Supernatural "Freaks and Geeks" Review: Creepy Victor's School for Gifted Youngsters

Supernatural S08E18: "Freaks and Geeks"

The last time we saw teen hunter Krissy Chambers, her dad had just promised to leave the hunting life and raise her like a normal kid. It was Season 7's "Adventures in Babysitting" and Sam wound up tied to a chair, but that's kind of Sam's shtick when he's put in the damsel spot, so, you know, it happens. And since this is Supernatural, where the writers laugh in the face of happy endings for, well, everyone, it was only a matter of time until something evil ate Krissy's dad. 

While "Freaks and Geeks" was ultimately the kind of not-really-essential-to-the-story filler I specifically said I didn't want in the wake of last week's awesome chapter, it at least had two things going for it: 

1. It didn't suck. 

2. It DID fit in with all the gates of Hell stuff, just in a really roundabout way. Kind of.  

Dean was horrified to learn that Krissy had taken up hunting again. I didn't matter that this time, she was backed by a team of fellow vampire-ganking teens and a seasoned mentor in Victor, she was still back in the life. Dean Winchester is a textbook example of a "Do as I say, not as I do" kind of guy, and nowhere is that more obvious than in his stance on young wannabe hunters. He grew up hunting and he can barely, if at all, imagine himself doing anything else, but he will time and again try to talk revenge-driven kids out of it in an attempt to both save their lives and encourage them to choose an existence that isn't absolutely miserable. 

While Sam didn't exactly argue in favor of Victor's machete-wielding patchwork family, he was a little more accepting of the situation. Krissy's experience mirrors his own. They both escaped. They both got dragged back in. Sam has finally reached the point of accepting the inevitability of his hunter role—if not for himself, then for the sake of the innocent people he puts in danger every time he tries to go legit. If the monsters won't leave you alone, you should at least be prepared for them. 

But both Sam and Dean landed on the one endgame that would guarantee a win for everybody, including the kids that Dean, in the end, reluctantly left to their hunting endeavors: Finish the trials, close the gates. Locking down the demon population down would go a long way toward cutting down the demand for experienced hunters.

It's interesting, though, that the real villain of "Freaks and Geeks" was actually a human. Victor was an old acquaintance of the Winchesters and while we're on that topic, let's just take a moment to pause on how ridiculous the parade of old hunting buddies is getting, shall we? It's like the inversion of the issues that plagued the early seasons of the show, where every other hunter the Winchesters encountered was like some rare creature, and apparently there was this whole subculture thriving (as much as hunters can thrive, anyway) with its own hangouts and culture. But at least the endless surprise every time they ran into another hunter could be explained by the fact that the Winchesters were isolated when they were growing up. John didn't care to associate with the rest of the hunting community and, so he kept his children away from outsiders as well. 

Given Sam and Dean's near-decade of working without their father's influence, it makes sense that they'd have contacts and acquaintances of their own, especially considering that, for as anti-social as they can be at times, they aren't exactly at John Winchester levels of self-imposed exile. They certainly have a reputation and their role in the apocalypse put them on a lot of hunter radars, but seriously, is this some kind of overreaction to the realization that at the end of Season 7, the Winchesters literally had zero living allies that we knew of? Is that what this is? This is a cry for help, isn't it?

We get it. The Winchesters know people. But writers, darlings, you've done a fine job of rebuilding the ranks with super cool side characters after the bloodbath of the past several seasons. When you want the Winchesters to show off their ability to socialize properly, pull one of them out. Aaron Bass is cool. His gollum is cool. Mrs. Tran is cool. Garth is a love-him-or-hate-him type, but I personally think DJ Qualls is hilarious. We haven't seen Sheriff Jody lately, let's give Kim Rhodes a call. BUT DON'T KILL THEM. That's what got you into this mess to begin with.

It just wasn't essential for Sam and Dean to have known Victor, even if it was only from that unseen job in Spokane. It had no bearing on the story. The dude blew his brains out in the end, but show didn't even give a nod to the fact that "Hey, it was really tragic that he was so paranoid about the future of the hunter community that he resorted to such drastic methods of recruitment," or "Wow, he seemed so level-headed when we worked with him in Washington,"  or even some passing comment about it always ending "bloody or sad." Nada. No one cared. 

So instead of being the benevolent father figure who stepped in at a rough time in these kids' lives to provide the understanding and guidance that they would only find in a fellow victim of supernatural slaughter, Victor instead orchestrated it all with the help of a hoodie-wearing vampire who murdered Krissy's father and the families of two of her friends in order to breed the new class of hunter—a perfect blend of brains and brawn (dude was dangerously close to quoting that Kanye song there).

I'm still not entirely sure what the vampire had to gain from all of this. Even if Victor gave him free reign over the town in return for his assistance, he was still contributing to the training of a trio of super-hunters who could easily set their sights on him someday, and in the meantime, will totally gank any and every other vampire they come across. I could understand it if the vamp, like Victor, was spurred into action by the reign of the Leviathan, since they were just as much a threat to monsterkind as they were to mankind, but I don't think "Freaks and Geeks" did a great job of explaining it. 


Still, those complaints aside, "Freaks and Geeks" was a solid case-of-the-week episode. The case was interesting. The kids weren't annoying. Peripherally, the debate over whether or not raising children as hunters is okay and the question of what a hunting life ultimately means tied into the Winchesters' motivations for closing the gates of Hell just enough that I didn't feel like we completely slammed the brakes on the bigger story at hand. 


What did you think of "Freaks and Geeks"?


CASE NOTES

– Smart Winchester sighting: They didn't get outsmarted by teenagers, so that's a plus. They remembered that they have a vampire cure. Dean disarmed Aiden like a BAMF.

– Dumb meddling kids sighting: So I guess we're just going to behead this dude and take the time to neatly wrap up his severed head and torso and fumble it into the trunk of a car right there on a city street, across from a hotel and probably apartments where anyone could look out a window at any time. Maybe they were counting on the Kitty Genovese effect? 

– I like how Dean and Sam tried (kind of) to communicate the stuff they usually keep from one another and were totally grossed out by it. "Good talk!"

– I think Victor was creepier as a doting daddy figure than as a manipulative wannabe mentor. 

– Look, I like the scruff, but I feel like FBI agents in real life would be more impeccably groomed. Yeah, we've been overlooking Sam's non-regulation hair for years. But still. 

– Jared Padalecki's nose was really red and it was really distracting. You know, for those of us who spend half the episode leering at Jared Padalecki. 

– Where do you think Cas is holed up?

– Don't you think Sam should be a pro at untying himself from chairs by now?

Comments (82)
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yeah, i found it quite irritating how few squabbles i had with this episode. one of them surely being that it didn't help much in the 'tie up some of the many storyline strings'-department (as the end of the season draws nigh and i just have no clue how they're gonna do that without some of the resolutions being incredibly lame); i didn't even hate the 'kids' (tho the dude came somewhat close). as far as the castiel roadtrip goes, i s'ppose he's just going someplace that hasn't extradition treaties with either heaven or hell. like canada. or liechtenstein, which is, well ...you know... kinda hard to get to by bus.
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I mourn for the Sam Hair (yes it gets a capitalisation) of the first three seasons. Those were the good (hair) days.
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Sam, please visit a hair salon soon.
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What drove me nuts is that as soon as Victor appeared I was certain we had seen him before. It nagged me more when the Winchesters referenced seeing him previously. Than on Friday S01E18 aired on TNT. Lo and behold this actor was the doctor who was draining the life essence of the kids. Aha!
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I was just reading through the review and scrolled past the picture and thought, hey isn't that the Striga?
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I guess when you have been hunting as long as they have, it all starts to blend together.
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did anyone else find that the interior of the house reminded them of another certain vampire slayer's house or was it just me? lol
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omg as soon as they walked into the house I thought it looked familiar.
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I also really hope this is not setting up some kind of spin off.
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Here's the giant flaw in Dean's closing the gates of hell will make everything better logic. Most of the things they hunt aren't demons. I mean the entire first season was pretty much about NOT demons. In fact it was a big deal when they first met one (phantom traveler) and it was all OMG it's a actual demon we never see these things. But back to the point. Even if they close the gates of hell what about all the vampires, werewolves, even ghosts...
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I was wondering about that too! I don't see how shutting demons up will make their lives normal. There's monsters everywhere!
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I was bored with this episode. Don't like Chrissy. This to me, was one of the worst episodes I have ever seen of Supernatural. The one with that crazy girl (Becky?) was the worst haha.
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Cas is stil riding the bus. If he were trying to get somewhere he would just show up there. If he ever stops moving he will be found eventually. So he rides. And he rides. And he rides.
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Possible. Or perhaps he can only be found if he uses any Angel powers (like teleporting and such). OR perhaps Chuck (or the tablet) are giving him SOME stealth powers so long as he doesn't use too much Angel power.
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Totally agree to your last and fourth to last points.
Cas is probs somewhere with the native peoples up there in Canada which is what I would do since, you know, the border of the US of A seems to be absolute to everything Supernatural. No way anyone would find him there, it's way easier to return from Hell, Heaven, Purgatory than to cross the border to the Big White North!
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Another episode this season that feels like a backdoor pilot IMO
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From the moment I saw the preview I knew this was one episode I wouldn't like. I HATED "Adventures in Babysitting," I thought the Krissy character was pretty much a Scrappy or Cousin Oliver replacement for the dearly departed Jo. And the writers brought her back with a Batman origin story now. I'm not a big fan of the past 3 seasons killing off recurring characters (Rufus in season 6, Bobby in season 7, ect.) but honestly I woudn't mind if the Vamp of the Week ate her and the other bratty kids at the end. I had said Season 8 has been getting to be more and more like Power Rangers, first with the Winchesters getting a Batcave and now with the creation of three "teenagers with attitude." All we need is the spandex and giant robot and BOOM, we've got ourselves an angst-ridden team of superheroes.
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Am I the only one who had to Google Kitty Genovese to get the reference.....God I'm uninformed.
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I just googled it from your comment. I will have forgotten it entirely by the next time I wake up. Sounds like life in the city. If you are in a big city, some of the people within a one mile radius of you are having violence done to them right now. What, are we all supposed to turn into Batman? Society would cease to function if we all stopped filling our roles every time we became aware of something bad happening.
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You and me both!
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true--> "I think Victor was creepier as a doting daddy figure than as a manipulative wannabe mentor."

ok filler now let's get back to the main arc
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I'm probably the only who thinks this way, but it is what it is - this episode sucked. Krissy Chambers is annoying at best, uncomfortable with her ....over familiarity with men so much older than her at worst. I hated the "we have history" comment - EEEEWWW! I thought the same thing last season, and I don't really wish to see her again. Charlie is a great example of an amazing female character - Krissy is a spoiled brat. As an episode as a whole it was predictable - As soon as I saw the vampire in the van, I knew he was working with Victor. And is it me, or have we had quite a few eps this season written around the guest actors? And seriously, we get it - Sam wants a normal life. How many times do they have to remind us of this? I also feel that, for two guys that completely slash any demon without a thought to the innocent people being possessed without trying to exorcise them, Dean's whole "we don't just kill people" speech was unconvincing at best, hypocritical at worst. I was also irked that Dean was ready to drop Krissy off at her Aunt's but didn't think of the OTHER MINORS in the room - he's not concerned about finding living relatives for them??
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Anyone noticed that when Dean reached the cabin it was raining , and in the next scene with Victor and Sam hunting the vamp it was sunny ?
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Yeah, that happens. Because they were close to each other. And you have heard of isolated showers right...
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Now that they have access to "the batcave", why not try to restart the Men of Letters organization? The next generation of hunters could be Men of Letters (and women of letters of course).

I still want to find out in what way the Men of Letters are superior to hunters. Is it just that they have access to better information? Did they have a better plan to rid the world of monsters?
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The first thing I have to say is that I pray for Kitty Genovese's immortal soul every time I come across her name, which I never take in vain. While all horrible events people can happen to them are equal in their depravity in my eyes, this tops them all.
Now that this off my chest, I want to say that this episode exemplifies vocation. We live in a world mostly of professional orientation; having a job, not necessarily something we like doing with our time, just to survive and if lucky, to live by.Vocations, unless, you are the one winner of America Got Talent, or are incredibly favored, are rare to come by. Here we see a group of children, barely youth, coming to grips with their vocation. This one in particular leads the way to a terrible life of incredible danger, terrifying encounters, and ultimately filled with the loss of many friends.
The point that Dean does not identify this kind of life with vocation, Sam actually in an intuitive way recognizes this fact. That's where I going with all this: this is why he is the one "chosen" to fulfill the Tablet of Demons' trials.
Vocation could not give a damn about danger,loss, or any terrible events that might come as obstacles to it- it just feels right. Ultimately, even if the children will keep their promise to remain out of the life, their vocation is to be Hunters. So, as much as we can dislike Victor, he was right in the end.
Maybe you should think yourself about your own vocation, if you still can.
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Many comments say Victor was dissing other hunters. While I didn't like Victor the moment he stepped on the screen, I don't think he dissed any of them. He was saying that nobody from their generation of Hunters was well put together. Bobby WAS an alcoholic. Bobby was often times barely holding it together. He would focus more on hunting and completely ignore anything else. He wasn't balancing hunting and living. Victor simply stated this. If he was trying to insult him he would have said something like, "Bobby was a shitty hunter." That's an insult, but he never said it. Pointing out what was already known, even if you don't want to hear it, doesn't make it an insult. I'm not trying to stick up for the guy, but I also don't think anybody should misinterpret somebody's words.
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Yeeeeah, I personally wasn't that bothered by it. He was being harsh, but he wasn't WRONG. Like you said, Bobby WAS an alcoholic. Great hunter. But a total drunk. Martin WAS crazy. Garth IS...well...Garth. While our current generation of hunters get by okay enough, I can see where Victor was alarmed and concerned about the future. Granted he went about the way waaaay wrong way of trying to do something about it...but I got where he was coming from too.
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I thought correct argument, wrong implementation to correct said argument. And the hunters' crappy life has been stated over and over throughout the series.
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I thought it was a better filler than the witch/familiar episode and the Felicia Day episode. As much as I like this idea of new gen hunters, I hope they never turn it into a spin-off.

The thing about Sam and Dean, they are not FBI agents, that is why they don't look like FBI agents. Sure they can try and make an effort, but they already have an episode about them being fake FBI agents. I for one just let it be.
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I did notice the stubble this ep. More so than usual. Maybe just more close up on their faces than usual...and I've just gotten used to the Jared Hair (tm)
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I sort of enjoyed this one, yes it was a filler...although it was done in a poetic way. The notion of normalcy was carefully placed and well executed. Both of the brothers have struggled with the same question: Can we have a normal life? Both, trying and coming up to the same conclusion - no. So it was of no surprise to me that the kid hunters were much like the Winchesters in their way of thinking. Only to end up dissapointed in the end and find out the one person they trusted is responsible for their family's deaths.

Very few complaints: - I don't like the actress that played Krissy nor did I like the character of Krissy before and/or now. Hopefully we won't see her again. < :)

- Dean was surprisingly unlikeable for me in this one. He was too self-righteous, and a hypocrite. Saying the girl vamp was "innocent" because she didn't kill no one. Oh please! We all remember how he killed that girl/lady monster sort-of-friend of Sam because she killed someone to save her son's life. She wasn't exactly innocent, and yes she couldn't become a human again but that didn't justify his actions. She did it to save her son's life and not for kicks.And him preaching to do the right thing to Krissy was hypocritical knowing he didn't do the right thing- HE SHOULD HAVE LET HER LIVE. But he killed her. His lame excuse: "She was a monster" < sighhhhh....

- Lack of comedy, Cass made this a sad day for me. :(
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Dean's view on monsters changed while he was in Purgatory. Specifically vampires, since he's gone out of his way to protect Benny or justify Benny's actions. Also, don't forget that Dean was EXACTLY in Sam's shoes as to "we gotta kill the monster because it's a monster" last season when Dean's Amazon daughter came to kill him. Unlike Amy, the Amazon daughter WAS evil, but Dean tried EVERYTHING to get her to just walk away... until Sam shot her, and then called Dean out as a hypocrite for killing Amy for just being a monster, and sparing Amazon daughter despite being an EVIL monster.
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That's right! Her name was Amy! Thank you. XD

Not sure what Sam has to do with Dean being a hypocrite. And it's really not the same thing. Dean's amazon kid was going to KILL Dean, Sam did it to save his life. Dean killed Amy simply because "she was a monster". That's really not an excuse, and I'll never forgive him for doing it and also for letting Benny live.
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Not gonna lie, I was nodding enthusiastically when Victor referred to Dean as Sam's "Self righteous ass of a brother." Love the guy, but that's a fairly accurate assessment. :/
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Hush your mouth! haha :)
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The story was obvious from a few minutes in, so then it was just watching to see how it would play out, and some of the scenes were so much sloppy writing, as you said, kids wrapping up body instead of just tossing it in a trunk and hauling ass - particularly because someone HAD called 911 for the vic. Also, Victor and Sam 'sneaking up' on hoodie vamp in broad daylight. The kids were not obnoxious, but I have no desire to see them again, and most of the secondary guests this year - (barring as you said, Benny, Aaron, Garth, Jodi, Kevin and Linda) I would much rather see some regular people saved by the boys if they are going to do a MOW. And some real cool creepy monsters, such as the Djinn in past eps.
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I liked this episode a lot more than your usual Supernatural filler episode. It reminded me a lot of the first season's "The Benders," where (SPOILERS) it turned out that the bad guys were actually just humans, and not supernatural at all. There was a similar moment in this episode, when everyone realized that Victor was actually behind everything, and Krissy said that Victor was himself a monster. In the past, we've had a lot of humans side with monsters, betray Sam and Dean, or just go crazy and do terrible things. But this is the first time, since I believe that episode I mentioned, where every thing about a case-of-the-week has been planned and orchestrated by a human. It wasn't like that vampire had come to Victor with this idea, and as a result they joined in a partnership, instead it was quite the opposite. Because while we don't know much about that vampire, or his relationship with Victor, it's clear that Victor came to him, and not the other way around.

Over the years, Sam and Dean have done a lot of soul searching as to what it is they do, and why they do it. In this episode, Dean said many times that hunting wasn't only about revenge, even though in early seasons that's what hunting was for him, a lot of the time anyway. Back then, they were searching for their Dad, hunting the thing that killed their mom (remember the first episode in which we met a demon? That was fun. Why don't they ever just say "Christo" in order to quickly identify demons, instead of pulling out the holy water and doing the whole routine?), and killing as many monsters that they could in between. But over time, things have changed very significantly for the two brothers. After they met a group of vampires who don't feed on human blood, it made them realize that not all "monsters" do bad things, which led them to wonder how many creatures they had killed didn't actually deserve to die. This episode gave them a similar lesson, or a least a reminder, that some humans can be just as bad as monsters, to the extent that they are basically monsters themselves. And it was nice to see that Krissy, even though she had just had her entire world turned upside down, was able to see that.

What I liked most about this episode, though, is the fact that it built up something interesting (Victor's happy hunter family), without fully destroying it at the end. Usually in filler episodes, we'll be introduced to about five or six characters, most of them will die by the end of the season, and the ones that are still alive at the end are grateful to the Winchesters, but would rather forget everything that had just happened. This time though, all of the important characters except the villains survived, and in many ways they became stronger for it. And while Krissy said that they wouldn't be seeking out any monsters themselves, I wouldn't be surprised if they end up hunting as a team at some point, and we see them again at some time down the road. This follows a trend that we've been seeing toward the later part of this season, where we've been meeting members of the new generation of hunters/supernatural beings who do good instead of bad. And Krissy and her family represent a whole new line of hunters: a tight-knit family unit that could maintain a stable base of operations while hunting, and simultaneously live somewhat of a normal life. After all the death, all the destruction that this show has undergone, it's nice that we're continuing to get this fulfilling sense of rebirth.

I'm not saying that the show has never introduced characters in filler episodes that eventually return and assist the brothers in some way, far from it. Krissy herself is an example of someone who survives a case, isn't seen for a while, and then pops back up. But ever since Season 2, the show has tended to have a number of recurring characters that somehow have a large part to play in the major arc of the season. Most of the time, these are hunters like Jo who assist the brothers from time to time, or shady characters like Bela or Ruby who walk the line of being enemies/allies until they finally reveal their true colors. But in Season 2, (SPOILERS) we were introduced to all the demon-blood children that the brothers met during various cases of theirs, who all ended up being pitted together to see who was the best of the best. These children were all a part of something greater than themselves, and all were an essential part of the major arc, as opposed to other recurring characters on this show, who often are along for the ride. Also, in Season 6 Grampa Campbell (SPOILERS) came back to life and brought together the Campbell family of hunters. And while all of these people (SPOILERS) eventually died by the end of the season, they were very important for half of it.

We're getting a similar thing with the rather unexpected Renaissance in the second half of this season. This is the fourth time that we have met some new cool character, who represents the new age of whatever they are. In the case of Krissy and her adopted siblings, they are the new and improved future hunters, provided they end up living that long. And if previous seasons are anything to go by, this might be similar to Season 2, where the people that we've met recently will all come back together in the finale. And while that would be awesome, and I really do hope that it ends up happening, it would be nice if this time they don't all die. Seriously Supernatural, please don't kill all of these people. Maybe one or two would be alright, just to keep things real, but please don't leave us with a clean slate at the end. I really do hope that this general theme of creation and rebirth runs through to the end of this season, and who knows, even further out until the end of the show. Because this show is so much better when some aspects of this world survive and are able to flourish, as opposed to everyone and everything crumbling to dust and destruction at some point, with whimpers, sobs, and hearts being torn out.

Overall, there were only two things that I didn't like about episode. The first was the acting of the guy who played Victor. It was like someone didn't tell him that he was on television, and not performing in some Shakespearean or otherwise dramatic play. Some of the times, when he was crying or yelling at people, I really couldn't take him seriously. It was pretty bad. But he's dead now, so that's just fine. Also, I didn't like the part where Dean said they needed to close the Gates of Hell as soon as possible, in order to make the world a safer place for these children, so that they could live a normal life, and Sam mused wistfully to himself that the same could happen to them. While I find this to be an admirable goal for closing the Gates of Hell, the idea that doing so will take away the need for hunters, and especially Sam and Dean, is ludicrous. Frankly, these two should know better. Over almost eight years, Sam and Dean have discovered more and more about just how many non-human beings there are out there, as well as just how many "there"s there are.

Sure, closing off Hell, and stopping the hordes of demons that meander over to our world to inflict pain and misery, will make everything a whole lot safer. But this does nothing to stop the hordes of ghosts, ghouls, vampires, changelings, werewolves, djinn, and other such monsters there are out there. Not to mention all the extremely powerful gods and demigods who will fight for dominance when such a huge power vacuum has been created. I mean, we learned in Season 6 that there is a whole other dimension of fairies out there, who periodically travel over to our world to abduct people and make clocks in exchange for milk and nefarious bargains. No, Sam especially should stop kidding himself. There will always be monsters to kill, ghosts to kill again, bones to be salted and burned, and nefarious evil global plans to put an end to. And for various reasons, the Winchester brothers are the best ones for the job. After all, they've literally saved the human race/world from utter annihilation...twice.
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This was well kind of dumb. I think it is a good idea. I mean at some point they are all going to have to replenish the hunter ranks with new and improved hunters. That is just pragmatic, and also makes me wonder why Angels never had the idea of making Sam and Dean have kids so that the Winchester line can be furthered and you know since these ones are difficult, maybe raise them to not be difficult. But that I am sure is another show and that show is a sitcom.

But the thing that didn't do it for me was Krissy. Krissy we have seen her before. Krissy is intelligent. I have a hard time believing that she could have been snowed by Victor in the manner she was. She had been hunting for a while, she should have been able to spot a rookie vamp no problem. So that kind of turned me off of the episode.

Also, dumb Winchester alert, Sam's look at the kids when they were going to stabilize the girl for the Paramedics. I mean it is no bottle of whiskey and some stitches. It is something that should have been thought up long ago.

Hunter academy is a good idea and at some point it is going to happen. This just seemed weird.
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I've always wanted a Hunter Academy idea to manifest in an SPN ep. But this wasn't what I expected. I thought that there'd be this big college-type building where hundreds of teen hunters living in it where they go to classes which teaches them everything required to be a good hunter with the teachers as semi-hunters. You know, Vampire Academy style...
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You know, I think the CW would buy that.
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Also, it looked like Cas was headed to Calgary, so my guess is there.
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Calgary-Alberta-Canada- he's going to get help from Bret "The Hitman" Hart.
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Yeah, I totally didn't get that vampire's motivations, it just felt lazy. Also, it was pretty obvious Victor was guilty the second he showed up on screen. And finally, like Neve Campbell's lil bro in the witch episode, stop making me try to remember characters that never existed SPN! Shit...
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"Also, it was pretty obvious Victor was guilty the second he showed up on screen."

Well, he is a Strega ... (or was one back in season one).
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I'm hoping that he reason we keep being introduced to new non-helpless characters is that they'll all help the Winchesters out with this seasons big end game. Hopefully without all of them being killed in the process.
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Yeah I totally believe they will be the Winchester's army come the battle to close the gates of Hell...
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The Winchesters leading a ragtag group of misfits against Crowley and his demon cohorts...lol...stranger things have happened, I guess...
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Initially, I didn't like Krissy in "Adventures in Babysitting" but I gotta admit that she was a total badass in this ep. Am I alone in thinking that? This ep was better than I expected since I thought that the teens would be annoying but I genuinely liked them. SPN doesn't really have a good track record when it comes to writing likeable/not-annoying kids (except for that Antichrist kid in S5, seriously where is he now?). I hope that we see more of Krissy in the future. Love how Dean connects with the kids, it's one of the things that show that he has a soft heart. An all round good ep. :)
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Yes the Antichrist kid! I so want to know what's up with him. I really hope they revisit that before the series ends because that's a pretty major thread to just leave hanging there like that. Seems like a good time given the current story featuring heaven/hell again. Ooh or what if he was the big bad of season 9? That could be cool...
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You know i had almost totally forgot about that kid. But yeah, how awesome would it be to have him back, and involved in the 3 feats before closing the gates of Hell.
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It was a solid filler episode and it could have been more than that.
The kids were good and the idea that the would use technology while hunting vampires was a nice touch - there may have been a missed opportunity for a few laughs if they tried to train Sam and Dean in using the tech (old school vs. new school methods)
I am beginning to see some problems in recent epsodes. The guys now have a base of operations, which apart from the greek mythology episodes, no one has visited - why not tell the kids they can contact them there instead of having Garth drop by. OR JUST GIVE ONE OF THEM YOUR NUMBER.
This kind of makes me think we'll never hear from these characters again.
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Well no, considering the fact that Jeremy Carver revealed at comic con he has a 3 season plan for the show, there is now new life in the show where its all ”Leading up to the end of season 10”. So there is defintely still actual filler within the story even post Season 5 because its been planned out.

Im noy sure if Gamble had the same plan for Seasons 6 & 7 seems like they were written by ear, considering the future of the series wasnt as clear as nowadays (where season 10 seems almost guaranteed)
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are you saying this was a filler episode or a story arc tie in episode?
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Sorry I mean to reply to someone else's comment, but no I agree this was filler. Not the best offering, but there's been worse. I think it stemmed from uninteresting characters (the kids were all brats and quick to act emotionless)

some of the conversations were interesting though. I would like to see a real Hunter School. Closing the gates of hell is only going to lock away the demons. What about all the vengeful spirits and creatures? there has to be a future generation of hunters, they do need to be trained.
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Also - doesn't closing the gates strand the demons that are on earth
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I think this episode *was* more than just "a solid filler." Victor (shades of Frankenstein?) was a well-conceived, tragic figure. Once a hunter, he was driven insane after having heard his children ripped apart by a wendigo. In attempting to both recreate his family, and to protect other families from what he sees as an increasingly frightening world, he puts together a "family" of high school kids he's going to train to be super hunters. The problem is that in order to create his new "family," he'd murdered the real families of his new hunter-children -- ultimately turning himself into a monster. And he realizes this at the end when Krissy confronts him. His suicide isn't a coward's escape from the punishment of living with himself (which Krissy condemned him to) -- it's a partial redemption (one last monster hunt).
Plus there are some interesting parallels btw the kids out to get the monsters that killed their family and Sam & Dean's search for the YED in seasons one and two. Dean tells Krissy not to shoot Victor -- but he doesn't try to stop her. He recognizes that Victor is a good man whose lost his mind (and who shouldn't be held responsible for his crimes), but he also identifies with Krissy's need for revenge. Her faux-symbolic execution satisfies her thirst for vengeance while showing that she is wise enough not to let her emotions overrule her sense of Right and Wrong. Dean's decision to let her make her own decisions is based on her having shown herself mature in this regard -- mirroring his recent mature attitude toward Sam.
The story also appears to be foreshadowing some of the issues that are likely to come up in next week's ep -- when Benny returns.
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My feeling is that this is a filler episode in the series because it doesn't really advance the seasons overall story arc, i think by now we get how important closing the gates of hell is supposed to be - the last scene with Sam and Dean is a clunky way of trying to tie this into the narrative for the season.
Compared to mystery spot in season 3, (which doesn't reveal its connection to the seasons overall arc until the last 3rd of the episode) then Freaks and Geeks seems alot more last a filler episode or a stand alone episode.
I didnt think Victor was trying to recreate his family - i think that he was still trying to avenge them because he still felt their loss. The Frankenstein reference wasn't lost on me, i just felt it had more to do with his idea that creating vampires, and having the kids kill them would make them better hunters.
The parralells between the kids and Sam and Dean in season one and two are seen in a lot of hunters that pop up in supernatural - revenge for a loved one sets starts the hunter on their path and it escalates from there to consume their lives - John Winchester and Mary, Bobby and his wife, Gordon and his sister are the obvious examples - so i dont think he recognizes that Victor is a good man, he see's himself in Krissy, whats ahead of her and wants her to give up on the idea of revenge and hunting, but knows its a double standard - her argument would be along the lines of "How can you judge me for being like you?" (not knowing about Deans angsty side), so he has to let her decide for herself.
The faux execution probably does give her some staisfaction, but it is also a form of mental torture - compare it to The Deer Hunter scene - as well showing Victor that his plan has failed.
His attitude toward Sam has changed due to the timetable involved in the trials, he has accepted Sam will be doing the trials and not him - whether this is maturity, acceptance or resignation is debatable.
There are 3 episodes left in the season, which leaves the remaining 2 trials, Benny, Kevin, Castiel, the new order in heaven and men of words strands to tie up - so surely this episode could have waited until next season and at least one of these strands could have been progressed instead
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We have past the intended life of the series, so does the term filler even have the same meaning? We are kind of in uncharted territory. Consider, alternatively, each series story arc after season 5 is itself filler, and only episodes that develop the characters further are non-filler. I, for one, couldn't care less about this season's or last season's or next season's arc.
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everything Post-Season 5 technically being filler because there's no long term goal for a story arc? That's not true ever since Jeremy Carver stepped in and created a 3 year arc that ends with Season 10's Finale. There's still filler episodes compared to episodes that move that story further.

I don't think Season 6 and 7 were planned this way with Gamble, but Seasons 8-10 are all relative.
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True enough, but one of the best thing about the first 5 seasons (at least for me), was the overall arc that evolved and ran through those seasons, and with the storylines with heaven, the men of letters stuff and the tablets i am hoping for something similar for this season and the next.
I do like most of the stand alone episodes, but with an season crossing story arc i think there is more chance of getting 10 seasons out of Supernatural
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No one should ever know about the Bunker, except very well known and trusted allies, letting anyone in the first place was a real clunker on the writer's part
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If they had made it a bigger deal in the Tians episode i could understand that point, so i agree about it being bad writing.
i just dont know where they are going with the men of words stuff
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Damnit, I forgot to be on the lookout for smart/dumb Winchester sightings again, I think I need some pills because my memory's really going.
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My mind usually doesn't focus on looking out for smart/dumb Winchester sightings when watching an ep. Instead it's often focused on how hot Dean is and how Sam really needs a haircut.
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i always forget
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It wasn't a bad episode, it had lots of good points, I might watch it again some day. But it really didn't have a purpose, we get it, Sam would like to get out of hunting and have a normal life, Dean doesn't think that's possible. The old hunting guard is dead, a new generation is going to have to be trained. Closing hell, heaven and purgatory lets everyone be happy.

I thought the spurred to action by the Leviathan's thing made no sense, as he was nowhere near the leviathan fight! I wanted Sam and Dean to yell, "sure, but we actually fought and dealt with the leviathans and we haven't started recruiting children, Sam got a dog though." And throwing shade on Bobby was unacceptable.
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I felt that the Leviathan line was thrown in to tie to the previous season. For really no reason. As for the Bobby mention, up-thread there are some good comments
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Didn't really care for this episode,but didn't hated it also. *Moving along*,was/were my thought(s)...let's get back to main stories,Cas and so on:D

Also episode itself was kinda weird...just felt half baked and not thought through episode.
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Yup, yup, yup. All of this. It wasn't OMG THE WORST but eh, it didn't quite have the same momentum as last week.
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Yeah plus i'm not feeling that the whole 3 trials of gate closure, will be dealt with this season. I know the next episode deals with the 2nd trial. And if they do wrap up all 3 trials for the season finale... What's next season gonna be about. A setup of a Men of Number/Hunter academy?
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yes I hope they don't drag out case of the week just to set up the "To be continued..." crap. We know it's renewed. Give us closure to this season and start the next one with the aftermath!
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Sam is looking a little scruffy and sick I think because they want him to look like he's sick or having a hard time from all the trial stuff - and it looks like they're doing a good job!

I thought this was a pretty good filler episode too, and I wasn't to crazy about Victor either. Especially when he dissed Bobby and all their other friends for not being "great hunters". And when Sam was tied up to that chair, I was just waiting for him to untie himself. I do think he should be pro at that now. I mean how many times has that boy been tied up in the last 8 seasons?!
I also really liked how Dean was able to teach the kids that hunting isn't always about just killing the first monster in sight, kind of like how if someone is considered a bad person, they may not be bad, they could have just made bad decisions.
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Scruffy? Sick? Red nose? Didn't notice. At all. It's like they there's an entire story arc just for girls written in invisible ink.
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I liked Dean's lesson too. It was especially nice given that earlier in the series, he kind of was a "shoot first ask questions later" kind of guy himself, though definitely not AS bad as the kids.
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I like Krissy and Dean's relation, I hope they bring her back for more. Those other two kids can be killed of.
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I like it too. He's incapable of being anything but a big brother to anyone who needs it and it's sweet. :)
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