Battlestar Galactica Forums

Syfy (ended 2010)

Discussion - "Daybreak, Pt. 2 & 3" (3/20/09) (spoilers)

How would you rate this episode?

  • Avatar of tribalchic

    tribalchic

    [281]Mar 31, 2009
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    123home123 wrote:
    After seeing all that went wrong because of technology in the first place over the course of the series, why is it so hard to believe that people would just want to abandon technology? I don't think they abandoned every last scrap of technology. We saw that they still had at least a couple small ships as well as smaller electronic equipment. How else would they have been able to ferry people to all corners of the planet? I'm not sure how interesting it would have been to watch everyone gathering to vote. This was a series finale after all, and one for a complex show. It's also a television series, not a documentary. Why would we need to see a boring detail like that, especially in a sweeping end to the series' run? I'm glad they didn't feel the need to show that. That would have destroyed the pacing of the story. As for quoting other people quoting other people, I don't think that's necessary. People are welcome to post their own thoughts on this forum, but this is not supposed to be a repository of every negative statement about the episode located at any point on the Internet. We shouldn't be copying and pasting entire statements from other forums. This is a forum for members of TV.com, not a collection of statements posted on other websites. Just post your own thoughts. Thank you.

    123home123, I agree with you completely.

    I thought this was the perfect end to a iconic show. Only then to come back to tv.com and be shocked at the huge uproar by its fans. I mean what were some of you expecting?......a flat out question and answer session or an end to a series??

    I'm not a religious person but I think the "Angels" explanation was a really fitting and satisfying solution to the role that faith plays on the show (hello! the Last Supper promo pic ring any bells). From season1 "head" six always spoke about a single God, she infact was a messenger of him all along....is it really that big of a stretch to suggest such a thing? No.

    I think why this bothers so many is because it had a "religious explanation" tone and this scares alot of atheist viewers because its imposing its beliefs on the viewers.....now if the religious angle had just popped up in the last 4 episodes on a whim with no prior mention of such a thing in the entire series yes, I would be skeptical HOWEVER, faith has been a significant part of the series since the beginning with humans being Polytheistic and the cylons Monotheistic. So don't take it out on the series since it wasn't the scientific answer you wanted.

    And all this crazy hate about them "abandoning their technology' is really unfounded, considering they were barely surviving on those ships day to day looking for A PLACE TO CALL HOME which they finally found in the finale so they no longer needed to search the depths of space. We saw tents, guns and Vipers so who's to say they didn't take whatever essentials they didn't wish to abbandon?

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  • Avatar of cpac2247

    cpac2247

    [282]Apr 3, 2009
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    I thought the ending was fantastic. For those of you that didn't pay attention at all to any part of the series and are still asking the question as to what Head-Six and Head-Baltar are, here is the big answer; They are angels. They said it themselves several times during the course of the series. And I cant understand why people didnt like the ending, it ended on a positive, they reached a final goal, and were able to live in relative peace while preserving the human race. What did you guys want? The Galactica to get nuked as it entered orbit and everyone dies? I guess there is just no pleasing some people.
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  • Avatar of Helostwin

    Helostwin

    [283]Apr 3, 2009
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    And all this crazy hate about them "abandoning their technology' is really unfounded, considering they were barely surviving on those ships day to day looking for A PLACE TO CALL HOME which they finally found in the finale so they no longer needed to search the depths of space. -------------------------------------------

    Exactly. The reason I left this forum in the first season of BSG & just returned to comment on the finale was because of all the technology obscessed posters who crucified anyone who disagreed with them. I went on to post on other shows forums & ignored the BSG forum but I still watched the show. I came to gloat because the way the series ended must have really p***ed them off.
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  • Avatar of kagekidan

    kagekidan

    [284]Apr 8, 2009
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    After spending the past few hours reading many of the posts here, it's interesting to see the divergence of opinions. And although I can understand and even agree with both sides, I have to fall on the side of dislike for the many reasons stated already. I'm a science guy and I like my scifi well crafted and more science than theology. But to actually add something new to the discussion, I was particularly amused by the people criticizing the negative reviewers of continually arguing the same points, etc, when they themselves were doing the same thing in response. I personally liked the first 2 seasons and my interest dwindled thereafter as things got more convoluted. But I kept up with the series more out of simple curiosity to see how things would turn out.

    And reason I decided to write this post is because I don't think it's right to condemn people that don't see things your way. When I lost interest, I stopped actively discussing it, but I didn't think anything less of the people around me who continually praised it as the best show ever (although not one of them actually liked the finale). Everyone has a right to their own opinions. People have been mentioning the plot holes and taking the convenient solutions, etc, which make for a great argument for why the episode wasn't technically well crafted, but you have to remember that has no bearing on whether people will like it or not. In fact, those negative reasons may very well be exactly why certain people do or will like it. People can be illogical like that. And many great movies and stories are born from being not at all what people were expecting or hoping for or that make sense. Accept it and you'll be better for it. It's like trying to convince someone that black licorice tastes great or terrible. If they like it or hate it, you probably aren't going to convince them otherwise. I for one can't stand the taste of it, by the way.

    And although I may not have liked the finale, I don't think it was the slap in the face others have described it as. That I reserve for the Enterprise finale.

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  • Avatar of AndromedaDiablo

    AndromedaDiablo

    [285]Apr 9, 2009
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    Good show shame to see it end
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  • Avatar of BSG2006

    BSG2006

    [286]Apr 9, 2009
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    I was disappointed with this episode too. I enjoyed many parts of it, but overall I was not happy. I really expected more answers and closure. I mean I'm a Christian and when they went with God did it, I was like, "really?" lol. But I didn't hate it, just disappointed. The flasbacks were time killers imo and didn't offer much insight. A few were good. Like Roslin having a one night stand with a much younger former student, drunken Apollo and Starbuck getting ready to shag on the day they met on a table with a passed out Zack(?) Adama in the room, and a s*&%-faced Adama shown puking on himself. Err, wait, no those weren't good either. Hmm, seems like all the flaskbacks involved alcohol, even the one with Boomer had Adama and Tigh drinking liquor. Anders flashback didn't though, or maybe he was soaking in a big ol' tub of white wine. I also expected Hera to be a bigger part too. Anyways, the God explanation wasn't the best, and then they go and say "he doesn't like to be called that", which means even that answer wasn't definite. I don't need to be spoonfed, but the line I just quoted means that we really don't know if it was God, Aliens, or Jimmy Hendrix that was the guiding force and responsible for Kara being brought back. I really would have like to known. Also, wasn't the guy reading the magazine at the end Ron Moore?
    Edited on 04/09/2009 6:53pm
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  • Avatar of xBakaTulipx

    xBakaTulipx

    [287]Apr 11, 2009
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    I really appreciated the ending. I think it was a solid closure, and it was relatively a happy ending (I was expecting devistation and senseless bloodbaths.) I do wish they'd focused more on "Coexistence good" than "Technology bad" at the end because I feel that the social messages are much more important.
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  • Avatar of myc4971

    myc4971

    [288]Apr 14, 2009
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    Certainly one of the best TV shows I've seen in my whole life. Season by season, I was continuously blown away. Nothing was ever predictable!

    The conclusion, although it has left some questions, was just PERFECTION! I think the unanswered mysteries that we have are the things that would just make this show stick to our memories along with the most brilliant characters.

    I'm left cold though if Kara will ever find her peace and eventually settle down with Lee.

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  • Avatar of myc4971

    myc4971

    [289]Apr 14, 2009
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    Hmm... my take is that the statement was not against technology. I think you have to take it with the context of the whole show. The whole point why history kept repeating itself was not the fact that the robots were wrong but because of humanity's capacity for deceit and natural inability to trust.
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  • Avatar of h4l0guy

    h4l0guy

    [290]Apr 16, 2009
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    The ending of the show is very poetic. The way Baltar/6 appear in present day was pretty awesome.
    But the ending makes very little sense. This abandonment of technology bit can't work, and there are so many reasons why. The first being that the purpose of life for many becomes menial. Think about it this way. Baltar was a very knowledgeable man in areas of science, one that was classified a genius. how does that man then, for the rest of his life, get up in the morning, plant crops, till his field, fertilize it, harvest, etc? HOW? This is all every colonist has to look forward to for the rest of their lives. Sure, they can be romantics, and fantasize about being one with nature. however, I believe that many of them would not be able to stand lives as farmers after living in a very civilized society.
    Secondly, women are giving up all advances they have made in society. This is because women will be taking their traditional role of mother/caretaker, while men will be ones that get food and fend for the family. How many women would really like to go back to a time when they would have no rights? Women would not just take that lying down.
    Finally, all of this is futile. All these fools are doing is a disservice themselves, as they are turning back civilization hundreds of thousands of years. Humans will still evolve, and perhaps create cylons of their own, as seen by the ending. They have done nothing except perhaps delaying the inevitable. It is foolish to say simply because they abandoned tech, that what happened before won't happen again. As indicated by the ending, it still may happen in the future. Therefore, what they are doing is futile, and they must know in their minds that they will eventually master technology again in the future.
    Think about it this way. Will the Doc be fine with giving up modern medicine, and allowing many people to die simply because of a romantic ideal planted in the survivors heads? Will Baltar be content as a farmer for the rest of his life when he could be doing things MUCH more important and challenging? I understand that the writers want to make the show end with these people being the forerunners of humans today. It is very poetic, but it does not make sense. I believe that in no way could any of these people from such an advanced society go back to that period of time and be content.
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  • Avatar of h4l0guy

    h4l0guy

    [291]Apr 16, 2009
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    Also, a take on the harbinger of death thing. Maybe she was the harbinger of death for the cylons? I don't see how though.
    Maybe she is the harbinger because what happened will happen again, and she is the one that took them to earth? Both stretches.
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  • Avatar of ISpeakTheTruth

    ISpeakTheTruth

    [292]Apr 17, 2009
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    Copied from my blog:

    Welp its official BSG or Battlestar Galactica is now over having its series finale a few weeks ago and as promised here's my review of it. Like I said before BSG is one of my all time favorite shows and that hasn't changed though I have to say I was less than thrilled with the way the series came to an end leaving plot holes wide open and many questions left unanswered.

    You may be asking why didn't you like the finale Truth? Are you high? Stonned? No, I am someone who has watched a great series for years that deserved a great finale and only got a 'Meh' ending at best. First the big fight with the Battlestar and the Cylong mother ship was rather boring... so to was the entire rescue of Hera. Then came the moment where the Cylos and Human's had a very short lived truce where the humans were going to give the Cylons resurection tech (Stupid idea) Then once it goes bad in a matter of 2 minutes all the evil Cylons are killed not by some grand plan but by a Raptor with a pari of dead pilots whoose dead hands trigger Nukes to hit the mother ship... Wow! Talk about random I swear I thought that someone was having a dream sequence when I saw this because it was just too hard to believe that the show would get rid of the series Antaonists in such a quick random fashion.... But they did.

    Speaking of the enemy Cylons lets talk about Cavil somoene who I sort of liked because of his pure evilness that he did throught the series especially the last few episodes. Here's a character who is an evil mastermind setting the Final Five into human lives and planning the Hera capture and many other cruel genious things and how does this great villain die? In the above mentioned 2 minute destruction of all the enemy Cylons after he sees the fight isn't going his way he says "Oh Frak" and shots himself? What? I think they could have done alot better than that.

    Then the crew makes it to Earth at the end.... and its our Earth which I find sort of cheesie. But hey it is what it is though their sudden readyness to live off the environment and send their ships into the sun was very hard to swallow. I get that there was suppose to be some sort of message but come on these people have advanced tech that they've lived with for their entire lives and they say naah I'm going to hunt bear with a sharp stick... Not realistic at all that they'd so utterly remove technology from their lives even with there fear of the past repeating which has been a staple of the show.

    Finally the questions left open and things that were really usesless in the final episodes of the series. First what was Kara? Honestly at the end she just disappears and we are left at that, having had this season as the season that was going to reveale everything ended up revealing very little and made alot more questions. Then we hae the Final Five which was a cool story line I give you that but there was no big pay off in the end... the Final Five did nothing of any value in the finale or in the last season all together they only thing it did was make for some personal soap-opera-ish drama and thats about it.

    So I give the Finale a 6-7

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  • Avatar of 123home123

    123home123

    [293]Apr 18, 2009
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    BSG2006 wrote:
    Also, wasn't the guy reading the magazine at the end Ron Moore?

    Yes, Ronald Moore was the man reading the National Geographic magazine near the end of the series finale. I think most regular viewers are familiar with him because he has appeared on a few of the "behind-the-scenes" specials on the Sci Fi Channel and some of the video clips on the Sci Fi website (soon to be called Syfy).

    Maybe David Eick should have had a cameo too. Even though Ronald Moore was the creative force behind the series, David Eick played a very important role in the success of BSG too. He recruited Ronald Moore to serve as an executive producer along with Eick. I think he was also the one who suggested at the beginning that BSG take a different approach to the sci-fi genre and move away from the "Star Trek" sort of subgenre. Eick specifically mentioned Star Trek in some early interviews and pointed out that Moore's Star Trek background (TNG and Deep Space Nine) would help him to create something new that moved away from the conventions of the Star Trek series.

    ***

    I only saw part of the repeat airing of the series finale the week after its premiere. I still got a kick out of watching the ship slam into the Cylon Colony. That provided a visceral thrill similar to the scene of the Galactica free-falling into the New Caprican atmosphere in "Exodus, Part 2". Though BSG wasn't an action/adventure series, the producers did manage to put together some great action moments.

    I haven't changed my viewpoint of the finale. I still like it, a lot. I've read the comments about how having "angels" and "God" is some sort of intellectual cowardice on the part of Ronald Moore. I still don't agree with that. Several people have pointed out that the religious themes and mysticism have been part of the series since the very beginning. Head Six was not just some afterthought that Moore came up with to explain everything away at the end. That character has been a major part of the series ever since the Miniseries.

    Those of you with some familiarity with Christianity know that God is sometimes described as a mystery. And even with other religions and creation myths and even the scientific explanation of creation, it's just not possible to really understand it all. Ronald Moore did the right thing about not being so presumptuous to say to viewers, "Here. I've figured everything out, the nature of existence, the supreme being (assuming one is out there), etc. and I am going to explain it all out for you clearly in this finale." While many sci-fi shows have had detailed explanations of "superior" or advanced beings like the Q from ST:TNG and the Asgard from Stargate SG-1, those shows never tried to be as gut-wrenchingly realistic as BSG was. I still would have been sorely disappointed to see a neat and tidy explanation of exactly what Head Six, Head Baltar and the single "God" was in the BSG universe.

    Yes, this is clearly not pure sci-fi but if anyone thought that BSG was pure sci-fi after 5-plus years of episodes, then I don't think they were quite examining all of the aspects of this show. It was a mix of philosophy, religion, politics, modern cultural themes, character-driven drama, a war drama, mysticism, and some sci-fi. Nevertheless, it's interesting to see the different reactions on the forum. It shows that BSG really engaged viewers on an intellectual level and an emotional level.
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  • Avatar of my1sunshine

    my1sunshine

    [294]Apr 19, 2009
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    I've just re-watched all three parts, and I must say, it was more profound, and made more sense the second time then the first.
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  • Avatar of rubyfruit67

    rubyfruit67

    [295]Apr 20, 2009
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    A truly profound ending to a brilliantly-written show.
    I've rewatched most of seasons 3 and 4 and, while there are a few episodes that feel like filler to me, I continue to feel that Daybreak is the only way the show could've ended.
    Ronald Moore and the other writers found the natural progression for Battlestar Galactica and gave us an exit that they should feel truly proud of.
    Watch it again!
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  • Avatar of rubyfruit67

    rubyfruit67

    [297]Apr 20, 2009
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    myc4971 wrote:

    I'm left cold though if Kara will ever find her peace and eventually settle down with Lee.



    If you didn't get it, Kara was an angel, too. Unlike the Baltar and Caprica angels, she appeared to everyone...not just a primary character. If you recall, she died on Earth I (found her own remains and pulled her tags) and came back to help guide the human race to Earth II. Did she always know that was her ultimate goal? Not until the very end...when she is finally standing on earth with Lee.

    Her experience in the bar with the "father-like figure"? That was supposed to be a ghostly (or angelic) visit from her own father sent to help her find her path.

    For those who wondered if she will ever settle down with Lee...the answer is No, how can she?
    She disappeared while he was saying goodbye to her on Earth II.
    Poof. Gone. She was an apparition...an angel.

    Get it? Got it? Good.
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  • Avatar of MajLorne

    MajLorne

    [298]Apr 24, 2009
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    :
    I only saw part of the repeat airing of the series finale the week after its premiere. I still got a kick out of watching the ship slam into the Cylon Colony. That provided a visceral thrill similar to the scene of the Galactica free-falling into the New Caprican atmosphere in "Exodus, Part 2". Though BSG wasn't an action/adventure series, the producers did manage to put together some great action moments.

    Going back to Star Trek, it was just as fun as the part where the Enterprise E was going to slam into the Reman Warship in Star Trek Nemesis. Smash ups are just so cool
    And yup, Exodus Part 2 is high on my favorites especially such moments like that. Wow, Galactica freefalling like that and the last moment jumping and leaving a massive shockwave over the planet. My kudos to the CGI/FX crews.
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  • Avatar of RockSiren

    RockSiren

    [299]Apr 28, 2009
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    I am saddened to see so many responses to the criticism as being "you didnt get it!" Oh I got it, I just didnt really like it/thought that it fit. Im actually relieved to see so many other viewers a bit dissappointed in the ending as I was- I thought there was something wrong with me. I absolutey loved the show- it has been far and away, one of the few shows I could pretty much count on for absolute and consistent excellence in the last few years. But I just didnt dig the ending. Im sorry. Someone who wrote a bunch of stuff up for Television Without Pity explains it best:

    http://www.televisionwithoutpity.com/show/battlestar_galactica/battlestar_galactica_unanswere.php
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  • Avatar of goldtop2007

    goldtop2007

    [300]May 9, 2009
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    What a sweet show - hate to see it go, but what a blast we had !
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