Beast Machines Forums

I was just curious as to where most people think Beast Machines went wrong. As in, "what made Beast Machines so horrible, such an atrocity to the Beast Wars and/or Transformers name?" Was it the writing? The pacing? Botanica? Waspinator somehow managing to return to Cybertron?

Personally, I really have no big problems with the series. It's not bad, though the writing is a little dumbed down in comparison to Beast Wars, and Optimus having his zen-like connection with all those sparks I thought was lame. Just because he's the leader doesn't mean he's the next Buddha. As I recall, he transforms back into beast mode in almost every episode because he lets his anger get the better of him.

But really, my main problem is the ridiculous designs of the main characters. The Vehicons look good, sure, but the Maximals look really dumb. Especially Rattrap. Whoever designed the new models for the characters deserves a good punch in the face. Cheetor looks surprised all the time (maybe that's just faulty animation), Blackarachnia has an awfully ugly head (and she doesn't even slightly resemble a black widow at all in beast mode! You would think maybe she would, seeing as how she's part animal/insect/whatever again), and URRRGH Rattrap. What were they thinking? I want to dropkick Rattrap off an endless bridge so I never have to see his godawfully ugly robot design again. (The beast modes of the Maximals don't bother me, just the robot modes.)

That's my peeve with Beast Machines. What's yours?

As I continued to watch Beast Machines (the entire series) after posting my first message, I must say I became more and more disappointed with the change of personalities. I think Rattrap's several betrayals were really badly done, since almost the entire series of Beast Wars was spent having Rattrap not trust Dinobot and sort of not liking Dinobot on the basis that Lizard-butt was a traitor.

Also, I hated Silverbolt's change (especially his awful [the worst of all the designs] samurai-like design). The only change in personality I could really stomach (besides Blackarachnia, who basically stayed the same except for she was a good guy instead of a traitor) was Cheetor's, who even though throughout Beast Wars followed Optimus almost blindly, in Beast Machines he matured and realized Optimus was not as perfect as he thought. It was good to watch Optimus have the problems he had, though they probably could have been better written.

Yeah... the designs on the robots sucked. Megatron as Hitler-bot sucked. The vehicons were an interesting idea, but I'd rather have seen more on the Tricapedicus council.

Optimus wasn't the hard-boiled, no-nonsense, but still caring and wise military leader he was in Beast Wars. Cheetor's changes were fine. They spent alot of time on his character growth in Beast Wars, and this was the result. Nightscream was bland. Blackarachnia was no longer the self-serving she-devil she had been on Beast Wars.

Rhinox's personality change was okay to me. As was Silverbolt's. (Silverbolt wasn't such an annoying knight in shining armour anymore!) Botanica was the most annoying character EVER. They brought back Waspinator despite his story being resolved completely. Uh... Ratrap's betrayal made no sense. It got far too caught up in itself, and lost the basic idea of 'cool robots with interesting and individual personalities fighting other cool robots with interesting and individual personalities just because they feel like it.'

Scott McNeil's lack of interest in the script REALLY shows. His acting is pretty boring. Megatron's plans make no sense, and don't really follow and pre-conceived notion he had prior to Beast Machines. (He LOVES predacons and the original Megatron. The whole idea is that he wants to live up to his predacesor. =S)

I think it's the fact the Beast Machines just flat out sucked compared to Beast Wars.

You know, I've seen a lot of reviews for this show in several different places on the web, and I've noticed that the viewers seem to be divided nicely down the middle. That is, there aren't a lot of people who're on the fence with this show in comparison to the amount of people who've made up their minds; either you loved it or you hated it. Has anyone else noticed this?

So saying (and I already know that I'm outvoted on this thread) I actually really enjoyed the show. And I'd go into a very long explanation of my views of the character developements, but I'll spare you. (Yes, I do have an argument; I just don't want to waste everyone's time. ^_^)

On the view of character designs, I think it should be mentioned that CGI is not a format that ages well. Watching the first few episodes of Beast Wars, I feel a little embarrassed because the animation is so... well... clunky. It looked great in the nineties, but after all the computer graphics discoveries made in the entertainment business, its almost laughably bad, I'm sad to say. (But its charm more than makes up for it. ^_^)
Thusly, it's also notable that the more outlandish something looks, the better it ages. The animation in Beast Machines, being so funky, actually manages to remain beautiful six years later. (You have to admit, that's a pretty long time in manner of CGI.) I'm not saying you have to love the designs just because of that; I just ask that you keep it in mind when you talk about it.

One thing that could have been used in the show, however, was humor. Admittedly, it's a dark show, more about the grittiness of war rather than the trumpets and banners, but all the more reason they could've used a little more humor. It certainly would've allowed the actors to enjoy themselves a little more, and maybe that could've eased the problem that many of you find with the acting. (I personally don't find anything wrong with it, but hey, that's just me: one of the fans who adored the show.)

So, that's my two cents. I'm just stating my opinion; please don't attack me. -ducks beneath desk-

I loved Beast Machines it was an original series in my opinion.It wasn't perfect like the designs and the story did go a little extrem but I really believe that the next step in transformers evoulation would be becoming living organsims mixed with robotic parts.

Optimus was the only character I found to be out of character.

Ratrap:He wasn't out of character in my opinion,he was still a wise cracking guy and he still put his life on the line for his friends,but he was never ever in a position like he was in BM.First he couldn't transform hard to be brave and loveable self when he can't defend himself.Second he was never the weak link of the Maximals in BW,when he transformed he didn't have any weapons and for the first time ever his team mates questioned his usefulness to the group.Rattrap felt awful and went to Megatron with intentions of taking his new battle suite and take him out to prove himself.He was never going to betray the Maximals and as the series progressed he revert back to his normal self and gained new skills.

Blackarachina:I felt didn't change that much she just became more of her Maximal personialty and less of her Predacon one.You never no how you will react to losing someone you love so her looking for Silverbolt and trying to turn him back into a Maximal wasn't out of place to me.She got him back she was dissapointed that he wasn't himself anymore and their roles reversed since BW.I believe she was just trying to save Silverbolt from his vengences or he would lose himself forever.I think she was just nicer to her team mates than she was at first because she no longer feels at odds with them being a Maximal now.

Cheetor:He went from kid in BW to a young adult in BM it his development was perfect to me.He finally saw Optimus Primal for his faults instead of the fawless hero he saw back in the BW.It was only natural he would become second-in-command as Rattrap showed no interest in leading the Maximals since the episode he was commander in BW and he couldn't transform yet.Blackaracina was a nice choice,but with her conflicting emotions with Trust she wouldn't have been good for when they faced him.Cheetor like all young adults seek to prove themselves to their father figure.So his ideas were different from Opitmus.

Nightsream:Nice guy,but he was made to clearly replace Cheetor as the kid of the group.He did have development with episodes like the Survial and Noble and Savage.He felt guilty he survived while the other Maximals and Predacons were went offline because of the viruis.

Silverbolt:His whole life was about honor and as a sick jock Megatron made him a dishonorable Vehicon and all he could did was watch as he hurt his love and friends.Not unbelieveable he would be a darker more angry character.

Botanica:She was intersting as she had a plant mode instead of a Beast mode and was a pacifist like Tigertron,but learned that she had to fight to save Cybertron.Rattrap and Botanica's relationship I thought developed nicely like how Silverbolt and Blackaracina's or Tigertron and Airrazor's.

Megatron:I thought he wasn't that out of character his goal was still conquest he just used a different method.He became a dictator who felt that if free will was gone their would be peace and seemed to give up universal conquest.By the last episode we find out it was all an act Megatron still plans on conquoring the universe he was planning on merging with Cybertron and use it as a weapon.To do that he need the planet to be all technological inorder to do that.It should have been explored more on why Megatron hates all organic life now since he generally thought his Transmetal 2 dragon beast mode gave him great power.Other than that he was still the same love able Predacon from BW.

Rhinox:I thought it was a great twist to have him actually stay a Vehicon intead of returning to the Maximals like I thought he was.Here's a guy who has been fighting in the Beast Wars and looking at Cybertrons history everytime they have peace it is destroyed because someone or group wants to take over the panet and gain power.After 5 million years the Transformers are still in the same place as ever as fake peace that will only last until the Predacons get enough power to start another war.The only way to stop that from happening would be if you take free will away from everyone.At first he didn't think so and encouraged Tankor to join the Maimals when Optimus touched his sprak.After seeing how Cybertron was actually in peace not a uneasy agreement got to him.Optimus and the other were the ones threatening that peace so of course he would start to see Megatron's ideals being more reasonable while his original ones have been failing for over millinons of years.So he choose to stay a Vehicon.He saw Megatron could never pull it of because of his problems with his Beast mode and found that organice life inspired free will which inspired chaos.Technology inspired logical thinking and in turn inspired order.He saw himself as being that person considering Optimus was for free will and that Megatron's beast mode made him chaos that would threaten the planet.In the end he found out that his way was incorrect and that peace without free will is a hollow one.

I don't see how Cybertron being organic runnied the series and contridicted anything?The Quintesson have found a organic planet and than wiped out it's organic population and recreated it into a metal planet for their factor.Beast Machines was a bit extrem,but the idea of the subject was great IMO.

Sorry for the spelling mistakes,I just didn't feel like having to check that long post.

    PLEASE DON"T SKIP JUST BECAUSE IT"S LONG!!!!!!!
    It's obvious a big problem with Beast Machines to most people were all the designs. What people don't get is that Mainframe was going in for a more stylish design on the characters. for some reason people can't admire that. But Silverbolt's design did suck and Botanica was retarded and Rattrap sucked without a weapon. Other than that, things are how they should be. Optimus Primal had a peaceful look, but he didn't look weird when he fought. Blackarachnia had an outlandish look to fit the way she moved and fought (which justifies her forehead somehow). Nightscream was just really cool looking and same for Cheetor (his sword thingies kicked ASS!). Megatron wasn't supposed to be a tough  looking bot to show that he can still be threat without being a huge monster with a full arsenal. (And I don't think anyone would have a problem with the Vehicons.)
    Another problem with many people were the character development. Sure Rattrap wasn't as "quippy" as he used to be, but he was still an insecure worry-wart and that's all he needs (And a weapon). Nightscream was perfect with character  development.  Until the Maximals found him, he was alone, scared, and wasn't sure he'd survive. That's why he would risk the whole team mission to help the lost sparks. And the team needed a kid figure. Cheetor was another perfect character. He began to see the "flaws" of Optimus because he began to contradict his moral codes he used to follow on Earth. He realized that Optimus was holding the team back, and they could go without him. That internal conflict was a great part of the show. Blackarachnia didn't change to much, but it was interesting to see how much she needed SilverBolt. In the Beast Wars, SilverBolt could live without his "black poison of his heart". To see the opposite of that made us feel empathy for Blackarachnia. The Vehicons were great because they were all the opposite of their former selves. But Rhinox's character development was mind blowing.What I found most interesting was that Rhinox could have always had that fascist sense of techno-perfection. Sure, he had a beast mode on on Earth, but that was just to protect himself from the Energon radiation. He didn't necessarily have any intent on keeping it back on Cybertron. For all we know Rhinox would have been on Megatron's side during the Beast Wars had he known how Megatron and Optimus felt about techno-organicism. He did stay away from beast mode in season 2 and 3. Megatron was another awesome character. He realized that he could control an army through robot mode and used his beast mode as a scapegoat for his "failure" in the Beast Wars. But when he  found out that he couldn't lose his beast mode, we bagan to see heis  dementia creep in.
   But the most debatable character in the series happens to be the hero, Optimus Primal. Many people believe that he was a hippie and a nut job. But imagine if you were in his position. After all your efforts and all the friends you lost go in vain and your home ruled by his most hated rival, and the only way to save it is to trust a strange voice telling you to plant trees, wouldn't you do it? Insanity and greif was what changed Optimus.All he did was rely on the Oracle, until season two, which was why he was less hippie then.
     So why do people hate Beast Machines so much. Well, it's because it wasn't what people expected. Beast Wars was a fun filled, action packed, joke filled adventure with interesting but not that deep plots (Except for the ones with the Vok). On the other hand, Beast Machines was a dark, thought-provoking, stylish Odyssey of survival (With the occasional slip-up). People just thought a sequel to Beast Wars which was
anything other than Beast Wras would be bad.

  Batman>Spiderman

i didnt like it as much as beast wars, but still kinda good. But i hated what they did to rionox!!!!!

Rhinox was the best plot twist.I thought that he would join the Maximals as soon as they revived his meomries.Him staying with the Vehicons and trying to over throw Megatron was good.The funny thing is if Rhinox had gone back to the Maximals everyone would have said it was so predictable.

I didn't have any real problem with beast machines.  My problems were with the arsenal.  Sure Rattrap caould have done better with feet and some explosives like he had in BW and they took away cheetors guns in favor of swords that make wings and a boomerang, Blackarachnia could only do that shock thing and tie people up with webbing, Yes nightscreams bat screech was kind of cool but they took away all the weapons with real power.  Optimus can only absorb energy and shoot it back. not like his giant plasma cannons on his chest in BW S3 I know i'm jumping around here but I don'y know exactly how to word iot.  Cheetor got superspeed  but it's better when we see his PINK Transformation light.  Optimus got blue whis was okay because his transmetal color was blue.  Rattraps was red which also matches his transmetal color.  nightscream and botanica shared the same off white close to gray flash.  Blackarachnia had a sort of lime-greenish and silverbolt had a brownish.  THe transformation scenes were half bad because all they did was shrink the beastmodes into the Robot modes.  the whole team could have a few more weapons.  the only physical weapon that was long range was silverbolts little feather bomb things.  I just don't understand wht the creators have such a fetish  for killing off optimus at the end of seasons one and two for both series.  end of season one, Transwarp explosion.  Season two, transformeds to optimal.  Season one BM melted or something, Season 2 BM killed at the same time as Megatron while tryuing to save Cybertron.  This puts him at the top of the list of transformers in BW and BM who died and then came back through some king of process.  BW rhinox enters the matrix while hooked up to a blank stasis pod.  BM the team tells Optimus how important he is to them and releases him from the oracle.  Other than taht it was a great series.  I Personally have the entire set of the series BW and BM dvds.