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Matching what was foretold with what has happened...

  • Avatar of BlaqChaos

    BlaqChaos

    [1]Jun 18, 2008
    • member since: 04/26/05
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    THE FIRST HYBRID (GUARDIAN HYBRID) TOLD KENDRA SHAW:

    "At last, they've come for me. I feel their lives, their destinies spilling out before me. The denial of the one true path, played out on a world not their own, will end soon enough. Soon there will be four, glorious in awakening, struggling with the knowledge of their true selves. The pain of revelation bringing new clarity and in the midst of confusion, he will find her. Enemies brought together by impossible longing. Enemies now joined as one. The way forward at once unthinkable, yet inevitable. And the fifth, still in shadow, will claw toward the light, hungering for redemption that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering. I can see them all. The seven, now six, self-described machines who believe themselves without sin. But in time, it is sin that will consume them. They will know enmity, bitterness, the wrenching agony of one splintering into many. And then, they will join the promised land, gathered on the wings of an angel. Not an end, but a beginning.
    ~~~
    Kara Thrace will lead the human race to its end. She is the herald of the apocalypse, the harbinger of death. They must not follow her.
    ~~~
    As my own existence comes to a close, only to begin anew, in ways uncertain.
    ~~~
    All this has happened before, and it will happen again...again...again...again...again...again...again..."

    I think that his words now merit a detailed breakdown, to 1) see if we can match what he foretold with what happened, and 2) to glean hints about what will happen next.

    At last, they've come for me.

    They're finally gotten within range of the first hybrid's forces, and are moving in for the kill.

    I feel their lives, their destinies spilling out before me.

    Like all hybrids, he can "see" the truths of the past and future.

    The denial of the one true path, played out on a world not their own, will end soon enough.

    Ah, now here's a key part. One can assume that by "a world not their own", the hybrid was refering to the planet they are currently on. It can be taken as both ways as to whether or not this planet is Earth.

    Where he says "the denial of the one true path" is important because of two elements: the denial, and the one true path. The one true path part seems to indicate that they will turn away from the path they'[re supposed to be on. This could mean that the final five will ally with the humans, or that everyone will turn their backs on Earth in preference for something else.

    Soon there will be four, glorious in awakening, struggling with the knowledge of their true selves.

    This part has played out already. Four of the final five discovered who they were and dealth with it.

    The pain of revelation bringing new clarity and in the midst of confusion, he will find her.

    This is anyone's guess. Yes, the "revelation" part seems to imply the revelation of four of the five; what is the clarity amid confusion, and who is "her"? I'm not sure about the "new clarity ~ mist of confusion" part, but I do believe that it is critical that we find out who is the "he" and the "she" he will find. What's worst is that the way "her" is used, it could refer to a person (human or cylon) or a place (like the Earth itself).

    Enemies brought together by impossible longing. Enemies now joined as one.

    This has now happened as well. Both sides wanted to get to Earth bad enough to put aside their differences to get to it.

    The way forward at once unthinkable, yet inevitable.

    This one's a little too cryptic for me. Maybe refering to the fact that one time, the thought of going to Earth together was unthinkable, yet it was the way humans and cylons were destined to go to Earth.

    And the fifth, still in shadow, will claw toward the light, hungering for redemption that will only come in the howl of terrible suffering.

    This one has multiple parts that will need to be broken down.

    For starters, the fifth is in shadow (whether literal or figurative) and is hungering for redemption. Baltar is an obvious choice for hundering for redemption, but perhaps there are others as well (I just can't think of any).

    The hybrid goes on to say that redemption will come for the last of the final five, but only in the "howl of terrible suffering".

    But whoever the final cylon is, they are in the dark and are clawing towards the light.

    I can see them all.

    The hybrid can now see all 12 models of the cylons.

    The seven, now six, self-described machines who believe themselves without sin.

    Another statement with multiple parts to be dissected. The "seven, now six" is obviously a reference to the known cylon models, and Deanna being boxed up.

    I find it interesting that he refers to them as self-described machines, as if they could possibly something else. Does the hybrid not consider them machines, or do they have an unknown origin that lacks machinical origin.

    But a more important part is that he says that they believe themselves to be without sin. So that implies that someone believes that the cylons have sinned, and/or continue to do so. But who or what would care to judge their sin?

    But in time, it is sin that will consume them.

    So, their "sin" will be their downfall.

    They will know enmity, bitterness, the wrenching agony of one splintering into many.

    I think this is a reference to the civil war.

    And then, they will join the promised land, gathered on the wings of an angel.

    I would state that this is another reference to the cylon forces joining the human forces, but what the heck is this "wings of an angel" nonsense? I assume that the hybrid didn't mean they would literally join on the wings of an angel, but a figurative. SO who or what would that be? Starbuck? Galactica itself?

    It's odd that they were stated to join the "promised land" instead of the promised people. Like they were going to side with a certain location, not a certain people.

    Not an end, but a beginning.

    All of this has happened before, and all of this shall happen again. The next cycle is about to begin.

    Kara Thrace will lead the human race to its end. She is the herald of the apocalypse, the harbinger of death. They must not follow her.

    Well, I think that makes it clear that Starbuck isn't the angel on whose wings they shall gather. But this would also have other...consequenses. They "followed" Kara to Earth. If she is the harbinger of death, her actions could result in an end to the cycle. But who would want that? What third party would make a copy of her Viper, and have Kara lead them to death? Who would even have the power to do that? Also, is she is the "herald of the apocalypse" does that mean that those who sent her are the apocalypse in carnate?

    As my own existence comes to a close, only to begin anew, in ways uncertain.

    All of this has happened before, and all of this shall happen again. It is aware of it's "larger" role in the cycle, but the minute changes that occur cycle to cycle are unknown to it.

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  • Avatar of cyclops_cylon

    cyclops_cylon

    [2]Jun 18, 2008
    • member since: 05/21/08
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    First off, I believe you made a lot of great points interpreting the original hybrids words, but there are a couple of sections which I interpret a bit differently.

    Here goes: "The denial of the one true path, played out on a world not their own, will end soon enough."

    I believe this is a reference to New Caprica. At the time the hybrid makes these statements, the Colonials had not yet discovered/reached/settled New Caprica, it certainly wasn't a part of the 'one true path' to Earth, and wasn't ever one of the Colonies, and thus was not 'their own.'

    In my opinion, the prophetic statements of the hybrid are for the most part in chronological order, starting with his discovery.

    That said, I disagree with the interpretation of this quote: "The pain of revelation bringing new clarity and in the midst of confusion, he will find her." I feel like this is pretty clearly referring to Starbuck's revelation(s) regarding the path to Earth, her visions, headaches, the extremes she was willing to go to to take those on, etc. The 'he find[ing] her,' refers to Leoben finding Starbuck and the Demetrius crew out in the middle of nowhere.

    From there the hybrid's prophecy just sounds like the uneasy alliance between the rebel cylons and the colonials. Enemies brought together, etc, the 'way forward at once unthinkable, yet inevitable,' simply referring to the fact that they will find Earth, but it wasn't until the forces were really united that they could do it, i.e., after the four of the final five were 'forgiven,' and the discovery regarding the reborn viper was made. Those two things had to happen before the next step could be taken.

    Then the bit about the seven, now six, and the splintering of the Cylon into factions, then joining up with the Colonials.

    What is still unclear to me about the statements directly pertaining to Kara, is who the Hybrid is talking about, exactly. He says that, "Kara Thrace will lead the human race to its end. She is the herald of the apocalypse, the harbinger of death. They must not follow her." She will lead the human race to their end, but does that mean a home? or the race's ultimate extinction? I tend to think it just means a home. Herald of the apocalypse? Well, apocalypse has several different meanings, including the a terrible event leading to the ultimate triumph of good over evil, or another definition is 'any universal widespread destruction.'

    And finally, who the hybrid is refering to with 'they.' The 'they,' that must not follow her may be the cylon rebels. She may be the herald of their apocalypse.

    Edited on 06/18/2008 8:27am
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  • Avatar of HeHateMe5

    HeHateMe5

    [3]Jun 18, 2008
    • member since: 04/12/08
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    everything seems to be in a chronological time frame. So with that, the fifth isn't either activated or seen. I believe before the seven now six, meaning the boxing of D'anna, we would be introduced to the final cylon.

    I would say it would be the episodes after Leoben found Kara in The road less traveled and The Hub where they join forces. So... if this truly is a chronological sequence, then it stands to reason that the Fifth is either Gaeta or Romo Lampkin, and neither are in the photo and neither are major characters, and either one of them goes through their own suffering. what do you think?

    one last thing, Romo Lampkin technically isnt in the military fleet if that is what D'anna implied. Think about it, a play on words in not the civilian fleet but getting everyone to think the military fleet.

    Edited on 06/18/2008 10:30am
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  • Avatar of HeHateMe5

    HeHateMe5

    [4]Jun 18, 2008
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    In the next preview you see Tigh holding a gun to someone with their back turned. It does look like Adm. Adama's hair and possibly Romo Lampkins, hard to say.
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  • Avatar of oddbodd72

    oddbodd72

    [5]Jun 18, 2008
    • member since: 09/30/06
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    Just a little section which stands out to me as relatively obvious in meaning:

    BlaqChaos wrote:

    "Soon there will be four, glorious in awakening, struggling with the knowledge of their true selves. The pain of revelation bringing new clarity and in the midst of confusion, he will find her. Enemies brought together by impossible longing. Enemies now joined as one. The way forward at once unthinkable, yet inevitable."

    It seems to me that this section refers entirely to Saul Tigh and Caprica 6, his discovery of his nature, their relationship, conversion from implacable enemies to lovers/partners/parents.

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  • Avatar of krinks

    krinks

    [6]Jun 30, 2008
    • member since: 10/17/06
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    One thing to keep in mind is that Razor is out of order. The final five had not yet been activated, and D'Anna had not been boxed at the time the movie takes place. In fact, D'Anna and Six hadn't even started the pace movement on New Caprica yet. Chronologically, the next episode after the movie is "Downloaded," where we see the birth of the new Cylon thinking... which is interesting timing when you think about it...
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