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Discussion - "Maelstrom" (3/4/07 episode) (spoilers)

  • Avatar of jcarver23

    jcarver23

    [81]Mar 5, 2007
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    The podcast is finally out. I haven't listened to it yet. Maybe it will shed some light on whether dying was Kara's real destiny or whether Katee will be back in some way.

    I have an awful feeling that this is it, though. It's like "The Body" from Buffy. We're watching a show about genocide. Billions have died and it's kind of abstract, until we see someone we love die.
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  • Avatar of gabfan31

    gabfan31

    [82]Mar 5, 2007
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    Why is it they waited to give a talented actress like Katee Sackoff a really strong story just as they were about to kill her off? What a swansong!
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  • Avatar of sla_17

    sla_17

    [83]Mar 5, 2007
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    I guess the million dollar question is "Is Starbuck really dead?" Unfortunately we may not know until next season. I don't really know what to think about her "death." She could be dead or she could be a cylon as others have stated. This episode was interesting because we were able to see into Starbuck's past and really see where all her anger and hostility came from. It was also nice to see Lee support her when his dad was doubting her. I guess their friendship was/is stronger than they thought.
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  • Avatar of Nethicus

    Nethicus

    [84]Mar 5, 2007
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    I liked the episode. Really gave a background to Starbuck that was desperately needed. And now to bump her off? I don't think so.

    Her mom kept saying she was special. Now, everybody's mom says that to them at some point, but I think she really had an alterior motive. Leoben also seemed to know all about Starbuck and he'd been saying that everything that has been is playing out again.

    Additionally, notice that Starbuck's canopy was shrouded in white light right there at the end? Hello, Temple of the Five anyone? Everybody there was shrouded in white light, too. Then the Cylon Heavy Raider-- why not a regualr raider? Answer: the Heavy can support a Ressurection Pod. Leoben knew all about Kara and was ready to "pick her up" when she died, and it's that realization that she was a Cylon that she wasn't afraid to die.

    So, yes, she is a Cylon. But they're not going to reveal that until cliffhanger time next year, methinks. Starbuck's back, and all that jazz. But this year? It's Tigh. He somehow figures out he's a Cylon.

    Next episode's trailer is over at Sci-Fi. For those of us who watch the late BSG, they don't show the trailer anymore, they just go right into the Twilight Zone. I think Lee's going to think he's a Cylon, then start dressing in Cylon's clothing.
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  • Avatar of AthenaAurora

    AthenaAurora

    [85]Mar 5, 2007
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    I feel soooo stupid ! I finally get it now! Glen A Larson is alive and well and he is God. People don't forget that Battlestar is his baby. What we are gifted with each week is his permission to vary from the origional concepts of the first series. At the same time it's like watching a parallel universe. He got us all. Ron and David cannot do what they want with the series just yet. They have to ask God if this or that is o.k.  Leoben is John the Angel so to speak. Don't worry, Kara is all right. Remember on New Caprica when Leoben was looking for Kara when the Cylons invaded? He specifically asked Anders "Where is Kara Thrace, is she here?" Anders was too messed up to respond but that was John trying to find her. John/Leoben is one of the beings of light. Perhaps they used the Cylons just the same way. I was thinking that the final five D'Anna saw were the beings of light.Of couse she would conclude that they were Cylons. What would the Cheif or any human  have seen if they'd been the one in the circle instead?  They were supposed to be considered like angels according to Adama(Lorne Green). They only wanted to make the playing field fair as in countering Count Iblis who we have yet to see in this reality. John/Leoben has probably taken Kara to Earth/Terra to keep them from destroying themselves so the survivors may have a choice about where to live. She might even be a guy there. Remember that we saw Apollo as Apollo but the people saw him as someone else. Kara will be back because she'll just raise hell wherever she goes and they'll kick her back to the Galactica family(with/without a memory or a set of coordinates). As for other parallels. Apollo being happily married is not something to be surprised about. The only reason Serina died is because Jane Seymore wanted off the series(i.e.remember Billy). If she had stayed she'd have been a great stable wife. I think Chief Tyroll is a counterpart to Jolly. I mean really how many fat pilots are out there. Putting him in charge of the deck would be a better way to go. Anders is Starbucks Cassiopea. A proffessional in one degree but always supportive, loving and loyal. Dee started out as Rigel but became Serina. Now it seems Helo is Rigel and Geata has become more like Omega. Hotdog is Bojay and Kat was Sheba etc...Everyone, use your minds and try to think like the creators old and new. Before we all jump to conclusions just remember God is watching and listening.

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  • Avatar of chalkitdown

    chalkitdown

    [86]Mar 5, 2007
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    I want what he/she's having^^^
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  • Avatar of Chainblast

    Chainblast

    [87]Mar 5, 2007
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    Makes one wonder if Batlar isn't connected to the final five in some way since he too has seen the opera house that the final five appear in. Considerinf he's on trial, I's say Baltar is either the one to die this season or he is the Cylon. Any other way out of his situation seems a bit...lame, don't you think?
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  • Avatar of ElleBow

    ElleBow

    [88]Mar 5, 2007
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    I'm sorry, but I can't honestly believe that they would kill off Starbuck, not after building her up so much, giving her this "destiny" and then giving her such a crappy, un-Starbuck like ending. Until its' officially stated, I'm goign to say this is just a starting of another twist.

    I still don't believe she's a cylon though.
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  • Avatar of cardcounter31

    cardcounter31

    [89]Mar 5, 2007
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    I can't see them kicking out Kara for good, and since it is obvious she is "dead", she will be back say halfway through next season or at the end of it.

    I remember someone saying they think tigh will find out he is a cylon and i could see that as a possibility.
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  • Avatar of ProDelgado

    ProDelgado

    [90]Mar 5, 2007
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    Isn't this linked into the rumours that Sackhoff has asked for a massive pay rise for this season, which the producers didn't want to give her?
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  • Avatar of trip31

    trip31

    [91]Mar 5, 2007
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    AthenaAurora wrote:
    I feel soooo stupid ! I finally get it now! Glen A Larson is alive and well and he is God. People don't forget that Battlestar is his baby. What we are gifted with each week is his permission to vary from the origional concepts of the first series.

    What a load!!!!! Glan Larson as far as I know has SFA to do with the new battlestar, RDM gave him a consultant title out of respect for his source material. Apart from the miniseries having parallels to his pilot, little baring the characters is similar. Which is why so many original fan boys are always (stupidly) baging the new show

    :
    I can't see them kicking out Kara for good, and since it is obvious she is "dead", she will be back say halfway through next season or at the end of it.

    I remember someone saying they think tigh will find out he is a cylon and i could see that as a possibility.

    The way sackhoff's mouthing off at the moment they won't want her back, the producers will just be told to introduce another pilot (seelix?) to cover starbucks position and do some plot workarounds

    I'd say Tigh was a cylon if he hadn't arranged the killing of so many of them and been tortured by them! And if tigh's a cylon it's a pretty freak'n screwed up model

    Edited on 03/05/2007 5:31pm
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  • Avatar of jcastro20111

    jcastro20111

    [92]Mar 5, 2007
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    In the original series, starbuck disapeared for a while, and was brought back on ship of lights.  I am sure similar thing will happen, either Kara is one of the final five, or her destiny is tied up with them somehow. 
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  • Avatar of pabycrof

    pabycrof

    [93]Mar 5, 2007
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    I'm assuming that if we've seen Starbuck dead in this episode and Sackhoff's name has been removed from the main cast, then it is possible that her fate is the subject of the season 3 cliffhanger, albeit as a special guest star. Consider that they might have filmed this scene before Sackhoff finished her filming for the season.

    That really didn't make sense, but anyway.
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  • Avatar of ttoupal

    ttoupal

    [94]Mar 5, 2007
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    Starbuck has died; but, has she?

    I believe she is on the fabled "ship of light".  As everone know from the original series, there is a ship of light that can capture the viper pilots and enlighten them on their existence.  I believe that the ship of light is Kara's fate.  She has unusual power of forsight that have drawn the ship of light to her.

    Baltar is most likely the Cylon.  I have suspected this from the first episode where number 6 had first occupied his mind. 

    This leaves the first person to reach earth to Apollo.

    Just guessing but my guesses have been pretty good so far, largely because they use the original series as the basis for plot lines.  For example, I guessed about the Pegasus well before she appeared.  There is also another original episode where starbuck gets stranded on a planet, finds cylon parts and puts one together for a servant.  Well anyway, I digress.  What about the boy genius that I believe the ship of light delivers to the Galactica to find the way to earth.

    Well, I wanted to conclude by saying that the new series does not appear to re-writing the history of the galactica but rather compliment the original series.

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  • Avatar of webe123

    webe123

    [95]Mar 5, 2007
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    WellI was a fan of both the series, but I think they cut their own throat with this series, if they make starbuck permanently "dead"!

    It is kinda crazy to think they will be able to survive attacks from the cylons without starbuck helping them fend off those attacks. Even though battlestar has good pilots...starbuck was supposed to be the best.But then again, new series do stupid things like killing off main characters all the time! Just look at the main characters that have died on LOST and SMALLVILLE and you will see what I mean.

    Killing off main characters usually cost the networks viewers! Why? Because they have loyal fansof those actors...when you kill them off...there is no more reason for those people to watch that show.  Mabye starbuck is not dead, but if they end up  pissing off enough viewers, it can kill a series before they somehow make it right. Mabye producers and writers should think about that before they go off with a half cocked idea and then say "gotcha"!

    It may be the viewers turning off the show and then the "GOTCHA" will be on the writers and producers that were trying to be coy, but only were acting stupid!  

    Edited on 03/05/2007 8:21pm
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  • Avatar of oldsage

    oldsage

    [96]Mar 5, 2007
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    How can anyone possibly believe that Kara is really dead? Did you watch the episode? Did you actually listen to the dialogue? To paraphrase... "sure Starbuck, you have a great destiny ahead of you, you're part of the big plan.. oh, and by the way, you're fulfilling your great destiny in the next 10 minutes.... SURPRISE!!!!! BOOM!!!" I was almost convinced that she was going to be one of the five, until the Leoben vision confessed that he was not, in fact, Leoben. Great episode... Adama's reaction at the end was great...
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  • Avatar of oldsage

    oldsage

    [97]Mar 5, 2007
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    ttoupal wrote:

    Starbuck has died; but, has she?

    I believe she is on the fabled "ship of light".  As everone know from the original series, there is a ship of light that can capture the viper pilots and enlighten them on their existence.  I believe that the ship of light is Kara's fate.  She has unusual power of forsight that have drawn the ship of light to her.

    This is interesting.. in spite of the variations from the original series, the writers have adapted quite a few of the general plot ideas (such as Battlestar Pegasus). I am curious whether they would actually try to adapt the ship of light. I also hope they find a friendly planet full of intelligent life.. the Battlestar is in desperate need of a good detailing... but I digress...

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  • Avatar of webe123

    webe123

    [98]Mar 5, 2007
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    oldsage wrote:
    How can anyone possibly believe that Kara is really dead? Did you watch the episode? Did you actually listen to the dialogue? To paraphrase... "sure Starbuck, you have a great destiny ahead of you, you're part of the big plan.. oh, and by the way, you're fulfilling your great destiny in the next 10 minutes.... SURPRISE!!!!! BOOM!!!" I was almost convinced that she was going to be one of the five, until the Leoben vision confessed that he was not, in fact, Leoben. Great episode... Adama's reaction at the end was great...

    I DID watch the show,  just like you did, but it IS possible that there is some other way to fufill her destiny! Get off your high horse of thinking you are right and think! They do NOT have to bring her back to explain what destiny she had!

    But you are so stuck believing that she is comming back, it is not even funny. I am not saying that they wrote her out of the show for sure, but if they did,  it was a stupid move on their part!

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  • Avatar of trip31

    trip31

    [99]Mar 5, 2007
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    I can't see them bringing in the ship of lights, it's a pure fantasy element and would detract from the drama of the series. If it happens the show might as some put it time after time after time "jump the shark"
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  • Avatar of whalenapp81

    whalenapp81

    [100]Mar 5, 2007
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    u know what would be the true twist, is when baltar goes on trial and gets executed, cause u know they will eventually shove him out the airlock, he will wakeup in a resurrection tank and he will see starbuck looking down at him and thats how the season will end, that would blow my mind
    Edited on 03/06/2007 12:06am
    Edited 2 total times.
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