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ABC (ended 2010)

question To the Haters

  • Avatar of fnlheroes

    fnlheroes

    [1]Jun 9, 2010
    • member since: 04/05/07
    • level: 6
    • rank: Small Wonder
    • posts: 146

    So I loved the finale, but I respect everyone's opinion. I just have question to those who hated the finale, and feel that they wasted six years of their life. Were you at least entertained most of the time?

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  • Avatar of motleylil

    motleylil

    [2]Jun 16, 2010
    • member since: 03/02/07
    • level: 19
    • rank: Fall Guy
    • posts: 971

    fnlheroes wrote:


    So I loved the finale, but I respect everyone's opinion. I just have question to those who hated the finale, and feel that they wasted six years of their life. Were you at least entertained most of the time?



    No one cares about that, of course. They want answers.

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  • Avatar of buildam2005

    buildam2005

    [3]Jun 16, 2010
    • member since: 05/30/08
    • level: 14
    • rank: Autobot
    • posts: 710
    motleylil wrote:

    fnlheroes wrote:


    So I loved the finale, but I respect everyone's opinion. I just have question to those who hated the finale, and feel that they wasted six years of their life. Were you at least entertained most of the time?



    No one cares about that, of course. They want answers.



    That's a bit of an unfair simplification. I enjoy a good story. That means good characters, theme, and PLOT. Looking at each, here's how I felt after the finale:

    Characters: For the first few years, great. The flashbacks provided great background and insights into who these people were as well as informing their decisions and actions on the island. However, moving into seasons four, five, and six, this didn't seem as important to the writers any more. Really, there was very little transformation for many of them (there are of course exceptions), particularly in seasons five and (to a greater extent) six. Theme: Again, in the early years, this was great. Questions of hope, redemption, faith and science were nicely wrapped up together and enmeshed with the plot, meaning the plot was a solid catalyst for character development and theme.

    Plot: Here's where things get tricky. The plot in the first season was somewhat basic: there are people whose plane crashed on an island. Then we get these little moments that indicate that something else is going on--the noise in the jungle (later IDed as Smokey), the discovery of the hatch, this crazy French woman spouting about the "Others." Then, as we all know, the mysteries EXPLODED. What carried me through during the slumps in which the characters weren't doing anything particularly insightful was the plot--and there were those lapses (to say that there wasn't a bit of a character slump mid season five is simply being blindly devoted to the show)--and how those mysteries unfolded. Part of being a good storyteller and creating a fascinating story is having the ability to bring these complicated mysterious threads together. In some ways, the writers succeeded. Just because the explanation of who Jacob is and the origin of the Smoke Monster is didn't really do it for me (along with some still ambiguous, and not in the good way, aspects), at least there was resolution there. I just would have liked some more resolution of plot points, not simply because I thirst for answers, but because I like to see how a creative mind is able to pull the plot together. I want to think "Wow, it was great how they made that mystery unfold!" or "Wow, they really knew what they were doing--look at the clues they had way back in _____ that hinted at this answer they just gave."

    It's NOT just that people wanted answers for the sake of answers--at least not for me. It was about seeing how the mystery unfolded, how they made those answers come together. For me, one of the biggest mysteries that wasn't resolved was the problem of childbirth. Never really addressed. Some claim that the incident caused it, but we get no real proof of this in the show, or explanation--and I like hearing and seeing the details of that sort. In sum, do I think the whole six years was a waste? No. Do I think that the show's mystery writing ended up falling flat when seeing the final product as a whole? Yes.
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  • Avatar of motleylil

    motleylil

    [4]Jun 17, 2010
    • member since: 03/02/07
    • level: 19
    • rank: Fall Guy
    • posts: 971

    buildam2005 wrote:
    motleylil wrote:


    fnlheroes wrote:


    So I loved the finale, but I respect everyone's opinion. I just have question to those who hated the finale, and feel that they wasted six years of their life. Were you at least entertained most of the time?



    No one cares about that, of course. They want answers.


    That's a bit of an unfair simplification. I enjoy a good story. That means good characters, theme, and PLOT. Looking at each, here's how I felt after the finale: Characters: For the first few years, great. The flashbacks provided great background and insights into who these people were as well as informing their decisions and actions on the island. However, moving into seasons four, five, and six, this didn't seem as important to the writers any more. Really, there was very little transformation for many of them (there are of course exceptions), particularly in seasons five and (to a greater extent) six. Theme: Again, in the early years, this was great. Questions of hope, redemption, faith and science were nicely wrapped up together and enmeshed with the plot, meaning the plot was a solid catalyst for character development and theme. Plot: Here's where things get tricky. The plot in the first season was somewhat basic: there are people whose plane crashed on an island. Then we get these little moments that indicate that something else is going on--the noise in the jungle (later IDed as Smokey), the discovery of the hatch, this crazy French woman spouting about the "Others." Then, as we all know, the mysteries EXPLODED. What carried me through during the slumps in which the characters weren't doing anything particularly insightful was the plot--and there were those lapses (to say that there wasn't a bit of a character slump mid season five is simply being blindly devoted to the show)--and how those mysteries unfolded. Part of being a good storyteller and creating a fascinating story is having the ability to bring these complicated mysterious threads together. In some ways, the writers succeeded. Just because the explanation of who Jacob is and the origin of the Smoke Monster is didn't really do it for me (along with some still ambiguous, and not in the good way, aspects), at least there was resolution there. I just would have liked some more resolution of plot points, not simply because I thirst for answers, but because I like to see how a creative mind is able to pull the plot together. I want to think "Wow, it was great how they made that mystery unfold!" or "Wow, they really knew what they were doing--look at the clues they had way back in _____ that hinted at this answer they just gave." It's NOT just that people wanted answers for the sake of answers--at least not for me. It was about seeing how the mystery unfolded, how they made those answers come together. For me, one of the biggest mysteries that wasn't resolved was the problem of childbirth. Never really addressed. Some claim that the incident caused it, but we get no real proof of this in the show, or explanation--and I like hearing and seeing the details of that sort. In sum, do I think the whole six years was a waste? No. Do I think that the show's mystery writing ended up falling flat when seeing the final product as a whole? Yes.


    I have to say, even though I don't agree with you, I enjoy reading well written arguments. These are not the people I'm reffering to.


    But I have a problem with people demanding what I consider to be too much answers. Yes, they answered about 40% of the stuff, so if you want to be angry about that, you have every right to be. But, to use your example of pregnancy issues, I don't think this needed to be explained in any way. To me, this "mystery" was more of a justification to why Juliet was brought on the Island rather than a mystery in itself. Yes, it's a mystery in the most literal sense of the word, but I don't think it's something that we were supposed to bother ourselves with.


    And I think that people are a little easy with the term "plot holes". The pregnancy issues were never really part of the plot, but part of the background. And, yes, that background was incomplete as hell. (I'm not saying you in particular are using this term incorrectly. This paragraph here is in no way directed to you specifically.)

    Edited on 06/17/2010 5:16pm
    Edited 2 total times.
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  • Avatar of Kevnay777

    Kevnay777

    [5]Jun 19, 2010
    • member since: 05/05/10
    • level: 8
    • rank: Super-Friend
    • posts: 310

    Actually the pregnancy issues were very well part of the plot in fact season 3 ended with the others still trying to capture pregnant woman to experiment and solve the pregnancy issues. But I'm not a freak about the answers either. I mean every answer just leads up to a new question. Like what you said about the Juliet mystery, we know why she was recruited but that answer gave us the question of the pregnancy issues. However I do agree with the fact that the writers should have done a little bit more to really wrap up the story. Don't get me wrong I thought the ending was very well done and emotional but to me it didn't provide the closure that I hoped for. To me they didn't need to end the story with just characterization because like buildam said the characters were already well built in the first three seasons and the last three none of them really made an impact. The mysteries themselves were what most people focused on going into the final season. Like I said I'm not a person that is a must when it comes to answers, but I felt that the writers could have satisfied some other people and myself more.

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  • Avatar of MichaelFC

    MichaelFC

    [6]Jun 23, 2010
    • member since: 05/13/09
    • level: 5
    • rank: Caveman Lawyer
    • posts: 158
    Yeah, but it was a good ride while it lasted.
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  • Avatar of motleylil

    motleylil

    [7]Jun 24, 2010
    • member since: 03/02/07
    • level: 19
    • rank: Fall Guy
    • posts: 971

    Kevnay777 wrote:


    Actually the pregnancy issues were very well part of the plot in fact season 3 ended with the others still trying to capture pregnant woman to experiment and solve the pregnancy issues. But I'm not a freak about the answers either. I mean every answer just leads up to a new question. Like what you said about the Juliet mystery, we know why she was recruited but that answer gave us the question of the pregnancy issues. However I do agree with the fact that the writers should have done a little bit more to really wrap up the story. Don't get me wrong I thought the ending was very well done and emotional but to me it didn't provide the closure that I hoped for. To me they didn't need to end the story with just characterization because like buildam said the characters were already well built in the first three seasons and the last three none of them really made an impact. The mysteries themselves were what most people focused on going into the final season. Like I said I'm not a person that is a must when it comes to answers, but I felt that the writers could have satisfied some other people and myself more.



    I may not have been clear about that. What wasn't part of the plot was the cause of the pregnancy issues.

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