TV.com will be making some changes to our user base starting Feb 25, 2015. For more information click here

Doctor Who Forums

Saturday 8:00 PM on BBC AmericaIn Season

6xSpecial: A Christmas Carol (25/12/2010)

  • Avatar of Anime-Alchemist

    Anime-Alchemist

    [21]Dec 29, 2010
    • member since: 03/05/07
    • level: 20
    • rank: Cow Bell
    • posts: 3,666
    I liked it =D
    Did anyone else notice that the TARDIS was slightly different in the opening? It was slimmer and a darker blue; more like RTD's TARDIS exterior.
    Also - did people notice that the TARDIS was struck by purpley-pink lightning just prior to the titles, just like it is in the titles?
    Just some stuff.

    Next year LOOKS EPIC!
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Ravenite

    Ravenite

    [22]Dec 29, 2010
    • member since: 10/20/05
    • level: 6
    • rank: Small Wonder
    • posts: 379
    Hang on, wouldn't the "time travellers see things differently" thing not apply to Kazran, this negating a lot of the plot holes?
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of TOCM19

    TOCM19

    [23]Dec 30, 2010
    • member since: 08/30/07
    • level: 14
    • rank: Autobot
    • posts: 2,221
    You can't negate them, they're massive.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of steamheaduk

    steamheaduk

    [24]Dec 30, 2010
    • member since: 07/04/05
    • level: 19
    • rank: Fall Guy
    • posts: 4,253
    TOCM19 wrote:
    You can't negate them, they're massive.

    Nope they're not, they're just not to your liking. Remember this is NOT, and I repeat NOT a Stephen Hawking documentary, it's a piece of Family Fantasy.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Anime-Alchemist

    Anime-Alchemist

    [25]Dec 30, 2010
    • member since: 03/05/07
    • level: 20
    • rank: Cow Bell
    • posts: 3,666
    'sides, it's Christmas. The season for forgiveness! 'tis the season, afterall... ...or was...

    Welcome back, Steamy (permanently or temporarily)
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of CiaraPearson

    CiaraPearson

    [26]Dec 31, 2010
    • member since: 07/13/09
    • level: 4
    • rank: Thighmaster
    • posts: 47

    I loved the bit when the Doctor was using the psychic paper to back himself up as a qualified babysitter and responsible adult and it shorted out because the lie was too big. Nothing truer has ever been spoken.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of TOCM19

    TOCM19

    [27]Jan 2, 2011
    • member since: 08/30/07
    • level: 14
    • rank: Autobot
    • posts: 2,221
    steamheaduk wrote:
    TOCM19 wrote:
    You can't negate them, they're massive.

    Nope they're not, they're just not to your liking. Remember this is NOT, and I repeat NOT a Stephen Hawking documentary, it's a piece of Family Fantasy.


    Wuv U. x Still you have to admit that is SM wants to involve time travel more as an actual mechanic in the show rathr than a platform for story telling, it would be a much better idea to establish rules rather than changing them every episode?
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of pferreira86

    pferreira86

    [28]Jan 2, 2011
    • member since: 03/17/06
    • level: 18
    • rank: Land Shark
    • posts: 1,481

    I thought it was a decent Christmas special. For once it was just a Christmas special about Christmas instead about dealing with alien invasions and the end of time. Good stuff! Smile

    Edited on 01/02/2011 2:48pm
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of jwgrlrrajn

    jwgrlrrajn

    [29]Jan 2, 2011
    • member since: 07/14/07
    • level: 23
    • rank: Close Talker
    • posts: 2,915
    TOCM19 wrote:
    Wuv U. x Still you have to admit that is SM wants to involve time travel more as an actual mechanic in the show rathr than a platform for story telling, it would be a much better idea to establish rules rather than changing them every episode?


    The rules were established in Blink. "Time is[...]like a big ball of wibbley-wobbley, timey-wimey... stuff." Remember?

    Basically, with that and the Doctor being the last of the Time Lords, the rules can change every other episode if not mid-episode.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of TOCM19

    TOCM19

    [30]Jan 3, 2011
    • member since: 08/30/07
    • level: 14
    • rank: Autobot
    • posts: 2,221
    jwgrlrrajn wrote:
    TOCM19 wrote:
    Wuv U. x Still you have to admit that is SM wants to involve time travel more as an actual mechanic in the show rathr than a platform for story telling, it would be a much better idea to establish rules rather than changing them every episode?


    The rules were established in Blink. "Time is[...]like a big ball of wibbley-wobbley, timey-wimey... stuff." Remember?

    Basically, with that and the Doctor being the last of the Time Lords, the rules can change every other episode if not mid-episode.


    Which makes it less fun, and more comic book style "I will save the world with my Deus ex Machina"

    I just don't like that, I want to be able to say. "Oh year that solution makes sense, why didn't I think about that" not "Well how could I have possibly seen that coming?"
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of jwgrlrrajn

    jwgrlrrajn

    [31]Jan 3, 2011
    • member since: 07/14/07
    • level: 23
    • rank: Close Talker
    • posts: 2,915
    True, I guess the rules should be somewhat consistent within their own episodes.

    One thing that kind of drove me nuts in series five were the cracks. If people or objects were unwritten, why weren't their effects on the timeline unwritten as well? (then there's the potential ramifications of the Doctor being unwritten)
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of TOCM19

    TOCM19

    [32]Jan 3, 2011
    • member since: 08/30/07
    • level: 14
    • rank: Autobot
    • posts: 2,221
    jwgrlrrajn wrote:
    True, I guess the rules should be somewhat consistent within their own episodes.

    One thing that kind of drove me nuts in series five were the cracks. If people or objects were unwritten, why weren't their effects on the timeline unwritten as well? (then there's the potential ramifications of the Doctor being unwritten)


    It's like Moffat thinks that Human memory is stored on a big hard drive in a dimension outside of time and space.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of landom21

    landom21

    [33]Jan 15, 2011
    • member since: 08/04/10
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 18
    I thought this episode was fantastic. And the reason I think changing everything didn't cause a Dragon or something to show up is because in Father's Day Rose's dad's death was a fixed event and Kazran's life was not set in stone. Either way some of you need to get over it. Its a TV show. Its not perfect.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Princess_Pinky

    Princess_Pinky

    [34]Jan 16, 2011
    • member since: 09/28/05
    • level: 11
    • rank: Red Shirted Lt.
    • posts: 1,073

    PsyduckRanger wrote:
    A theory I saw on the TARDIS wiki about them being able to touch each other is that time being rewritten meant the older Kazran is essentially not the same person he once was...


    The thing is, when have we ever seen anything like this before? Not often, because the Doctor doesn't let it happen often.


    It's really a non-issue about the characters touching their past/future selves, according to the dialogue in "Father's Day."


    The only reason Rose couldn't touch her infant self was because she'd already screwed up the time stream enough by making The Doctor go back to the same place twice and saving her dad. They were already in a load of trouble and touching Baby Rose was the breaking point. It was the straw that broke the camel's back:


    "No! Don't touch the baby. You're both the same person and that's a paradox. We don't want a paradox, not with these things outside. Anything new, any disturbance in time, makes them stronger. A paradox might let them in."


    And in fact, The Doctor said he could've fixed things and kept her dad alive with the TARDIS:


    "…once I've got my ship back, I can mend everything."


    Rose: "When time gets sorted out…"
    The Doctor: "Don't worry, everyone here forgets what happened…and the thing that you changed, will stay changed."
    Pete: "You mean I'll still be alive, even though I'm meant to be dead?"


    It was only because Pete touched Baby Rose to Rose that the latest in a long string of paradoxes made the Reapers strong enough to get inside, which ate The Doctor and knocked the key out of the TARDIS before it had completely materialized. Otherwise, The Doctor would've been able to fix everything and the paradox of the Roses touching wouldn't have mattered.


    Therefore, the difference in "A Christmas Carol" was that The Doctor had control of the TARDIS, there were no Reapers, and there was no camel's back for the straw to break. The Doctor knew what he was doing and the limits he could push in ACC. Thus, two characters can touch at different points in their timeline such as Amelia and Amy or Young Kazran and Old Kazran did, without breaking canon.

    Edited on 01/16/2011 3:28am
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of jwgrlrrajn

    jwgrlrrajn

    [35]Jan 16, 2011
    • member since: 07/14/07
    • level: 23
    • rank: Close Talker
    • posts: 2,915
    The way I see it, in this case, a paradox was a necessary evil. The Doctor will direct people away from coming into contact with their younger/older selves when it's not necessary for them to come into contact as evidenced by The Hungry Earth. However, episodes like The Three Doctors and A Christmas Carol have shown that it can be a necessary evil sometimes.

    In the case of Father's Day, it just showed one of the worst possible things that could happen if a paradox like that were to occur.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of steamheaduk

    steamheaduk

    [36]Jan 17, 2011
    • member since: 07/04/05
    • level: 19
    • rank: Fall Guy
    • posts: 4,253
    jwgrlrrajn wrote:
    The way I see it, in this case, a paradox was a necessary evil. The Doctor will direct people away from coming into contact with their younger/older selves when it's not necessary for them to come into contact as evidenced by The Hungry Earth. However, episodes like The Three Doctors and A Christmas Carol have shown that it can be a necessary evil sometimes.

    In the case of Father's Day, it just showed one of the worst possible things that could happen if a paradox like that were to occur.

    The big difference with Fathers Day is that it wasn't just 1 Paradox, the Doctor and Rose turned up twice with an extra young Rose AND a resurrected Father. It was the high number of paradoxes that allowed the reapers through, not just the touch. The Doctor points out that the double presence weakened things.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of jwgrlrrajn

    jwgrlrrajn

    [37]Jan 17, 2011
    • member since: 07/14/07
    • level: 23
    • rank: Close Talker
    • posts: 2,915
    steamheaduk wrote:
    jwgrlrrajn wrote:
    The way I see it, in this case, a paradox was a necessary evil. The Doctor will direct people away from coming into contact with their younger/older selves when it's not necessary for them to come into contact as evidenced by The Hungry Earth. However, episodes like The Three Doctors and A Christmas Carol have shown that it can be a necessary evil sometimes.

    In the case of Father's Day, it just showed one of the worst possible things that could happen if a paradox like that were to occur.

    The big difference with Fathers Day is that it wasn't just 1 Paradox, the Doctor and Rose turned up twice with an extra young Rose AND a resurrected Father. It was the high number of paradoxes that allowed the reapers through, not just the touch. The Doctor points out that the double presence weakened things.


    I know there were multiple paradoxes in Father's Day, I was just giving an example for how paradoxes can go horribly wrong.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of archangelwho

    archangelwho

    [38]Dec 14, 2011
    • member since: 07/13/05
    • level: 18
    • rank: Land Shark
    • posts: 2,290

    Just got it on DVD. Show it to my clas and 2 others. (PMD/TMD classes) Was able to cover 4areas on the lesson plan. Itis a Christmas story so it covered our holiday theme. It was based on the Christmas Carolso that covered Literacy. We did a lesson on the science of Christmas (Santa'S bag/the TARDIS same design). It was made in England which lead to a Social Study lesson. Hey when you teach high school PMD you really have to be creative. Not only was this Matt Smith best story so for I feel that it is right up there with Midnight and the Water of Mars as the best story of the new Doctor Who and would be in my top 10 over all. This is the story where Matt Smith stated I'm the Doctor!!!


    I feel that this was not only the best special but one of the best of the Doctor Who 2005 stories. Not only was it fun to watch but show how time travel could be used or misused depending on your piot of views. It was also one that non-Doctor Who fans can enjoy. I show it to my class and 3 others as part of our Winter theme. Many of the staff did not know what Doctor Who was, never heard of the show. They all enjoyed it and 4 asked where they could see more of the show.

    Edited on 07/07/2013 1:01pm
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of MadamStacey

    MadamStacey

    [39]Dec 21, 2011
    • member since: 12/22/11
    • level: 2
    • rank: Sweat Hog
    • posts: 24

    I loved that episode, I believe that's the episode that got me interested in watching Doctor Who in the beginning. Boy did it confuse me when I saw Chris playing the Doctor in the beginning instead of him, lol.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of PenguinSuzie

    PenguinSuzie

    [40]Dec 26, 2011
    • member since: 08/19/11
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 1,012
    I'm surprised so many people loved this episode. I didn't like it.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.