Human Target Forums

FOX (ended 2011)

Official Discussion Thread: Marshall Pucci (possible spoilers)

  • Avatar of Gislef

    Gislef

    [1]Feb 6, 2011
    • member since: 04/22/05
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    Please direct all general and specific discussion of the 2/9/11 season finale, "Marshall Pucci", to this thread.

    enjoy!
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  • Avatar of Don_Moltisanti

    Don_Moltisanti

    [2]Feb 9, 2011
    • member since: 06/12/07
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    Looks like a good episode, hope it is better than the last season ender. That one did not end well, thought we were going to get to see thwe old man but we did not even see him in the start of the second season even though chance was supposed to be saving Winston with him but it turned out to be chance and Guerro even though Chance left in the Helicopter with the Old Man.
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  • Avatar of thribs

    thribs

    [3]Feb 9, 2011
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    This episode got me thinking, is The Losers based in the same universe as human target?

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  • Avatar of beilmandulin

    beilmandulin

    [5]Feb 9, 2011
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    thribs wrote:


    This episode got me thinking, is The Losers based in the same universe as human target?




    Well Human Target is DC Comics and The Losers is Vertigo which is a branch of DC Comics if that is what you mean.


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  • Avatar of sandbur

    sandbur

    [6]Feb 9, 2011
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    Too bad that the season (or the series?) couldn't have ended on a higher note. Except for Guerrero and the bad guys, I didn't think much of the episode. Shame how FOX has let this once great, fun, unique show slide into...this ending. Makes me sad...Cry

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  • Avatar of BarryWeen3

    BarryWeen3

    [7]Feb 10, 2011
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    beilmandulin wrote:


    thribs wrote:


    This episode got me thinking, is The Losers based in the same universe as human target?




    Well Human Target is DC Comics and The Losers is Vertigo which is a branch of DC Comics if that is what you mean.




    Human Target started off as a back-up feature in 1972in certain DC Comics titles such as Action Comics and Detective Comics and was created by Len Wein and Carmine Infantino.Then the Human Targetappeared in his own title in DC's Vertigo Imprint when Peter Mulliganrevived Len and Carmen's creationin a 4-issue mini-series in 1999 and an originalGN (Final Cut) and an ongoing series that lasted 21 issues in 2003.Last yearthere was a 6-issue mini-series of the Human Target which featured the TV show's version of Christopher Chance written by none other thanhis creator Len Wein. The TV version of Christopher Chance is not quite the comic book version, but that's understandable as it wouldn't make sense not to see your main actor on screen each week, so the whole thing of Christopher Chance literally becoming the target he's protecting both physically and mentally works fine in a comic book but wouldn't work on television practically.


    As for The Losers and The Human Target being in the same universe, Vertigo titles tend not to inhabit the same universe from title to title, although there are some exceptions but that's either due to circumstances or due to being a spin-off. For example, the characters from Hellblazer, Swamp Thing, Madame Xanadu, and a few others are both Vertigo characters but were also in the mainstream DC universe as well. So you may see mainstream DC characters showing up in their titles. Fables has a spin-off called Jack of Fables, so they share a universe, but their universe is separate from any other Vertigo title. And to add even more fun into the mix, the mainstream DC universe is actually now established as a multiverse of 52 universes.


    So the Human Target and The Losers may inhabit the same universe, that is a possibility, but based off of what I know about Vertigo, I would lean towards no. Other than as beilmandulin says, they are both in the overall DC Comics umbrella.

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  • Avatar of RoverGuy

    RoverGuy

    [8]Feb 10, 2011
    • member since: 04/29/05
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    Again a good solid fun episode.


    Note to self: Do not mess with Guerrero's family. Hitting his 'pressure point' can get you DEAD. It looked like he had been worked over to, before getting blowed up.


    At first I thought it was silly that some mysterious 'evil bad guy' could control stop lights and buses. It made more sense when it was revealed it was a (rogue) CIA agent. Funny how Ames finally got what the guys meant when Chance mentioned pulling a Geneva. She's one of the gang now. Neat how they pulled the old switcheroo with Pucci and Ames, like the CIA did. I wonder what happened to the 'mistress'. Maybe a re-occurring character next season?


    Hopefully this was a SEAON finale and not the SERIES finale. Fingers crossed.


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  • Avatar of BarryWeen3

    BarryWeen3

    [9]Feb 10, 2011
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    So as we suspected, the photo Ames found in Guerrero's briefcase back in Cool Hand Guerrero was a picture of his son.


    Such a quick turnaround for Ilsa in regards to Julia when she first meets her and being urged on by Ames, neither one of them listening to Chance's misgivings.


    At the end, Guerrero proves how cool his is taking out the rogue CIA agent and having him blow himself up. I also liked Chance popping out of the ceiling and taking out the CIA team and also scaling up the wall of the hotel.


    I didn't understand how if this rogue agent researched and was following the team, how he could so underestimate the abilities of both Chance and Guerrero. Leaving himself with only two other agents in the office, the small number of agents he sent after Chance, etc. I believe that if Chance was alone on the roof, he would have taken on the entire team and won, but because Ilsa was there, they did the Geneva jump.


    Nice episode, and hopefully only a season finale. I think last I read that Human Target and Lie to Me are considered could go either way for renewal/cancellation.

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  • Avatar of thribs

    thribs

    [10]Feb 10, 2011
    • member since: 02/05/05
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    BarryWeen3 wrote:


    beilmandulin wrote:


    thribs wrote:


    This episode got me thinking, is The Losers based in the same universe as human target?




    Well Human Target is DC Comics and The Losers is Vertigo which is a branch of DC Comics if that is what you mean.




    Human Target started off as a back-up feature in 1972in certain DC Comics titles such as Action Comics and Detective Comics and was created by Len Wein and Carmine Infantino.Then the Human Targetappeared in his own title in DC's Vertigo Imprint when Peter Mulliganrevived Len and Carmen's creationin a 4-issue mini-series in 1999 and an originalGN (Final Cut) and an ongoing series that lasted 21 issues in 2003.Last yearthere was a 6-issue mini-series of the Human Target which featured the TV show's version of Christopher Chance written by none other thanhis creator Len Wein. The TV version of Christopher Chance is not quite the comic book version, but that's understandable as it wouldn't make sense not to see your main actor on screen each week, so the whole thing of Christopher Chance literally becoming the target he's protecting both physically and mentally works fine in a comic book but wouldn't work on television practically.


    As for The Losers and The Human Target being in the same universe, Vertigo titles tend not to inhabit the same universe from title to title, although there are some exceptions but that's either due to circumstances or due to being a spin-off. For example, the characters from Hellblazer, Swamp Thing, Madame Xanadu, and a few others are both Vertigo characters but were also in the mainstream DC universe as well. So you may see mainstream DC characters showing up in their titles. Fables has a spin-off called Jack of Fables, so they share a universe, but their universe is separate from any other Vertigo title. And to add even more fun into the mix, the mainstream DC universe is actually now established as a multiverse of 52 universes.


    So the Human Target and The Losers may inhabit the same universe, that is a possibility, but based off of what I know about Vertigo, I would lean towards no. Other than as beilmandulin says, they are both in the overall DC Comics umbrella.



    I was wondering because the villian of this episode reminded me of Max from the 2004 Losers comics and it clicked with methat he might be kind of a cool villian for Chance.

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  • Avatar of BarryWeen3

    BarryWeen3

    [11]Feb 10, 2011
    • member since: 09/28/05
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    thribs wrote:


    BarryWeen3 wrote:


    beilmandulin wrote:


    thribs wrote:


    This episode got me thinking, is The Losers based in the same universe as human target?




    Well Human Target is DC Comics and The Losers is Vertigo which is a branch of DC Comics if that is what you mean.




    Human Target started off as a back-up feature in 1972in certain DC Comics titles such as Action Comics and Detective Comics and was created by Len Wein and Carmine Infantino.Then the Human Targetappeared in his own title in DC's Vertigo Imprint when Peter Mulliganrevived Len and Carmen's creationin a 4-issue mini-series in 1999 and an originalGN (Final Cut) and an ongoing series that lasted 21 issues in 2003.Last yearthere was a 6-issue mini-series of the Human Target which featured the TV show's version of Christopher Chance written by none other thanhis creator Len Wein. The TV version of Christopher Chance is not quite the comic book version, but that's understandable as it wouldn't make sense not to see your main actor on screen each week, so the whole thing of Christopher Chance literally becoming the target he's protecting both physically and mentally works fine in a comic book but wouldn't work on television practically.


    As for The Losers and The Human Target being in the same universe, Vertigo titles tend not to inhabit the same universe from title to title, although there are some exceptions but that's either due to circumstances or due to being a spin-off. For example, the characters from Hellblazer, Swamp Thing, Madame Xanadu, and a few others are both Vertigo characters but were also in the mainstream DC universe as well. So you may see mainstream DC characters showing up in their titles. Fables has a spin-off called Jack of Fables, so they share a universe, but their universe is separate from any other Vertigo title. And to add even more fun into the mix, the mainstream DC universe is actually now established as a multiverse of 52 universes.


    So the Human Target and The Losers may inhabit the same universe, that is a possibility, but based off of what I know about Vertigo, I would lean towards no. Other than as beilmandulin says, they are both in the overall DC Comics umbrella.



    I was wondering because the villian of this episode reminded me of Max from the 2004 Losers comics and it clicked with methat he might be kind of a cool villian for Chance.



    I can see that, but no chance of that now considering what Guerrero did to him.

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  • Avatar of thribs

    thribs

    [12]Feb 10, 2011
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    BarryWeen3 wrote:


    thribs wrote:


    BarryWeen3 wrote:


    beilmandulin wrote:


    thribs wrote:


    This episode got me thinking, is The Losers based in the same universe as human target?




    Well Human Target is DC Comics and The Losers is Vertigo which is a branch of DC Comics if that is what you mean.




    Human Target started off as a back-up feature in 1972in certain DC Comics titles such as Action Comics and Detective Comics and was created by Len Wein and Carmine Infantino.Then the Human Targetappeared in his own title in DC's Vertigo Imprint when Peter Mulliganrevived Len and Carmen's creationin a 4-issue mini-series in 1999 and an originalGN (Final Cut) and an ongoing series that lasted 21 issues in 2003.Last yearthere was a 6-issue mini-series of the Human Target which featured the TV show's version of Christopher Chance written by none other thanhis creator Len Wein. The TV version of Christopher Chance is not quite the comic book version, but that's understandable as it wouldn't make sense not to see your main actor on screen each week, so the whole thing of Christopher Chance literally becoming the target he's protecting both physically and mentally works fine in a comic book but wouldn't work on television practically.


    As for The Losers and The Human Target being in the same universe, Vertigo titles tend not to inhabit the same universe from title to title, although there are some exceptions but that's either due to circumstances or due to being a spin-off. For example, the characters from Hellblazer, Swamp Thing, Madame Xanadu, and a few others are both Vertigo characters but were also in the mainstream DC universe as well. So you may see mainstream DC characters showing up in their titles. Fables has a spin-off called Jack of Fables, so they share a universe, but their universe is separate from any other Vertigo title. And to add even more fun into the mix, the mainstream DC universe is actually now established as a multiverse of 52 universes.


    So the Human Target and The Losers may inhabit the same universe, that is a possibility, but based off of what I know about Vertigo, I would lean towards no. Other than as beilmandulin says, they are both in the overall DC Comics umbrella.



    I was wondering because the villian of this episode reminded me of Max from the 2004 Losers comics and it clicked with methat he might be kind of a cool villian for Chance.



    I can see that, but no chance of that now considering what Guerrero did to him.



    Was he "the boss". All we know is that he was in charge there. It could go higher up.

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  • Avatar of dif_frent

    dif_frent

    [13]Feb 10, 2011
    • member since: 05/30/10
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    Season two was fun to watch, but not as much fun as season one. However, I do not agree with most opinions that it was because of the women that season two was so much softer and weaker. It was just a bad decision by the producers. It happens. Hope the show returns with season three and hope it brings back the strengths and fun of season one. I'll be looking forward to seeing badass Guerrero, kicking-ass Chance and wise guy Winston again.


    Why not explore the the plot that was not finished in episode 12 of season one? It would be a good starting point. And I'd love to see Babtiste again, but season-one Babtiste, the dangerose enemy/friend as good as Chance or even more leathal. This show has still a lot of potential. Do not waste it.

    Edited on 02/10/2011 3:52pm
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  • Avatar of BarryWeen3

    BarryWeen3

    [14]Feb 11, 2011
    • member since: 09/28/05
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    thribs wrote:


    BarryWeen3 wrote:


    thribs wrote:


    BarryWeen3 wrote:


    beilmandulin wrote:


    thribs wrote:


    This episode got me thinking, is The Losers based in the same universe as human target?




    Well Human Target is DC Comics and The Losers is Vertigo which is a branch of DC Comics if that is what you mean.




    Human Target started off as a back-up feature in 1972in certain DC Comics titles such as Action Comics and Detective Comics and was created by Len Wein and Carmine Infantino.Then the Human Targetappeared in his own title in DC's Vertigo Imprint when Peter Mulliganrevived Len and Carmen's creationin a 4-issue mini-series in 1999 and an originalGN (Final Cut) and an ongoing series that lasted 21 issues in 2003.Last yearthere was a 6-issue mini-series of the Human Target which featured the TV show's version of Christopher Chance written by none other thanhis creator Len Wein. The TV version of Christopher Chance is not quite the comic book version, but that's understandable as it wouldn't make sense not to see your main actor on screen each week, so the whole thing of Christopher Chance literally becoming the target he's protecting both physically and mentally works fine in a comic book but wouldn't work on television practically.


    As for The Losers and The Human Target being in the same universe, Vertigo titles tend not to inhabit the same universe from title to title, although there are some exceptions but that's either due to circumstances or due to being a spin-off. For example, the characters from Hellblazer, Swamp Thing, Madame Xanadu, and a few others are both Vertigo characters but were also in the mainstream DC universe as well. So you may see mainstream DC characters showing up in their titles. Fables has a spin-off called Jack of Fables, so they share a universe, but their universe is separate from any other Vertigo title. And to add even more fun into the mix, the mainstream DC universe is actually now established as a multiverse of 52 universes.


    So the Human Target and The Losers may inhabit the same universe, that is a possibility, but based off of what I know about Vertigo, I would lean towards no. Other than as beilmandulin says, they are both in the overall DC Comics umbrella.



    I was wondering because the villian of this episode reminded me of Max from the 2004 Losers comics and it clicked with methat he might be kind of a cool villian for Chance.



    I can see that, but no chance of that now considering what Guerrero did to him.



    Was he "the boss". All we know is that he was in charge there. It could go higher up.



    It could but I don't think so. He was the boss, I don't think it went any further than him.

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  • Avatar of VConn

    VConn

    [15]Feb 12, 2011
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    Good episode and a well thought out season finale really tied up all the loose ends, Now hopefully FOX gets off its corporate rear end and renews this for a third season though if I remember right they did take a month or so last time before they renewed it so hopefully they do that again but quicker this deserves a 3rd season.

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  • Avatar of haldrey

    haldrey

    [16]Feb 13, 2011
    • member since: 02/23/08
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    Solid episode once get over the too much Pucci lady syndrome. This season, although good, was not as good as the first one. They changed their winning formula with introduction of the Pucci lady and from there on, in my opinion, the show began a downward slide. The way it was ended the show can go either way, down the drain or upward. I do hope for a new season.
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    xM4589ERx

    [17]Feb 13, 2011
    • member since: 09/18/05
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    I LMAO, when the bad guy was reading the team's files and one of the agents comes in with the "GUERRERO" boxes, XD.
    Guerrero is the best character of this series, I hope it comes back for a third season.
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  • Avatar of BarryWeen3

    BarryWeen3

    [18]Feb 14, 2011
    • member since: 09/28/05
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    xM4589ERx wrote:
    I LMAO, when the bad guy was reading the team's files and one of the agents comes in with the "GUERRERO" boxes, XD. Guerrero is the best character of this series, I hope it comes back for a third season.


    See, and that points to one problem I have with this episode. They must have done a lot of research on this team and yet they have no clue how dangerous Guerrero and Chance can be, especially Guerrero. They invade the office, chase off the team, and think it'll be easy to kill the team off because apparently they're nothing special. That's how I felt in the attitude of the boss rogue CIA agent and the fact he left himself with basically no protection once he took over the team's office. It's like did they actually read any of the files they accumulated? I'm guessing apparently not considering the boss didn't know Guerrero had a kid. Apparently the CIA skips the lesson of "Know thy Enemy".

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  • Avatar of MajLorne

    MajLorne

    [19]Feb 15, 2011
    • member since: 01/31/08
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    dif_frent wrote:

    Season two was fun to watch, but not as much fun as season one. However, I do not agree with most opinions that it was because of the women that season two was so much softer and weaker. It was just a bad decision by the producers. It happens. Hope the show returns with season three and hope it brings back the strengths and fun of season one. I'll be looking forward to seeing badass Guerrero, kicking-ass Chance and wise guy Winston again.


    Why not explore the the plot that was not finished in episode 12 of season one? It would be a good starting point. And I'd love to see Babtiste again, but season-one Babtiste, the dangerose enemy/friend as good as Chance or even more leathal. This show has still a lot of potential. Do not waste it.

    I agree. It was a total waste to have 'the old man'? [been so long since i last saw season 1 and forgot most of it] and no word about after he and Chance got off the helicopter. Also at least they could've answered questions like what was so important about that book.
    Babtiste as a main villain [teamed up with other villains would be pretty neat].

    As for this finale, I'm glad it ended with a 'happy ending'. So other than some loose ends, at least I won't have to worry about a cliffhanger should Fox stupidly can this show. Also it feels like everything was wrapped up too perfectly and they never really gave a good reason about the whole rouge CIA thing. It just seemed a bit too vague. I think this ep could've used an extra half hour to fill in some more details, but that's just me.

    I am dissapointed of the trio: [Fringe, Human target, Lie to me] over how I'd have to choose one to ax. But I'd have to let Lie to me go if it means keeping the other 2.
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  • Avatar of danharr

    danharr

    [20]Feb 15, 2011
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    Good episode I liked it just fine and even warmed up to Pucci I knew Marshall wasn't a cheater way too simplistic and I like the way they handled it all and even though the ship is there they nicely backed off of it good job.

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