Battlestar Galactica Forums

Syfy (ended 2010)

Discussion - "The Woman King" (2/11/07 episode) (spoilers)

  • Avatar of FrakkingFrakker

    FrakkingFrakker

    [61]Feb 13, 2007
    • member since: 01/22/06
    • level: 28
    • rank: Disco Stu
    • posts: 319

    greenbat22 wrote:
    In the extended scene, after Helo said he did it, Adama asked him if he really wanted to continue and go on record. Bill made sure to coolly mention that the process would include recording, an arrest, and likely a firing squad. Helo said "no" and Adama coolly dismissed him.

    I just love what this says about Adama!

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of gabfan31

    gabfan31

    [62]Feb 13, 2007
    • member since: 11/09/06
    • level: 100
    • rank: Master of the Universe
    • posts: 1,218
    They were right not to include this. They need to stop looking the other way for disciplinary breaches, but no one (or very few, anyways) wants to see Helo get the firing squad for his actions. Wipe the slate clean, and start from scratch here. Don't go after the former misdemeanors, but don't allow any more.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of 123home123

    123home123

    [63]Feb 13, 2007
    • member since: 05/24/02
    • level: 55
    • rank: Bounty Dog
    • posts: 11,760
    In the bonus scene, after Helo said that he didn't want to go forward with his statement when Adama said that he could face a firing squad, Helo then saluted Adama. I think Adama saluted Helo in return.

    I thought it was interesting because it would have followed Adama's apology to Helo. Adama realized that he owed Helo for uncovering Dr. Robert's crimes. By letting Helo retract his admission, he was doing a favor for Helo, making them even. This is in addition to the general concerns about not having enough military personnel.

    Adama understood that Helo was a necessary member of the military leadership. Though he can sometimes get out of control, at other times he can save innocent lives. Adama probably mulled all of this over at the end of the "A Measure of Salvation" episode. That's why he closed the investigation into the murder of the Cylon prisoners, even though he already knew the culprit was either Helo or Athena.
    Edited on 02/13/2007 3:04pm
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of MichaudMR

    MichaudMR

    [64]Feb 13, 2007
    • member since: 03/22/06
    • level: 17
    • rank: The Crazy Neighbor
    • posts: 429

    Sometimes the greatest wisdom is knowing what to "see" and what not to. This is why Bill Adama has the Admirals rank on his collar and Saul Tigh never will.  One thing though; a flag officer would (should?) never "trade favors" with a subordinate like that.  It would  be disastrous to his authority to be beholding to a subordinate. 

    However, the truly great leaders can acknowledge their own shortcomings and those of others in ways that reinforce the bonds formed within the command structure.  "hey, we all make mistakes, but if we work together under my leadership, we'll more than make up for our individual weaknesses, and take full advantage of our common strengths."  The short version is; "we've got each others backs." 

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of 123home123

    123home123

    [65]Feb 13, 2007
    • member since: 05/24/02
    • level: 55
    • rank: Bounty Dog
    • posts: 11,760
    Just a couple observations about the cast: The regular Baltar didn't appear at all in the episode. James Callis only appeared as the imaginary Baltar in Caprica Six's head.

    And Racetrack had a few more lines than usual. She appeared early in the episode when she said she had a date, and she also appeared later on when everyone was playing Pyramid X at Joe's Bar. Connor called her "Marge". (Her full name is Margaret Edmondson.) That's the first time anyone has called her Marge. I think it's also the first time anyone has referred to her by any name other than "Racetrack".

    Dee finally decided to join in the fun and go to Joe's Bar with Lee. Good to see her in better spirits, though she had a narrow escape at the end.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of FrakkingFrakker

    FrakkingFrakker

    [66]Feb 13, 2007
    • member since: 01/22/06
    • level: 28
    • rank: Disco Stu
    • posts: 319

    123home123 wrote:
     Dee finally decided to join in the fun and go to Joe's Bar with Lee.

    Dee had joined him at Joe's in Taking a Break... at the end of that episode. She'd been there before. Whether she was in good spirits then or not, I don't know. But she had been there before. 

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of AthenaAurora

    AthenaAurora

    [67]Feb 13, 2007
    • member since: 12/22/06
    • level: 1
    • rank: Weatherman
    • posts: 49
    I enjoyed this episode a lot. It put more focus on the secondary characters. Ironic how Sharon was *itching about the Sagitarans and feeling comfortable knowing another race was hated more than hers. I kind of wished she could have shown a little more support of her husbands feelings over this however she did tell 6 that the way to humanity is to be self centered. Funny. It was fun to see Lee and the crew having some fun. It was really refreshing to see Dee smiling and laughing for a change. I think they need to get Anders quartered up with Kara so she can have her man at her side to cheer her up as well. As for Dee not liking Cottle, I know he treated her a couple of times from previous seasons. Perhaps when the order was given to preserve all life and Adama was looking at Dee and Billy to "multiply" maybe Cottle was doing OBGYN's to find out who was fertile. Ha, ha, ha now that would creep out any female. I do notice one thing about the show that kind of bothers me. Except for Dee and Cally here and there, there are really no women that kind of hang together and girl talk like best friends or something. Dee is truly feminine, Starbuck uses her feminity to bed guys and Cally just reminds me of Olive Oil. Love the show! 
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of 123home123

    123home123

    [68]Feb 13, 2007
    • member since: 05/24/02
    • level: 55
    • rank: Bounty Dog
    • posts: 11,760
    FrakkingFrakker wrote:

    123home123 wrote:
    Dee finally decided to join in the fun and go to Joe's Bar with Lee.

    Dee had joined him at Joe's in Taking a Break... at the end of that episode. She'd been there before. Whether she was in good spirits then or not, I don't know. But she had been there before.


    That's right. When she and Lee were having dinner. But she didn't look too happy at that point.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of 123home123

    123home123

    [69]Feb 13, 2007
    • member since: 05/24/02
    • level: 55
    • rank: Bounty Dog
    • posts: 11,760
    AthenaAurora wrote:
    I kind of wished she could have shown a little more support of her husbands feelings over this however she did tell 6 that the way to humanity is to be self centered.

    Actually the imaginary Baltar said the trick to being human was to think only about yourself, not Athena.

    AthenaAurora wrote:
    I do notice one thing about the show that kind of bothers me. Except for Dee and Cally here and there, there are really no women that kind of hang together and girl talk like best friends or something. Dee is truly feminine, Starbuck uses her feminity to bed guys and Cally just reminds me of Olive Oil. Love the show!

    Boomer and Starbuck used to be friends in Season 1, but then Boomer had to go and shoot Adama.

    I read some complaints once that all the women on the show were portrayed as bad influences on the men (Number Six and Baltar, Ellen Tigh and Saul Tigh). I didn't agree with that because there were examples of women who have positive influences on the men in their lives (Dee and Lee, Cally and Chief Tyrol, Athena and Helo). You might even add Roslin and Adama to that list. (You might have noticed Adama hanging out in Roslin's bedroom in a recent episode while she was lying down on her bed.)

    And now we see the return of the "imaginary" Baltar as a demonic influence on Caprica Six, so the tables are turned.
    Edited on 02/13/2007 8:46pm
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Chainblast

    Chainblast

    [71]Feb 13, 2007
    • member since: 09/13/04
    • level: 6
    • rank: Small Wonder
    • posts: 149
    My only gripe with the episode is why Gaeta is sitting in the bar boozing it up after stabbing Baltar in the neck with a pen. I assume could be a fair explanation to it, but I think it's something we should know. Of course, I doubt Adama or Roslyn care. Great ep none the less.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of copygeek

    copygeek

    [72]Feb 14, 2007
    • member since: 10/04/06
    • level: 13
    • rank: Regal Beagle
    • posts: 527

    123home123 wrote:
    I read some complaints once that all the women on the show were portrayed as bad influences on the men (Number Six and Baltar, Ellen Tigh and Saul Tigh). I didn't agree with that because there were examples of women who have positive influences on the men in their lives (Dee and Lee, Cally and Chief Tyrol, Athena and Helo). You might even add Roslin and Adama to that list. (You might have noticed Adama hanging out in Roslin's bedroom in a recent episode while she was lying down on her bed.)

    I thought Laura was lying down on the couch in Adama's office, unless you are talking about another episode that I don't remember. I don't remember ever seeing Adama in Roslin's bedroom.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of 123home123

    123home123

    [73]Feb 14, 2007
    • member since: 05/24/02
    • level: 55
    • rank: Bounty Dog
    • posts: 11,760
    Oh, I guess it could have been Adama's office. But they did seem awfully intimate in that scene.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Sarp87

    Sarp87

    [74]Feb 14, 2007
    • member since: 02/07/07
    • level: 2
    • rank: Sweat Hog
    • posts: 12
    123home123 wrote:
    Oh, I guess it could have been Adama's office. But they did seem awfully intimate in that scene.


    Well there is definetely something going on between Adama and Roslin, I kind a remember Adama kissing Roslin, I think it was in New Caprica.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of gabfan31

    gabfan31

    [75]Feb 14, 2007
    • member since: 11/09/06
    • level: 100
    • rank: Master of the Universe
    • posts: 1,218
    I don't remember any romantic kissing, if there was any at all. But even if there was, that was when Roslin was nothing but a school teacher. Now that she's back as president she's got to be more careful about entering into any relationship. I know she was having an affair with Caprica's president way back when, but with Adama and her being the two most powerful people, it would be a major ethical problem for some people if they were to become personally involved. But I did like the glimpses they showed of "what might have been, but for the war". I think it's best to leave it as a wistful undertone, at least for now. 
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of copygeek

    copygeek

    [76]Feb 14, 2007
    • member since: 10/04/06
    • level: 13
    • rank: Regal Beagle
    • posts: 527

    Sarp87 wrote:
    123home123 wrote:
    Oh, I guess it could have been Adama's office. But they did seem awfully intimate in that scene.


    Well there is definetely something going on between Adama and Roslin, I kind a remember Adama kissing Roslin, I think it was in New Caprica.

    They didn't kiss to my knowledge, either. However, they DID share a "cigarette" of indeterminate substances while they were lying on the ground together and Roslin was talking about what sort of house she planned to build on New Caprica. That definitely LOOKED like an intimate (sexual) moment, with them on their backs (granted, with full clothing on) and sharing a smoke. I never was sure what that scene was supposed to be implying, however, since you could take it to a variety of levels, depending on your attitudes about the two of them.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of chart3

    chart3

    [77]Feb 14, 2007
    • member since: 06/02/05
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 36
    Can someone please explain to me why this episode is called "The Woman King"?
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of gabfan31

    gabfan31

    [78]Feb 14, 2007
    • member since: 11/09/06
    • level: 100
    • rank: Master of the Universe
    • posts: 1,218
    The woman's name was King.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of 123home123

    123home123

    [79]Feb 14, 2007
    • member since: 05/24/02
    • level: 55
    • rank: Bounty Dog
    • posts: 11,760
    Correct, although I also agree that the title is somewhat confusing. When I first heard the title, I thought the episode would have something to do with a "royal personage" or long-lost woman leader. They could have picked a better title, one that fits the actual plot. But I can live with it.

    Better to have a good episode and a strange title than a good title and a strange episode.

    (That kind of reminds me of all the New Wave bands in the 80s where the groups seemed to spend more time trying to figure out a clever name for the band than learning how to play their instruments and writing good songs.)
    Edited on 02/14/2007 5:59pm
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of chart3

    chart3

    [80]Feb 14, 2007
    • member since: 06/02/05
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 36

    gabfan31 wrote:
    The woman's name was King.

      terrible, terrible title.  they could have come up with something better than that, especially since the plot really revolved around Helo's persistence, and the scenes involving Mrs. King weren't very dramatic or compelling. 

    Edited on 02/14/2007 9:30pm
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.