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Official Discussion Thread: Rubber Man (possible spoilers)

  • Avatar of SweetMissJaye

    SweetMissJaye

    [41]Nov 30, 2011
    • member since: 08/22/07
    • level: 22
    • rank: Freak and Geek
    • posts: 1,026

    I've been away from the forum for a few days, just reallyfrustrated with the show after rewatching certain scenes from the Rubber Man episode. I hope they clear up a lot of this stuff. To me, it just doesn't make sense that Tate doesn't know he's dead; he really has to know. And Nora not knowing she's dead? I really can't take that, not after the way she helped Ben in the basement and told him to save the baby. A couple of people referred to the scene where Nora goes to the house and Viv thinks she's a potential buyer. I don't think this shows that Nora didn't know she was a ghost. I think she knew she was a ghost then too. She walks through the house curiously, looking at the electonics and whatnot. But shouldn't she have been upset that strange people and strange items were in her house (unless she forgot the house was hers)? Either way, I don't think that the fact that she helped Ben in the basement can be ignored.

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  • Avatar of JoshSutton

    JoshSutton

    [42]Nov 30, 2011
    • member since: 09/18/06
    • level: 15
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    I think i would've liked a new family every season. That would mean they could have a set story within a season and the show won't become some wacky sitcom like My favourite Ghosts! or something.
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  • Avatar of JosephPerry

    JosephPerry

    [43]Nov 30, 2011
    • member since: 09/22/10
    • level: 2
    • rank: Sweat Hog
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    Viv has been my favorite on the show since episode 1 (except for every once in a while, Constance), I liked Tate up until the school shooting episode, that did me in for him. He DERSERVES to be chased by angry ghosts. Who can blame 'em? He shot them all dead (PLUS, all the murders we didn't see that occured off screen) for no apparent reason. Oh they called him names in school? Boo-freaking-hoo for him.He's nothing but a huge p***y fied baby, IMO. And I like Violet much less now, too. To stand there and watch your mother being led out the door to a mental unit when you could have saved her with four little words, "She's not imagining it"...You could see how torn she was, but big deal. You don't do that to your saintly mother! And Ben? What a scum bag. That all being said I CANNOT WAIT FOR TONIGHT!!!!!!

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  • Avatar of MsAnalytical

    MsAnalytical

    [44]Dec 1, 2011
    • member since: 11/08/11
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 51

    I think part of the psychological aspect of the show is to create sympathy for unlikeable characters. (Which is postmodernism...characters are "real" now, flaws and all. No white hats and black hats to designate good guys and bad guys.) While I find actions reprehensible, decisions inexcusable, and some people annoying as hell, there are points where I have felt empathetic toward almost all of them. I think that the quote from the interactive house is basically a quick quote theme of the show, you desire what you fear, you fear what you desire. Plus, I think it is vital to remember that the house takes the very weakest parts of your personality, your fears, your desires, and manipulates them to control you. Everyone has a weakness. What if someone could read your mind and do everything he/she could in order to drive you insane and/or use you for their own ends. That is the most terrifying thing about this show.

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  • Avatar of cawylie

    cawylie

    [45]Dec 3, 2011
    • member since: 04/04/06
    • level: 5
    • rank: Caveman Lawyer
    • posts: 67

    Yeah, but could they have not gotten someone better than whiny immature Hayden to do all that?




    "I MATTER!"

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  • Avatar of cawylie

    cawylie

    [46]Dec 3, 2011
    • member since: 04/04/06
    • level: 5
    • rank: Caveman Lawyer
    • posts: 67

    SweetMissJaye wrote:
    I've been away from the forum for a few days, just reallyfrustrated with the show after rewatching certain scenes from the Rubber Man episode. I hope they clear up a lot of this stuff. To me, it just doesn't make sense that Tate doesn't know he's dead; he really has to know. And Nora not knowing she's dead? I really can't take that, not after the way she helped Ben in the basement and told him to save the baby. A couple of people referred to the scene where Nora goes to the house and Viv thinks she's a potential buyer. I don't think this shows that Nora didn't know she was a ghost. I think she knew she was a ghost then too. She walks through the house curiously, looking at the electonics and whatnot. But shouldn't she have been upset that strange people and strange items were in her house (unless she forgot the house was hers)? Either way, I don't think that the fact that she helped Ben in the basement can be ignored.


    Welcome back, SMJ! I've been away too, working on the fansite. But that's what I loved about Nora. The current situation, even the deaths of Chad and Patrick, do not sit well with her. I foresee her and Moira being the saviors in the end. I cite my own two examples:


    Moira's warning Vivien about the house.


    Nora's secretly weeping over the choice she made to bring money in. (Her tears when Charles took the first girl to the basement.)



    I also don't think Tate intended to cause the Apocalypse to happen when he "raped" Vivien.

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  • Avatar of HeadlinesRCrazy

    HeadlinesRCrazy

    [47]Dec 3, 2011
    • member since: 10/27/11
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 63

    SweetMissJaye wrote:


    I've been away from the forum for a few days, just reallyfrustrated with the show after rewatching certain scenes from the Rubber Man episode. I hope they clear up a lot of this stuff. To me, it just doesn't make sense that Tate doesn't know he's dead; he really has to know. And Nora not knowing she's dead? I really can't take that, not after the way she helped Ben in the basement and told him to save the baby. A couple of people referred to the scene where Nora goes to the house and Viv thinks she's a potential buyer. I don't think this shows that Nora didn't know she was a ghost. I think she knew she was a ghost then too. She walks through the house curiously, looking at the electonics and whatnot. But shouldn't she have been upset that strange people and strange items were in her house (unless she forgot the house was hers)? Either way, I don't think that the fact that she helped Ben in the basement can be ignored.



    I do actually buy that Nora doesn't know she's dead (or didn't, until Hayden told her). I think she goes back and forth between moments of lucidity, sort of like she's kind of stuck in-between two worlds. I, however, agree that I really can no longer believe that Tate doesn't know he's dead. If he doesn't know he's dead, it's just so hard for me to buy: 1. that scene in the basement between Hayden and him 2. The fact that he's trying so hard to please Nora. 3. that he kills Chad and Patrick because he knows they're not going to bring a baby into the house, which means he knows that multiple owners come into the house and that their purpose is to provide a baby. In this week's episode, Hayden had a scene where she lied to Ben about having an abortion, blah, blah, blah...But it made me think. Her lies were obviously intended to maintain the illusion that she's alive for Ben because he doesn't know she's dead. Hayden VERY obviously knows she's dead. What if Tate's deal is the same as Hayden's? He puts on a performance of not being dead for people who don't know he is dead--Ben, the five people he killed in the library, etc. The big question mark here becomes Violet, of course. Does he know that she knows he is dead or does he not know that she knows he is dead? My money is on that he does, based on the fact that he called her 'evolved', they've done the deed, and he's giving her the secrets of the house. Then again, if you think about it, Tate has been trying to show Violet the truth about the house since they first moved in--he appeared to her in the rubberman suit and unmasked himself, they had the Ouija session where he told her about Dr. Montgomery, he's had her bring people to basement and witness what happened to them, he gave her photos of the Montgomery family. Tate has always wanted Violet to know the truth about the house. She just never really believed him until she learned the truth about him. So I'm thinking maybe the key to learning the truth about the house is knowing the truth about someone who is in it, which makes Ben and Moira's scene from Spooky Little Girl rather significant. Because Ben has seen "the truth" about Moira, maybe that's an indication that he's now going to begin seeing the truth about the house, like Violet.

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  • Avatar of MsAnalytical

    MsAnalytical

    [48]Dec 4, 2011
    • member since: 11/08/11
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 51

    HeadlinesRCrazy wrote:



    So I'm thinking maybe the key to learning the truth about the house is knowing the truth about someone who is in it, which makes Ben and Moira's scene from Spooky Little Girl rather significant. Because Ben has seen "the truth" about Moira, maybe that's an indication that he's now going to begin seeing the truth about the house, like Violet.


    [/QUOTE]


    If he does not suspect something after this I am going to be annoyed. I am wondering if Moira will come back now or if her "firing" will be permanent.

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  • Avatar of cawylie

    cawylie

    [50]Dec 7, 2011
    • member since: 04/04/06
    • level: 5
    • rank: Caveman Lawyer
    • posts: 67

    :


    If he does not suspect something after this I am going to be annoyed. I am wondering if Moira will come back now or if her "firing" will be permanent.



    Moira will be there till the lot is dug up. Just because Ben has seen her true form, it doesn't mean he's caught on to the Ghost theory. But I also think the house allows certain ghosts to appear at certain times so that may be reason enough for Moira to not be around much anymore. (I will miss Ms. Breckinridge, if that's the case.) I just like the idea that she is fighting for the good guys.

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