not the only who laments the cancellation of Space: Above & Beyond!
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Oct 27, 2015
Yup, that came on after Earth 2 and set up a great universe....all to be crushed with a cancellation.

I remember that was paired with Earth 2 and later John Doe was paired with Firefly. Sci-fi doesn't work for the network TV masses in America. It's not straightforward enough.


Space AAB had interesting factions that you don't see in sci-fi often.

Nipplenecks were basically oppressed people that had their civil rights violated.

Chigs were the evil enemy.


Humans were the good people with a bit of racism toward nipplenecks.


AIs were the wildcard. "Take a chance."
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Oct 28, 2015
HMmmmmm I'd say the Nipplenecks were waaaaay more than that. It was about the morality of using genetically engineered people and using them as chattel. So that's classic sci-fi ethics.
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Nov 01, 2015
Well, it was in a nutshell. In the show, it ended up being a human rights thing.
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Oct 28, 2015
I remember reading that it was cut due to the budget. It cost around 1 mil per episode back then.
Totally agree with you, I think it was too forward for its time. Maybe 5 years later, it would have had a better chance.
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Nov 01, 2015
NO reason that this show can't be actually continued or remade. With today's tech, it would be easy.

There's a ready made universe right there.

I remember that ass that played in the Green Mile (gotta dead man walkin' here) was an AI.
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Oct 27, 2015
Earth 2 was NBC in 1994, and S:AAB was Fox in 1995. At least in the U.S.
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Nov 01, 2015
Weird, I remember watching them back to back. Obviously, I'm wrong then.
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Oct 27, 2015
umm but trimming IS cancelling is it not? so you men to tell me the shows that got cut from 13 to 10 or 9 will be coming back next season? Last i checked thats not how it worked.. i already deleted Extant s02 and now every episode of the player (which i never started watching) from my DVR since theyve been cancelled... no point n getting invested in a show i wont get to see a proper end for.
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Oct 28, 2015
Just because the series is limited doesn't mean it doesn't have a proper ending. Crossbones (which was suppose to be a mid-season show but was pushed back to summer) ran only 9 episodes but had a fairly conclusive season finale (while still leaving some room should the series get picked up elsewhere). And even if a show is picked up there's no guarantee that it will have a conclusive ending. (Such as Under the Dome.)
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Oct 28, 2015
Well i havent finished under the dome yet, but that show is about ppl being trapped under a dome, they wanna know what it is, why its there and to get out, if the final season answers those questions (which I hear it does) them Im satisfied with that ending even if we dont get the Barbie and Julie marriage we know they show would have eventually led to if it lasted longer or Big Jim doesnt get the the bullet in his head that he deserves, Im ok with that side stuff as long as the MAIN part (the dome) is dealt with.

Also a limited series isnt the same as a series who gets its episodes count cut. I limited series is designed to be "however many episodes" finished for its initial run, so if it was 12 episodes that 12 episode already has a definitive ending planned, so even if it doesnt get another season its ok, 13 episodes season shows that had their episodes cut from 13 to 9 werent designed to have ended at episode 13, so episode 9 DEFINITELY isnt gonna offer closure, if it did then what were those other 4 episodes for?
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Oct 27, 2015
No it means the show can be refastened as a "limited series" and rented cheap Netflix or Amazon.
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Oct 27, 2015
but no real ending/obviously rushed ending and no additional seasons still = cancellation, whatever goal that series stet upon in episode 1, if it didnt get accomplished by episode 9 with all questions answered and no loose ends then even if it didnt end in a cliffhanger its still not a proper ending thus cancellation to me.

Just like the messengers even though that show got cancelled, there goal from the begining was to stop the apocalypse and that one girl was looking o find her son.... i havent finished watching it yet but if the show ends with those two things happening then Id consider that an ending.. even though i COULD have went further with a second season (like this time trying to destroy the horsemen and or satan etc etc but that was never the goal on day one)
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Oct 28, 2015
but no real ending/obviously rushed ending and no additional seasons still = cancellation, whatever goal that series stet upon in episode 1, if it didnt get accomplished by episode 9 with all questions answered and no loose ends then even if it didnt end in a cliffhanger its still not a proper ending thus cancellation to me.

True but it's good for the viewers who are already invested in the show and want to see what happens rather than just having it yanked unceremoniously from the airwaves.
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Oct 27, 2015
I like this new policy. It's like enjoying a miniseries.
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Oct 27, 2015
They may as well cancel them, cutting the episode order just makes me feel like they don't want to 'burn bridges' as was mentioned but they also have no faith in the show. the sooner it's cancelled the sooner another network or company could pick it up because now when they're cut, I usually stop watching just like if it had been cancelled
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Oct 28, 2015
If a show gets cancelled in it's first season because of poor ratings, no other network wants the show. Shows that get picked up are usually shows that have a decent audience to begin with.
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Oct 29, 2015
From my personal experience as a TV viewer, other factors play a role in the series getting picked up, regardless of what season the show is in. Several series on CBS (Without a Trace, Cold Case, CSI) have been cancelled because their ratings dropped as a result of the football game lasting 4 hours instead of 3 like the network scheduled. Forever was produced by WB and not ABC Studios, which led to its cancellation. (I can give you at least 7 articles that state that it was a part of ABC's decision to try to compete with Netflix, Hulu, and Amazon.) Longmire attracted the 25-49 age range of the 18-49 age group. And, see my above comment about Numb3rs' cancellation. In those cases, the audience size does not matter.
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Oct 30, 2015
The shows usually get cancelled because of poor ratings, but they're picked up because there's enough audience to make it worthwhile. There are a few shows that have been cancelled and picked up after one full season, but I can't think of a single case where a show was cancelled with less than 13 episodes and was picked up by someone else. And even in the case of those that are picked up, ratings isn't always a factor in their cancellations.
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