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The WB (ended 2004)

Why did Glenn Quinn (Doyle) leave?

  • Avatar of NickSeng

    NickSeng

    [41]Sep 28, 2006
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    tjaman wrote:
    I don't remember Tara making any kind of appearance after she died.

    I'd have remembered my heart being ripped from my chest like that.


    I thing she was referring to "Villians", where Amber playes Tara's dead body. She wasn't credited in the episode though.
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  • Avatar of tjaman

    tjaman

    [42]Sep 29, 2006
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    Oh, sorry.

    Everything after "Seeing Red" becomes a kind of blur for a bit.
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  • Avatar of Charisma69

    Charisma69

    [43]Oct 1, 2006
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    grailwolf wrote:
    I have nothing to add. Thanks for fielding that one Cordy.


    You're Welcome Grail. Glad I could help.

    grailwolf wrote:
    Hmm... remember when I said I had nothing to add? I lied.



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  • Avatar of Catatonicc

    Catatonicc

    [44]Oct 7, 2006
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     I think from the outset of when Joss was developing Angel it was always decided the Doyle would die a few episodes in. I wish that hadn't been the case cause if he had had a more regular role maybe he wouldn't have died. But there are always the "what-ifs".
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  • Avatar of Sevenwndrs

    Sevenwndrs

    [45]Apr 26, 2007
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    I know this is late coming into such an old topic, but I am new at TV.com. These topics are interesting to me as of late, for I have begun watching these series again, in syndication. Anyways, I am surprised at my fellow Buffy/Angel fans! A lot of you have mentioned the words and quotes of Whedon. So you show remembered; or at the very least heard of, the interview with Joss just after Glenn Quinn's death in December of 2002. Glenn had remained in contact with Joss after his contract was up with the Angel series. Just to help answer any questions that I possibly can:

    1. Some of you are quite correct in Joss's desire to do the unexpected, ex: killing off a main character either early on, or when it is least expected. He wanted to make sure that the audience understood that Angel's life was all about loss. Unlike the life of Buffy, where the gang is dealing with a constant Apocalypse, Angel is dealing with THE Apocalypse in which he plays a major key. You learn most of this in the last season. Everything that happens in every episode is meant to happen, to start a chain of events that all leads to Angels role. This includes Doyle's death; the first soldier down, whom passes on his visions to Cordelia, who in turn becomes part demon; which she believes is so that she can handle the visions and thus becomes a higher power because she has been promoted, yet this is untrue. She becomes a higher power to bring back an ancient demon, etc. OK, getting way off track here. 

     2. Was Glenn fired because of drugs or any other reason? No. The point with this is that it was the writers intentions all along to kill off Doyle. However, it later became a tough decision for the creators, as Glenn had produced quite a fan base. He was not supposed to survive past 5 episodes, in which the character of Wesley was supposed to step in. The character of Wesley was given extra episodes on Buffy, to satisfy his contract because of the fact that Glenn stayed on for 6 extra episodes. It was the intention of Joss, from the moment of decision of a spinoff series of Angel, that "Wesley" would be joining the cast. However, the Angel scriptwas changed completely to keep the character on longer. Apparently, he was supposed to die saving Cordelia in episode 5, but was changed at last minute to "Room w/a Vu", and the story then brought in Cordelia's roommate ghost.

    3. Was the character of Doyle supposed to return? Well know that no one in the Angel family, in front or behind the scenes knew that the show would be cancelled when it did. Joss himself had hoped for a few more years to reach the main goal of the series. Writing had to change often and quite quickly. Joss and the writers always had main ideas, including the Powers-That-Be, Wolfram & Hart, etc, and how each would play a role in the Apocalypse. They did not plan; however, on Charisma Carpenters pregnancy. So they used this to their advantage. They also did not plan on the series given one more season before cancellation. So they had to take all of their ideas and cram them into one last season. Because of this, Cordelia was killed off, also because it was time for her to leave and raise a family. But Joss did say after the death of Glenn Quinn, that he has always hoped that the character of Doyle would be the one who returns to give Angel some sort of inspiration when he felt like he just wanted to quit. But Cordelia ends up being the one to do this in the end of the final series. Glenn's death was a surprise to everyone, including Joss, who was not aware of drug problems during their time working together.

     I hope some of this helps. All of this comes from what I know of the shows, like you, as a fan, as well as words straight from the creators mouth; including commentaries and interviews. I am not sure if anyone will see this, as the last post on this tpic was a year ago, but maybe it will reach someone! I am sure there are still a few straggling B & A fans out there! Take care!

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  • Avatar of noahcrash

    noahcrash

    [46]Apr 26, 2007
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    tjaman wrote:
    Oh, sorry.

    Everything after "Seeing Red" becomes a kind of blur for a bit.


    I seem to remember these horrible potential cheerleaders. is that right? And a whiny sister who wouldnt shut the hell up. And some redhead skinned an as*hole! Im sure Im right on this!
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  • Avatar of tv_lover066

    tv_lover066

    [47]Apr 26, 2007
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    thanx sevenwndrs!!!! rely informative!!!!
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  • Avatar of emerald999

    emerald999

    [48]Apr 26, 2007
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    Since this topic's been resurrected, I'll just add that I had also heard that Doyle's main purpose in season one was to establish what the visions were and why and then to pass them to Cordy. It was always meant to be a very temporary character, but it's happy and sad that Doyle was such a great character that he is missed so much. It's even sadder that we never got to see him back on the show because of Glenn's death.

    Just out of curiosity, how much does it cost to make opening credits? Can't take much to put in a few extra frames of film, can it? I know that Joss had a very low budget at the beginning of BtvS, but that seems like a strange reason. However, Jesse was only there for a couple of episodes so we hadn't really considered him a main character the way we did Doyle. Amber as Tara is a different issue....

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  • Avatar of netgoddess

    netgoddess

    [49]Dec 21, 2009
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    emerald999 wrote:

    Just out of curiosity, how much does it cost to make opening credits? Can't take much to put in a few extra frames of film, can it?

    I don't think it would cost much to add an extra 3 or 4 seconds to the opening sequence. All the footage is captured already from episodes. I've done some video production myself and it just doesn't seem like it'd have been a big deal, but then again all the massive effort involved to bring a TV show to life could have just been too much to put on the plate that early in the show's run.
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  • Avatar of lovingpizonica

    lovingpizonica

    [50]Feb 3, 2010
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    ViktorCharmed wrote:
    supreme_dar wrote:
    I think the name was Jessie or something like that.

    His name was Jesse, and he was only in the two pilot episodes of Buffy. I think Joss talked about that in the commentary of those episodes.


    That whole thing really bothered me. I understand Joss's plan, and I even think it was kind of funny/interesting, but the fact that Willow and Xander never mention the name of their apparent best friend ever again contributes to the patchy "what the heck-ness" of the first season.
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  • Avatar of allendoyle343

    allendoyle343

    [51]Jun 25, 2012
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    you guys don,t know much about the show because at the time when the made it they wern,t going to kill doyle off because he is the guy who started up the angel group. not just that he was also the key to the powers that be. joss whendon was surprise he died on the epsode hero cause he did not make that epsode so theres your awnser

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  • Avatar of Fanodoyle

    Fanodoyle

    [52]Jul 16, 2012
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    Hi,

    I'm not so sure if Glenn and Joss didn't have a falling out, on the dvd of angel there is the option of watching the first episode with joss and david greenwalt's commentary, when doyle first appears you would expect joss to speak glowingly of Glenn but he doesn't, he barely says two words about him, that to me would suggest that however their relationship began it certainly didn't end amicably, i could be wrong. Anyway as far as i'm concerned the first nine episodes of Angel were the best. Cheers Glenn.
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  • Avatar of jack756

    jack756

    [53]Aug 11, 2012
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    i wonder that too.i dont know if he and joss had a falling out or not.but i just figure he wasnt never meant to stay full term b/c he had to pass on vission to cordy.


    but on another sad note.when i found out he died and i rewatched that ep where he died.i cried like a baby.im not an emotional guy but i did get emotional over that.just like when i found out the guy who play lorne died too.sad


    now to a funny note.what if doyle stayed and had to give his vissions to tht guy the grosale.(i cant spell his name)his the guy who wanted to do it with cordy to get her vissions when cordy went to lorne homeland.just imangine if doyle had stayed and keep his vissions and meet the groasal.that would be too funny


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