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FOX (ended 2010)

Official Discussion Thread - "Vows"

  • Avatar of Alyssatao30

    Alyssatao30

    [41]Sep 26, 2009
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    i was feeling like I missed something when I watched this episode. Like how did Echo get away from Alpha? I am hunting for the 13th episode they decided not to air (idiots) to try and piece it together. I hate it when they do that!
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  • Avatar of Vesper-Lynd

    Vesper-Lynd

    [42]Sep 26, 2009
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    Alyssatao30 wrote:
    i was feeling like I missed something when I watched this episode. Like how did Echo get away from Alpha? I am hunting for the 13th episode they decided not to air (idiots) to try and piece it together. I hate it when they do that!
    Alpha ran off after tossing Caroline's wedge and Echo went to try to retrieve it, then Paul came and everything is back the way it is. Epitaph One, doesn't actually tell you anything you need to know to understand this story line. it's more of a later on thing.
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  • Avatar of chris17blue

    chris17blue

    [43]Sep 26, 2009
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    A small note: Adelle told Ballard that Echo has 3 more years left! I remember very well that they had a contract for 5 years, so first season happpened during the duration of 2 years? < That's another thing I can't understand.

    I tought it would be Season 1 -- the first year, second season - year 2 and so on..my head hurts.

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  • Avatar of lazyjay

    lazyjay

    [44]Sep 26, 2009
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    Vesper-Lynd wrote:
    Alyssatao30 wrote:
    I am hunting for the 13th episode they decided not to air (idiots) to try and piece it together. I hate it when they do that!
    Epitaph One, doesn't actually tell you anything you need to know to understand this story line. it's more of a later on thing.
    But it is oh so awesome and you should definitely watch it.
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  • Avatar of lazyjay

    lazyjay

    [45]Sep 26, 2009
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    chris17blue wrote:

    A small note: Adelle told Ballard that Echo has 3 more years left! I remember very well that they had a contract for 5 years, so first season happpened during the duration of 2 years? < That's another thing I can't understand.

    I tought it would be Season 1 -- the first year, second season - year 2 and so on..my head hurts.

    Sure it's not like Harry Potter, but I don't understand what's hard to get about the show not following Echo's life since the minute she joined the Dollhouse. It's just telling an interesting story, the kind that doesn't always nicely align with convenient events.
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  • Avatar of chris17blue

    chris17blue

    [46]Sep 26, 2009
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    lazyjay wrote:
    chris17blue wrote:

    A small note: Adelle told Ballard that Echo has 3 more years left! I remember very well that they had a contract for 5 years, so first season happpened during the duration of 2 years? < That's another thing I can't understand.

    I tought it would be Season 1 -- the first year, second season - year 2 and so on..my head hurts.

    Sure it's not like Harry Potter, but I don't understand what's hard to get about the show not following Echo's life since the minute she joined the Dollhouse. It's just telling an interesting story, the kind that doesn't always nicely align with convenient events.


    Well, what bothered me is that Season 2 picks up very short right after Season 1. It's not one year later, and to throw in something like oh Echo has 3 years left when it doesn't go well with the story. So now it's 4 years contract instead of 5? It does not make sense....

    I did not like any of it, the whole episode was so bad.
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  • Avatar of ___Mr_Nasty___

    ___Mr_Nasty___

    [47]Sep 26, 2009
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    chris17blue wrote:
    Well, what bothered me is that Season 2 picks up very short right after Season 1. It's not one year later, and to throw in something like oh Echo has 3 years left when it doesn't go well with the story. So now it's 4 years contract instead of 5? It does not make sense....


    I think what might be confusing you there is that the first episode, Ghost, starts off with Caroline about to sign her contract. Then it jumps to one of Echo's engagements. The thing is there's many months between these two events. By the time we see Echo again it's maybe a year or so later. Her contract is five years in total, like you say but we don't see the first bit of it. What we do know is that by the episode Vows, she has about three more years left.

    What might be a good idea for you is to buy the DVD set and then you can watch all the episodes again many times if you need to. Also, go watch as many episodes as you can on Hulu. Watch them over and over until you understand everything. Then you can enjoy the rest of the show as it airs.
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  • Avatar of Vesper-Lynd

    Vesper-Lynd

    [48]Sep 26, 2009
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    ___Mr_Nasty___ wrote:
    chris17blue wrote:
    Well, what bothered me is that Season 2 picks up very short right after Season 1. It's not one year later, and to throw in something like oh Echo has 3 years left when it doesn't go well with the story. So now it's 4 years contract instead of 5? It does not make sense....
    I think what might be confusing you there is that the first episode, Ghost, starts off with Caroline about to sign her contract. Then it jumps to one of Echo's engagements. The thing is there's many months between these two events.
    Not to mention it takes time to become the Dollhouse's most popular active.

    And totally, Epitaph One is an awesome suace episode and it should totally be watched.

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  • Avatar of alias571

    alias571

    [49]Sep 26, 2009
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    I've finally seen it and it was good, but not as amazing as I led myself to believe it would be. The engagement wasn't that great, Ballard still annoys me and I wasn't really impressed with the rest of the characters. Amy was good, sure, but that was pretty much it.
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  • Avatar of Dewbak75

    Dewbak75

    [50]Sep 26, 2009
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    The stuff with Eliza and Tamoh wasn't bad, but this was really Amy Acker's episode, and she knocked it out of the park. She's got such incredible range as an actress. As good as she was playing the adorable nerd on Angel, she does just as well with the heavy drama here, not to mention she can REALLY bring the sexy when she wants to. Between her attempted seduction of Topher, and last year's leather-pants lapdance, wow. It's certainly an interesting dilemma they've created for her character. We've gotten to know Claire, and sympathize with her situation, but keeping her around means that whoever Whiskey used to be before the Dollhouse never gets her body back. She's one of those characters who's just not going to get a happy ending in all this, is she?(Of course not, this is Joss Whedon we're talking about)

    I'd still like to know a little more about Boyd, and why he's there. I still can't quite understand how he's ok with what the Dollhouse is doing. He's not a believer like DeWitt, and he's not borderline sociopath like Topher, so how does he justify sticking around? Also, did they ever answer the question of who was sending Ballard those Doll-grams last season? Were we supposed to think it was Dominic? Because that wouldn't explain his actions. Are they ever going to pick up that plotline?

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  • Avatar of Bendyfay

    Bendyfay

    [51]Sep 26, 2009
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    A fantastic start to season 2, this has Whedon written all over it - something that was distinctly lacking in most of season one.

    If this is a sign of things to come, then we're in for a brilliant season!

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  • Avatar of fatfreeoreos

    fatfreeoreos

    [52]Sep 26, 2009
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    Yes, season one starts approximately one year after Caroline signed the contract, as stated by Dewitt. Which means the whole Alpha fiasco happened in the year proceeding S1. And I believe Dominic was the one who encoded those messages to Ballard in Echo and Mellie.
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  • Avatar of buffyTVSrox

    buffyTVSrox

    [53]Sep 26, 2009
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    AnilThornberry wrote:
    We won't get a 3rd season or maybe not even all the 13 episodes.


    Well last we heard from Eliza, episode thirteen was being shot/had just been shot, so even if the show gets canceled right away, the DVD should have the thirteen episodes.

    Dewbak75 wrote:
    She's one of those characters who's just not going to get a happy ending in all this, is she?(Of course not, this is Joss Whedon we're talking about)


    Have you seen "Epitaph One"?
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  • Avatar of spikemaniac

    spikemaniac

    [54]Sep 26, 2009
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    Have the ratings for this episode come out yet?
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  • Avatar of TwistedConverse

    TwistedConverse

    [55]Sep 26, 2009
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    spikemaniac wrote:
    Have the ratings for this episode come out yet?


    You really don't want to know.

    But it got 2.6 million.

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  • Avatar of spikemaniac

    spikemaniac

    [56]Sep 26, 2009
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    TwistedConverse wrote:
    spikemaniac wrote:
    Have the ratings for this episode come out yet?


    You really don't want to know.

    But it got 2.6 million.


    Oh man, that is so much poo.
    Anyway.


    This episode was AWESOME. Amy Acker was just... aaaaaah. I really really hope she comes back. All her scenes were just phenomenal, and Fran Kranz was great too.
    I think I prefer Adelle's hair long, but she still looks hot with short hair. Echo's wedding dress was beautiful, and Eliza looked extremely beautiful. Wow. I really like the new credits, but I still wish they'd show the other characters as well. Sierra's imprint made me laugh. Though isn't she like Tibetan That's "oriental", no?
    I loved Topher saying "I know what I know", gave me chills. At first I thought that Topher's "man reaction" to Claire being all nymph-like suggests that they're probably not related, but then he's all like "I made you hate the way I smell so we'd never sleep together" so maybe they are.
    Yeah, just... wow.
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  • Avatar of fatfreeoreos

    fatfreeoreos

    [57]Sep 26, 2009
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    IDK, I'm on the fence on that whole Topher/ Whiskey how-are-they-related thing.
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  • Avatar of EJamison

    EJamison

    [58]Sep 26, 2009
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    I was very confused during most of the episode. It's hard to figure out what is real, or even what "real" means.

    I'm assuming that Echo's assignment did not go as planned, but I'm not clear on what was the original plan. In the grand scheme, I guess it's not really that important. I'm not sure anything about the assignment was important. But are we supposed to understand why they didn't adequately plan it all out? Why wasn't Paul more careful about meeting with Echo?

    The thing that is really confusing me is how can they possibly use Echo in such a fragile state? How can they depend on her doing anything? Maybe this will be addressed in the next episode.

    Amy is amazing, no matter what she's doing.

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  • Avatar of fatfreeoreos

    fatfreeoreos

    [59]Sep 26, 2009
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    The assignment was for her to get close to Martin, which she obviously did, and get some dirt on him to get him arrested or to inform Ballard on any trips, like the one at the end, so he could call in a tip and get him that way. Basically, it was an inside job to take down a bad guy, or difficult is that to get?
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  • Avatar of Lady_Lancaster

    Lady_Lancaster

    [60]Sep 26, 2009
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    Well, for a start, I thought it was a lot better than the first episode of Season 1. I agree with what everyone is saying; that the opening credits need to encompass other lead characters and not just Eliza though. (even though I think she is fantastic!)

    Acting wise, I thought Eliza was far better than in the first season, but that could be put down to more familiarity with the character and her feeling more comfortable with it. On the whole though, I thought Amy Acker stole the episode pretty much from her first scene and I don't know if that's a good or a bad thing from the point of view of the future of the show itself.

    Ballard I found to be just as dull and boring as ever and I'm not sure if that will change. Interesting lines for both Amy and Fran on several occasions.

    The ratings are a disappointment but not at all a surprise. Joss's shows usually start off fairly weakly and then build up to their higher level of excellence later on. Unfortunately, with low ratings and only 13 episodes to convince the viewing audience, I'm not sure if the first episode was really strong enough overall to keep people interested and watching. I REALLY hope I'm wrong bcause I'd hate to see it go down the tubes. A Whedon-free television universe is not a good place to be.

    Olivia Williams' hair is a bit of a shocker, I think I liked it better before, but it's not important. The engagement itself was pretty uninteresting and I think that was a mistake because the whole overall point of the dollhouse is the engagements and the Actives.

    I'm hoping for better and brighter things to come in future episodes (and higher ratings) but it was great to see the show back again and I'm looking forward to episode 2.

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