Battlestar Galactica Forums

Syfy (ended 2010)

The 2 most used endings for any given series.

  • Avatar of hevo4ever

    hevo4ever

    [1]Mar 22, 2009
    • member since: 11/16/06
    • level: 5
    • rank: Caveman Lawyer
    • posts: 8

    When I see a series that end using the following. I know the writters did not work hard.

    1 - Divine Intervention
    2 - Time travel (Techno blabla ending)

    Cant they come with something more original than that?

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Kondix

    Kondix

    [2]Mar 22, 2009
    • member since: 03/22/07
    • level: 11
    • rank: Red Shirted Lt.
    • posts: 245
    What we had here was only divine motivation... not intervention, the people of galactica and the cylons simply made their one choices, which lead to the final... no divine entity made those choices for them
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of guidryp

    guidryp

    [3]Mar 22, 2009
    • member since: 08/23/05
    • level: 8
    • rank: Super-Friend
    • posts: 177
    What do you mean no intervention? Visions in everyones head from "God" guiding them. Starbuck (another of "Gods" angels) puts in the coordinates she was programmed with to jump to New Earth. The missile launch from the raptor that nuked the Cylon Colony was a clear "act of god".

    There is practically no free will, all the strings are being pulled by "God".
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of my1sunshine

    my1sunshine

    [4]Mar 22, 2009
    • member since: 09/15/07
    • level: 12
    • rank: Evil Bert
    • posts: 349

    You know.. I couldn't wait to see the finale, and get on this board and have fun discussing the different opinions with people of varied viewpoints who either liked or didn't like it. Instead, the majority of what I see here are a plethora of posters who either have not come here in a while, or I've never seen before to overwhelm the site with bullying negativity. There are SEVERAL threads on this board geared toward negative views, and the same people are coming to the more positive threads to spread their dislike.. most of them repeating and repeating the same views, as if we didn't get it the first ten times already.

    I'm not specificly speaking of this poster, but this has to be the fourth negative thread on this board. Why do we need four? And why do the negative people feel the need to beat back those who try to explain WHY the finale, in their opinion, was good. I've tried to have constructive discussions with opposing viewers, but to no avail. I'd like some listening and responding.

    But the answer is always the same. " No, you're wrong, I'm right. it sucks because it was God who did it". Pounding and pounding that viewpoint ad infinitum.

    I think we get it already.

    I'm sorry, but I couldn't wait to spend the weekend here. I thought this would be the most fun I've ever had on this place. Insead it's a sea of negativity trying to outdo people's fun and enjoyment.

    None of it promotes the constructive discussions that used to appear on this forum. If it was occuring on one or two threads, fine. But it's on four or more.

    Now I couldn't wish to be farther away from this board.

    How dissapointing.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Ionic_basic

    Ionic_basic

    [5]Mar 23, 2009
    • member since: 03/20/03
    • level: 5
    • rank: Caveman Lawyer
    • posts: 41
    my1sunshine- Amen Brother!!
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Omnia87

    Omnia87

    [6]Mar 23, 2009
    • member since: 03/22/09
    • level: 2
    • rank: Sweat Hog
    • posts: 24
    This is becoming rediculous. Threads being closed, and now this 'moral brigade' is making a sweep through the forum. It sounds a little bit like people want to stay in their 'happy place' and are now taking all measures to safeguard that.

    First of all, some points I'd like to make about 123home123's behavior. What I find unacceptable is to label the people who didn't like the finale as being non-fans. I'm a great fan of BSG and in my mind things were going great up until the finale. The fact that you DID like the finale doesn't make you more of a fan than me, so please don't be so arrogant. Second, I hear a lot of people say that we (the complainers) are telling those that liked the finale that they're ignorant or what not. Perhaps you could interpret it like that, but I know the other side doing exactly the same. Suddenly people start to come up with this stuff about 'art not needing to be spoonfed to you', implying that there is some sort of satisfying reasoning behind the events in the finale, but that if you don't find them satisfying enough, you must've misunderstood. There's this romantization going on of the NOT KNOWING, it being some sort of incredible way to make everything work out for everyone. Now I'd just like people to explain to me what God's plan was that needed such maticulous planning in so many details, that couldn't have been brought about in any other way. Some of you happy folks seem to be able to 'read between the lines' as it were, and know the true intent of the writers without being 'spoonfed', so please ENDULGE ME!!
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of hevo4ever

    hevo4ever

    [7]Mar 23, 2009
    • member since: 11/16/06
    • level: 5
    • rank: Caveman Lawyer
    • posts: 8

    Now i can understand why they use the "Divine intervention" on most of the AMERICAN tv series.

    In the case of BSG, my guess is ratings. First they get to keep the Hard core scifi fans, they got in the 2 first seasons, and then they get to hook religious people to watch the show as a religious statement.

    I bet they will try the same with Caprica.

    We are suckers.. So say we all!

    So say we all!

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of brain05

    brain05

    [8]Mar 23, 2009
    • member since: 05/01/07
    • level: 15
    • rank: Ginsu Knife
    • posts: 984
    hevo4ever wrote:

    Now i can understand why they use the "Divine intervention" on most of the AMERICAN tv series.

    In the case of BSG, my guess is ratings. First they get to keep the Hard core scifi fans, they got in the 2 first seasons, and then they get to hook religious people to watch the show as a religious statement.

    I bet they will try the same with Caprica.

    We are suckers.. So say we all!

    So say we all!



    Divine intervention on most American tv series? I personally don't know of any other prominent American tv shows that have religion in it. Maybe you could elaborate on your insinuation.

    Just for the record, I love this show and it's one of my all time favorites. I do have mixed feelings on the finale. I thought it hit all the right emotional notes and served the characters well, but I also agree with people that would have liked to have gotten more answers to certain questions. I'm mixed on my feelings but I appreciate what Ronald Moore created and this show was one hell of a frakin ride from beginning to end.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Hungry_Homer111

    Hungry_Homer111

    [9]Mar 23, 2009
    • member since: 11/22/05
    • level: 26
    • rank: Bow Flex
    • posts: 5,528
    Omnia87 wrote:
    This is becoming rediculous. Threads being closed, and now this 'moral brigade' is making a sweep through the forum. It sounds a little bit like people want to stay in their 'happy place' and are now taking all measures to safeguard that.

    First of all, some points I'd like to make about 123home123's behavior. What I find unacceptable is to label the people who didn't like the finale as being non-fans. I'm a great fan of BSG and in my mind things were going great up until the finale. The fact that you DID like the finale doesn't make you more of a fan than me, so please don't be so arrogant. Second, I hear a lot of people say that we (the complainers) are telling those that liked the finale that they're ignorant or what not. Perhaps you could interpret it like that, but I know the other side doing exactly the same. Suddenly people start to come up with this stuff about 'art not needing to be spoonfed to you', implying that there is some sort of satisfying reasoning behind the events in the finale, but that if you don't find them satisfying enough, you must've misunderstood. There's this romantization going on of the NOT KNOWING, it being some sort of incredible way to make everything work out for everyone. Now I'd just like people to explain to me what God's plan was that needed such maticulous planning in so many details, that couldn't have been brought about in any other way. Some of you happy folks seem to be able to 'read between the lines' as it were, and know the true intent of the writers without being 'spoonfed', so please ENDULGE ME!!


    First, I have to agree that people on either side of the argument for or against the other side is dumb. I mean, I can understand when, if one side gets upset over one person saying they are stupid to either like or dislike the episode, the other side gets defensive and attacks the person who attacked them (and in doing so, attacks anybody who agrees with their opinion), but still... People are entitled to their opinions either way.

    Second, about the divine intervention. At first I didn't really get it either. But I "read between the lines," and thought about some of the things that were shown, and I think I do understand it now. It isn't that God (or whatever "it" is) molded humanity all this time, through all the cycles, every step of the way. It's that they feel that humanity as a whole deserves to live on. They let each cycle develop on its own (for example, once Adama and the fleet landed on Earth, the divine intervention stopped, and it's up to Earth to stop the cycle and survive). If and when humanity reaches a point where their technological, or other advancements, overpower them and destroy them because they're not ready to be that advanced (i.e. the old saying "guns don't kill people, people kill people," but if people are at a point where they want bigger and better things to kill people with, it could become dangerous, or the technology becomes so advanced that it matches, or exceeds the intelegence of humans like the Cylons dide, etc.), that's when the divine intervention comes in, to give humanity a "second" chance to prove that they could get to a point where they can co-exist with their creations without them either being abused for the wrong reasons or for them to over-power us, or whatever.

    Of course, not everybody will like that answer, but that's just what I got from it. I personally thought that it was a great ending, but can understand why some people don't like it.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of guyroy1971

    guyroy1971

    [10]Mar 23, 2009
    • member since: 04/18/08
    • level: 12
    • rank: Evil Bert
    • posts: 87
    my1sunshine wrote:

    You know.. I couldn't wait to see the finale, and get on this board and have fun discussing the different opinions with people of varied viewpoints who either liked or didn't like it. Instead, the majority of what I see here are a plethora of posters who either have not come here in a while, or I've never seen before to overwhelm the site with bullying negativity. There are SEVERAL threads on this board geared toward negative views, and the same people are coming to the more positive threads to spread their dislike.. most of them repeating and repeating the same views, as if we didn't get it the first ten times already.

    I'm not specificly speaking of this poster, but this has to be the fourth negative thread on this board. Why do we need four? And why do the negative people feel the need to beat back those who try to explain WHY the finale, in their opinion, was good. I've tried to have constructive discussions with opposing viewers, but to no avail. I'd like some listening and responding.

    But the answer is always the same. " No, you're wrong, I'm right. it sucks because it was God who did it". Pounding and pounding that viewpoint ad infinitum.

    I think we get it already.

    I'm sorry, but I couldn't wait to spend the weekend here. I thought this would be the most fun I've ever had on this place. Insead it's a sea of negativity trying to outdo people's fun and enjoyment.

    None of it promotes the constructive discussions that used to appear on this forum. If it was occuring on one or two threads, fine. But it's on four or more.

    Now I couldn't wish to be farther away from this board.

    How dissapointing.

    Ah, I hear you, but don't let it get you down. I reviewed the episode and rated it a 10, I loved it. But try to be open minded to those who didn't. They are fans and this was the last Battlestar and they were kinda crushed. Its understandable. TV is a form or art after all. Some people look at a painting and see greatness, other see crap. Its the nature of art. Its subjective. Before Battlestar, my last favorite show was the soprano's. If you wanted to see a nuclear blast of negativity on message boards after a finale, you should have been there..lol this is a love fest compared to that..lol "fade to black THEN NOTHING!!!" lol They were practically weilding torches and pitchforks.

    Star Trek Enterprise ending? The trekkers cried! Even the actress on the show said the finale was appalling! lol They wanted an explanation to the plot and the writers were more interested in touching character moments and saying goodbye than answering the questions. That is really what it comes down to. The people who liked the finale were like me. I didn't care about the FTL drives and the opera house. I liked Baltar the conflicted guiilt ridden traitor. Kick ass Kara and Adama and Tigh and the acting was first rate for the little show on the SiFi network. For some people, it was the answers to mysteries. They are the ones dissapointed. The ending was ambiguous and the writers admitted they knew that, but that was their vision. The same people ripping up their signed Ron Moore autographs need to remember he was the one that totally remade the show into something that everyone loved and won a peabody! Critics were pleading with people to watch this show! They usually made fun of people who watch these shows..lol

    Do you know how many Trekkies and Star Wars fanatics cried for years they never got their due, it was ignored at awards time, people made fun of them for liking sci-fi...this show got kudos in spades! Women actually liked the show (once you talked them into it..lol) they loved Adama/Rosalyn's relationship, the doomed Kara/Lee relationship. Did they care about resurrection or ftl drives..frak no. This is what Eick and moore wanted, a ci-fi show that appealed to people who do not like sci-fi. The finale reflected that premise.

    Don't defend your likes and dislikes. If you want to post something positive, go ahead and do so with pride.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of my1sunshine

    my1sunshine

    [11]Mar 23, 2009
    • member since: 09/15/07
    • level: 12
    • rank: Evil Bert
    • posts: 349

    Omnia87 wrote:
    This is becoming rediculous. Threads being closed, and now this 'moral brigade' is making a sweep through the forum. It sounds a little bit like people want to stay in their 'happy place' and are now taking all measures to safeguard that. First of all, some points I'd like to make about 123home123's behavior. What I find unacceptable is to label the people who didn't like the finale as being non-fans. I'm a great fan of BSG and in my mind things were going great up until the finale. The fact that you DID like the finale doesn't make you more of a fan than me, so please don't be so arrogant. Second, I hear a lot of people say that we (the complainers) are telling those that liked the finale that they're ignorant or what not. Perhaps you could interpret it like that, but I know the other side doing exactly the same. Suddenly people start to come up with this stuff about 'art not needing to be spoonfed to you', implying that there is some sort of satisfying reasoning behind the events in the finale, but that if you don't find them satisfying enough, you must've misunderstood. There's this romantization going on of the NOT KNOWING, it being some sort of incredible way to make everything work out for everyone. Now I'd just like people to explain to me what God's plan was that needed such maticulous planning in so many details, that couldn't have been brought about in any other way. Some of you happy folks seem to be able to 'read between the lines' as it were, and know the true intent of the writers without being 'spoonfed', so please ENDULGE ME!!

    I would like to address, as a reponse, not the writers intent, or the perception of the episode, put the point of view of one person who thought hwat occurred this weekend was wrong, and why, since we've been asked.

    If anybody want's to take this as arrogant, if you want.. that's your choice.. but I'm stating here and now.. it's not that way.

    First of all, I use this quote as evidence of reasons people take offense. Multiple, attack terms like "moral brigade", "complainers", "happy folks".. all that is just name calling. I myself used words like that, such as "Negative people". Someone called me on it, and I immediately reeled back, saw it from thier side, and apologised.. even to the point of ridiculing myself. looking at this persons behavior since, taunting and instigating , and ridiculing.. I almost regret apologising, but you know what, I was doing what I was accusing others of doing, and I stand by my apologising. But namecalling is the quickest way to cause someone to take offence one way or the other.

    You seem to want to turn this into a point of who liked or disliked the episode. And that's not the point. The point is..

    It's wrong to try to bully people into not being able to enjoy liking the show!

    This weekend we had a minimum of four threads posting the same argument, over and over. Not neccesary.

    People were trying to explain why we liked the show, constantly being told they are wrong for doing so. Not neccesary.

    It's not like people who didn't like the show weren't getting the same type of response, but you didn't see four warring threads going on about the positive aspects of the finale, did you?

    I hope this isn't used as a reason to close another thread, I don't want to see that happen.

    But I almost left this thread for the first time, and I want you to understand my reasons why. Please understand my blathering on, but a question has been asked, I intend to answer it. To put it into perspective.. and I don't say this to garnish sympathy for myself, but to make a point.

    I had a very harsh weekend. My wife has been very sick, bronchial asthma. We work at a call center for AIG. You can imagine the nightmare of what we have to do. Calls have been off the chain. As sick as she was, she was coming to work everyday like a trooper when she should have been home in bed.

    The one thing, the one escape valve we were looking forward to was the finale. Fridays we get home at 11 o clock PM, only to get up at 9AM to go back the next morning. Yet we were soo looking forward to staying up late that night to watch the recorded episode. Friday night she got bad attack, and for the second time in a week, I had to rush her to the hospital. We were there all night. After catching a fewhours sleep, we woke to find someone had slashed our tire.

    After dealing with all this drama, FINALLY, I got to watch it. And I had so much fun. Yeah, it had a lot of faults, no doubt, but I had a good time. No matter what people thought about it, it brought ME a lot of joy, and it was my only ray of light during an otherwise very frustrating and stressful week.

    Afterwords, I was so pumped to get on the boards. I knew there would be a lot of negative views on the episode, and I was even looking forward to debating some of them. But I thought this would all be happening in the spirit of fun and intelligent discussions we've had here in the past.

    Instaed, I couldn't even post the viewpoints I had, without being attacked, and made to feel like I was wrong for liking it, and enjoying it, and letting it be the one bright side to my week. Not because other people felt different than I. But because the people who were mad felt they had to call us stupid, or delusional, or mindless, etc. And there was such a flood of it. Four threads, not counting the flood on the main discussion thread. A tital wave. It was like there was no where to go, I was actually seeking sanctuary.. a place of light or something.

    When I posted an answer to your thread ( which was pretty much the most intelligent thread on the board, by the way).. I gave what I thought was a halfway intelligent, and dare I say, pretty well thought out answer to one of your "Unanswered questions".. just trying to show that maybe, there was another side that you might not see. I thought, oooh, I could have fun on this thread. He must want discussion. What's the point of a list of questions without answers?

    But your response, even though done in a civilized way felt like a slap in the face.

    So I thought, okay... next.

    Then I spotted a thread that was clearly meant to be positive.

    And the complainers had to come on there too, and spoil that too.

    Don't you see? It was like, how dare we enjoy the show. WE won't let you, because WE hated it. It was, in fact, the dominant force on the forum for two whole days. It was IMPOSSIBLE to enjoy ANY aspect of the forum because it was impossible to escape the negativity.

    Say what you want about 123home123's "behavior", as you put it. But he sat back for a long while watching this go on, until he saw that posters like myself proclaiming their intention to leave. When you let stuff like that go on for too long, the moderaters will come down on the editor, and pretty soon, he loose his site. Things WERE getting out of control, and you can pretty much narrow that one down to a few trouble makers. Call it a police state, or whatever, but he did what he had to do. That's his responsibility. There's a difference between debate, and flaming.. and this was degenerating into flaming pretty quick.

    EVERYBODY has the right to voice thier opinion. NOBODY has the right to force people to want to leave because they can't enjoy themselves on their favorite forum. That's too much.

    So, right or wrong, like or dislike has nothing to do with it. It's all the way it was done, and the overwhelming intensity of it that just said, enough!

    Thank you for indulging me. I'll shut up now. Sorry for going on.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of macjay33

    macjay33

    [12]Mar 24, 2009
    • member since: 10/21/07
    • level: 9
    • rank: Door Number 2
    • posts: 92

    Some shows end as dreams or in court too! And I think those endings are probably worse.

    And even though I personally feel this show did end with a shout out to divine intervention with maybe the producers wanting you to rewatch repeats to see that intervention from it's infancy, but I think they wrote it vague enough that it could be subject to interpretation and still not be in fact from divine intervention.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of eater11

    eater11

    [13]Mar 24, 2009
    • member since: 02/11/06
    • level: 18
    • rank: Land Shark
    • posts: 521
    The ending was good, not great but most of you people who hate it obviously you missed the whole point of the show. The finale happened as the four seasons of the show allowed it to happen. On the Starbuck issue can you honestly imagine her settling down, death was her happy ending she needed to RIP after all her hardships.
    Edited on 03/24/2009 1:12am
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Xaviersx

    Xaviersx

    [14]Mar 24, 2009
    • member since: 05/25/03
    • level: 11
    • rank: Red Shirted Lt.
    • posts: 533

    No ending, episode, idea will satisfy all. We all come to a show with different viewpoints and differing expectations, and in the end, we can only get what the creative forces behind a show present. When we can make our own shows, our own visions, we can and will direct them to our satisfaction. For my opinion, I feel the series overall was excellent, but I was less than satisfied with the last few episodes inclusive of the finale. I feared the use of time travel as a device in the plot (too much Star Trek and StarGate under the viewing belt) and maybe wanted direct answers to the mystery of Kara Thrace, as well as Hera. Given that visions are not necessarily 100% true to real life, I can go with how they unfolded Hera's part in this opera of players.

    Anyway, the writers did what they felt best flowed with the clues and scripture of the re-imagined show, and did an ending better than the re-imagined Planet of the Apes, which was just a twisted ending for the sake of being different than expected, a frak with the audience. BattleStar was logical, if not satisfying, and end's the 'human' story that we followed. It's part of the plan.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of wounds

    wounds

    [15]Mar 24, 2009
    • member since: 02/28/06
    • level: 24
    • rank: Golden Girl
    • posts: 4,616
    I am an atheist. I don't believe in god or any higher power, but I like the concepts of some. I think religion is nothing else than a legalized cult (now many people will hate me).

    Anyway... I hate it when they come up with a stupid devine intervention (like a certain new movie).

    But on BSG it actually kinda works for me.

    But you also can't call it "devine intervention" since the characters are only slighly pushed into the right direction. Starbuck came back because it wasn't her time to die. If there was a god who could intervene... wouldn't he have saved Starbuck from dying to begin with?

    The nukes from the raptor... some call it devine intervention, some call it coincidence.

    And the people who say "This ending was BS!"... what would've been the "correct" ending according to you? I'll be honest... I haven't read anything about it yet, but as it normally happens people only say "This is bad" and don't state how it could be better.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Omnia87

    Omnia87

    [16]Mar 24, 2009
    • member since: 03/22/09
    • level: 2
    • rank: Sweat Hog
    • posts: 24

    To my1sunshine:

    I've just read your post and I must say I really sympathize, and it got me to think about some of the things you pointed out. I'm really sorry for you and your wife having had (or still having) a hard time. My intention was never to bully anyone or try to 'convert' people to 'the angry side'.

    When the day came to watch the finale I was both excited and emotional. I really am a big fan of the show and unlike some others around here I did feel seasons 3 and 4 had a lot of great moments. While watching the finale I wasn't that disappointed, I was actually just very sad on one hand that it was over, that Lee and Kara didn't get together after all, that Bill had to say goodbye to the two most important parts of his life. On the other hand I felt great joy over the fact that Helo and Athena were able to raise their own daughter in peace and that Six and Baltar finally got together again. I'm not insensitive to the character aspects of the show, in fact that's the most important part of it. It's why this show is different from.. say: Heroes, where people just do a lot of things in sequence, but have almost no depth of character.

    But once the episode was over I started to reflect on it, put things in perspective. And the more I did that, the more frustrated I became. I was like: "hold on a minute?". What about Kara Thrace and her special destiny? What about this God's intention into staging this entire thing? And I realised how many questions were left unanswered. I was upset because for all this time I was watching the show I felt like RDM and the other writers really had a vision of a bigger picture. Of a complex story with many intricacies. And now I feel as though we've all just been kept on a leash. BSG has in some way become just another show, that didn't distinguish itself from the rest in the sense that it also didn't have a defined exit strategy. It was written from moment to moment, episode to episode, season to season, without always having in mind what they were working toward. Some may feel that this is not true and that God was always the bigger picture, but for me that doesn't seem like a satisfying story for a writer to write. It's not a very creative way to end your story, since almost everyone can call upon a higher power to explain things.

    Anyway, I guess it took me 3 days now to be able to let go of some of that anger and frustration and see that I may have used this board to blow of too much steam. I guess a part of me was trying to find SOME meaning to the whole story and I was trying to find it here, but the answers given by others were not satisfying to me and I got more and more frustrated, because that confirmed to me even more that a large part (certainly not all) of why I thought I loved BSG was never really there.
    Now there's only Lost left and I hope it doesn't pull a hard six on me as well, otherwise I'll never watch tv shows again.

    But I'm sorry for raining on your parade man, and I hope you and your wife will find better times ahead.

    Edited on 03/24/2009 6:23am
    Edited 4 total times.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of guyroy1971

    guyroy1971

    [17]Mar 24, 2009
    • member since: 04/18/08
    • level: 12
    • rank: Evil Bert
    • posts: 87

    Everyone needs to remember that series endings are almost always controversal. The writers or producers are under alot of pressure to make a "last chapter" that everyone will love and be remembered. This sometimes causes shows to veer of into wierd finales. If some of you are over 30 (lol) you may remember St. Elsewhere. The final had the whole show in the head of an autistic boy. Magnim P.I. actually had two final episodes as a letter writing campaign brought it back from the dead (it is still considered one of the few examples where the viewers brought a show back.) The first final showed him saying goodbye as a ghost to his friends that walking into the light. The second was more a happy ending as he was finally reunited with his daughter.

    "Cheers"- considered an Ok but not great final episode. Some people were disappointed about the Seinfield finale as it didn't make alot of sense they would all go to jail. That wasn't Seinfield's point though as he wanted to bring back all the wacky characters throughout the show.

    In Sci-Fi, Star Trek TNG had a very well received finale, Voyager didn't answer anything except they got home. Enterprise..everyone hated it. People talk about Babylon 5 but I can't comment on it because I never saw it.

    I just rewatched the final on in demand after reading all the posts and I can still say it still got me in the end. It was tragic and sad and concenrated on the characters. Laura being picked up by Bill and walking to the raptor and Lee choking up was a powerful scene. Tyrol Killing over his wife's murder, Cavil walking onto Galactica Darth Vader style (some people missed that) surrounded by centurians. Laura dying and Bill's reaction was powerful stuff. Baltar breaking down at the end talking about farming. Even the little stuff like Adama making a joke about Baltar, finally signaling he was forgiven. It was really good!

    They even made a kinda joke at the complicated storyline if you remeber. When the final five joined with Anders for resurrection, Laura asked Bill what they were doing, and he started to give a complicated answer, then smiled and said "or something like that".

    So I guess what I'm trying to say is don't get caught up in the little let downs. 90% of it was really well done.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of my1sunshine

    my1sunshine

    [18]Mar 24, 2009
    • member since: 09/15/07
    • level: 12
    • rank: Evil Bert
    • posts: 349
    Omnia87 wrote:

    To my1sunshine:

    I've just read your post and I must say I really sympathize, and it got me to think about some of the things you pointed out. I'm really sorry for you and your wife having had (or still having) a hard time. My intention was never to bully anyone or try to 'convert' people to 'the angry side'.

    When the day came to watch the finale I was both excited and emotional. I really am a big fan of the show and unlike some others around here I did feel seasons 3 and 4 had a lot of great moments. While watching the finale I wasn't that disappointed, I was actually just very sad on one hand that it was over, that Lee and Kara didn't get together after all, that Bill had to say goodbye to the two most important parts of his life. On the other hand I felt great joy over the fact that Helo and Athena were able to raise their own daughter in peace and that Six and Baltar finally got together again. I'm not insensitive to the character aspects of the show, in fact that's the most important part of it. It's why this show is different from.. say: Heroes, where people just do a lot of things in sequence, but have almost no depth of character.

    But once the episode was over I started to reflect on it, put things in perspective. And the more I did that, the more frustrated I became. I was like: "hold on a minute?". What about Kara Thrace and her special destiny? What about this God's intention into staging this entire thing? And I realised how many questions were left unanswered. I was upset because for all this time I was watching the show I felt like RDM and the other writers really had a vision of a bigger picture. Of a complex story with many intricacies. And now I feel as though we've all just been kept on a leash. BSG has in some way become just another show, that didn't distinguish itself from the rest in the sense that it also didn't have a defined exit strategy. It was written from moment to moment, episode to episode, season to season, without always having in mind what they were working toward. Some may feel that this is not true and that God was always the bigger picture, but for me that doesn't seem like a satisfying story for a writer to write. It's not a very creative way to end your story, since almost everyone can call upon a higher power to explain things.

    Anyway, I guess it took me 3 days now to be able to let go of some of that anger and frustration and see that I may have used this board to blow of too much steam. I guess a part of me was trying to find SOME meaning to the whole story and I was trying to find it here, but the answers given by others were not satisfying to me and I got more and more frustrated, because that confirmed to me even more that a large part (certainly not all) of why I thought I loved BSG was never really there.
    Now there's only Lost left and I hope it doesn't pull a hard six on me as well, otherwise I'll never watch tv shows again.

    But I'm sorry for raining on your parade man, and I hope you and your wife will find better times ahead.

    Hey, thank you.. but please understand.. all of that was not directed at you, but to explain to you, since you were frustrated about events on the forum, and why.. my reason for feeling the way I did this weekend about the forum as a whole. You didn't do anything to me personally. And you were actually more civilized and intelligent than most , and I thank you for that. My wife is doing much better, and at least we have a job. A lot of people aren't so lucky.

    I'm sorry for going on, and I'm glad I didn't push the forum off topic.

    Actually, I think, upon reflection, what happened this weekend is testimony to BSG's power as a story, and to how much they feel about the characters. And I can completely understand fans feeling betrayed or hurt by the outcome, especially for a show that puts so much stock in it's realistic take on situations, no matter how fantastic the enviroment. This show has a way of drawing the viewer in, and really making one care, really care about the characters.

    The story? Well what can I say? The story has been one of the biggest rollercoaster rides I have ever taken. The quality has been outstanding, and more consistant then others. If it wasn't, people wouldn't be as upset of critical of the so called "filler" episodes, when they aired. I, myself never got down or dissapointed with those episodes. I always took it as a time to catch my breath for when the story picks up again, and it always did. Besides, real life isn't ALWAYS exciting and fast paced, so that made it more realistic.. down time, and I always thought even those episodes added more to the people in the show, anyway.

    Ron Moore has said from time to time over the course of the show, that although he had general idea of plot, he sort of WAS making things up as he went along, although because of the consistancy of the plot twists, I don't think many people belived him, or wanted to. I know I didn't want to. The writing just made it seemed like everything was meant to fit together, as part of a well concieved long standing plotline. But it wasn't and he never kept it a secret.

    So, I guess, as an aspiring writer, I was a little more sympathetic about the " easy way out" ending, where Ron was concerned. Really, exactly how do you tie up a story as complex, and twisted as BSG? I'm sure sitting here as a viewer you can say.. " Oh, well.. I'd do this, or I'd do that." . But when you're sitting in the writers chair, with millions of eyes on you, and millions of expectations riding on you, and you're responsible for fulfilling those expectations, it's not that easy.. especially with everybody, including the cast constantly saying to him.. "How the hell are you gonna end this thing?!". It's impossible in situations like that to fulfill everybody's expectations.

    But that's the job he signed up for, and he took responsibility for it. I can also understand the infamous writers block night , and that people may have thought this was the show's undoing, but I don't think so. I've been following Ron's work for a long time, starting with The Next Generation. He's written some astounding stories for different shows over the years, and this is the first time I've ever heard of him getting writers block. I give him credit for admitting it publicly.

    For a plot that twists and turns as much as this one does, it's sooo easy to have a show collapse under the weight of it's expectations.. in fact, it's almost impossible to keep it from happening ( I'm thinking X-Files) . The two best ways to avoid it are concentrating on characters, and to lean on plotlines that have been the most consistant in the show as a whole.

    One of the things I love about this show more than anything, and the thing that seperates it from so many others, is that it's the characters that drive it, not the plot . But the plot is there, and you have to deal with resolving it, which brings us to the consistancy angle. just about the only thing that has been consistnt in all of BSG's storyline IS the religious angle, which I always thought was very refreshing, because the one thing most famous Sci-fi works almost always stay away from IS religion, at leat religion that resembles our own (One true god, and so on) . So, I think he leaned on that, and prayed. Keep it simple stupid.

    In some ways, that worked perfectly, and in some ways, it didn't work at all.. particularly with Kara.. in my opinion. And I think he purposely avoided explaining the head entities directly at all. Religion is one of the most debated, heated discussions on the planet, because it's all based on faith, not the tangible. So much is unexplained and unknown. I think that lack of resolution lent itself to the spirit of that mindset, while at the same time, avaoid a lot of ranting and carrying on by different sects if there WAS a difinitive answer. Sometimes there just isn't one.

    As in life. Y'know someone mentioned the Sopranos ending, and the ensuing flack that followed. Ron Moore posted in his blog at the time how much he LOVED that ending. He thought it was brilliant. Close the door on a day in the life of Tony. The end.

    Because life doesn't tie itself up in neat little bows. Would be nice if it did. But it doesn't. Those who didn't like the BSG finale should know he actually entertained ending the show this way. OMG! Just think of what this board would have been like if THAT had happened.

    But he knew it couldn't. He would be crucified. Absolutely crucified. Long, slow, and painful in the hot sun. He'd never work again.

    Would I , as a writer, have done things differently? Sure .

    But if you asked me what I would do, and how, exactly.. in a way that makes sense to tie most of the elements of the story together to please millions and millions of high expectant fans?

    My answer would be simple. "Doh!"

    I think all things considered, he did okay. And I think, if most fans go back and watch the episodes again, they might not be so harsh in judgement.

    So, to each his own, and more power to all for their opinions.. really. We've all devoted a lot of personal time into watching this thing unfold, and we feel we deserved to be rewarded in return. But truly, Omnia87, I think, for someone who truly loved this show as much as you did until the finale... knowing what you know now, that it wasn't part of a greater plan, you might want to go back and watch it from the beginning. I think it's really sad to have the memory of something you love so much tarnished by the bad memories of the finale. Maybe, if your expectations aren't so high this time, you may feel better about it.

    And besides that, belive me, re-watching it is fun. You see so many things in a different light because of all that's been revealed, it;s like watching a whole new show. And if you do, please contribute to my re-watch thread. I have a feeling it's gonna grow in popularity as time goes on, and I'd love to read your contributions. You'd bring a lot to it, and make it a lot more interesting, and that's a high compliment

    Salute,

    Ted.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Omnia87

    Omnia87

    [19]Mar 24, 2009
    • member since: 03/22/09
    • level: 2
    • rank: Sweat Hog
    • posts: 24
    Hey Ted,

    I understand it wasn't directed at me, I just wanted you to understand why I said what I said. Also trying to get rid of some of the tension that's been hanging in the 'air' here ever since we saw the finale.

    I think it's really cool to find out you're an aspiring writer yourself, because so am I. And in that sense I can understand your point about the difficulty to end a show this complex. The only comment I can make about that is that Ron Moore was there when he wrote the story into what it was. It's not as though he just came in to a story that was already complex and he had to improvise and make something out of it. I just prefer it when writers have a vision and a meaning for the plot points they insert into their story. Of course in real life not everything is part of a bigger purpose, but in BSG a lot was implied to be as such. Not just in the show itself, but also in advertising slogans like 'you will know the truth' and stuff like 'and they have a plan'. And in my view the one 'teasing' the audience with these kinds of implications should also be responsible enough to have a 'reward' at the end of the audience's patience and loyalty. I will definitely take my time to check out your re-watch thread. I'm actually a huge 're-watcher' =P I re-watched the entire series whenever there was a hiatus between two seasons. So I'm sure there's a couple of things I can say about the joys of watching it all over again.

    But well, I would want to say a lot more at the moment but I'm living in the Netherlands and it's 0:30 right now over here. I've got an exam at 9AM so I guess I'll call it a night and come back tomorrow for some more talk. I'm actually planning on starting a new thread tomorrow, a really positive one, so be on the lookout . G'night
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of martymcflyjb

    martymcflyjb

    [20]Mar 26, 2009
    • member since: 06/17/05
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 318
    Just be glad "God" or some alien creature didn't appear to them in the finale to answer all their questions and "take Kara home" or something like that (a la Indiana Jones and the Kingdom of the Crystal Skull).
    Edited on 03/26/2009 7:10pm
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.