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CBS (ended 2011)

Official Discussion: 6x15 "How to Beat a Bad Guy"

  • Avatar of Edward_Nigma

    Edward_Nigma

    [1]Mar 5, 2010
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    I'm rooting for a solid return for the show! And I kinda almost wanna see Allison get beat up, as terrible as that sounds, lol. She deserves it after confronting all those bad guys on her own and never getting punched, much less killed!!

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  • Avatar of agent_0042

    agent_0042

    [2]Mar 5, 2010
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    Heh, yeah, as harsh as it sounds, you have a point there.

    According to schedule listings, Allison will start taking a self-defense course following that attack. In other news, Devalos is investigated the possible murder of an undercover and the rape of a teenager.
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  • Avatar of pgsuperfan

    pgsuperfan

    [3]Mar 6, 2010
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    I still cannot figure out why Lee let his brother get killed ?

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  • Avatar of Vesper-Lynd

    Vesper-Lynd

    [4]Mar 6, 2010
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    pgsuperfan wrote:

    I still cannot figure out why Lee let his brother get killed ?

    I think it's because he realized exactly how terrible a person his brother was.
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  • Avatar of TesserT

    TesserT

    [5]Mar 6, 2010
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    Vesper-Lynd wrote:
    pgsuperfan wrote:

    I still cannot figure out why Lee let his brother get killed ?

    I think it's because he realized exactly how terrible a person his brother was.
    His brother told him that he wasn't going to change his sexual predator ways & that he liked the way he was - even that he thought himself as normal. Lee knew his brother would continue pretending to have changed but would commit a violent sexual attack on someone else in the near future (He couldn't prove his brother was the one on the video with the teenager even though it was.) & that there was nothing he could do legally to prevent it. Letting the lady who'd already killed a cop (but no one could prove she did) kill his brother would allow him to catch her and take his brother out of society for good. Remember there were several sexual predators who'd gone missing & it was alluded to that she'd done the killing. Neither she nor his brother were going to stop so he let the night run its course.

    I wondered how Lee was going to handle it & I guess his way was the best way to keep the population safe. I know Lee's one tough guy but I think having a daughter who, in the future, might need protection from men like his brother made his decision easier.
    Edited on 03/06/2010 6:31pm
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  • Avatar of haldrey

    haldrey

    [6]Mar 6, 2010
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    I know that the brother was a no good rapist but, wow, that was how it ended, really, Lee crossing over to the dark side?
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  • Avatar of ummhaniyyah

    ummhaniyyah

    [7]Mar 7, 2010
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    This episode blew me away. It was really harsh, though as set out by another poster the logical solution to both problems. Bad that in effect Allison got used - she may well find out if Lee's brother starts talking to her. But sometimes she is way too goody shoes-ish.


    Also, I think there was some pretty strong hinting that Lee's brother might pose a problem to his daughter later on - the whole creepy teddy bear thing - coming back to Phoenix when he learns that Lee has a little girl. Maybe even to Lee's fiancee (though he seems to prefer teen girls).


    The other thing is that Lee's brother is a great liar. Lee certainly could never trust him - so not just a violent sexual offender but an extremely effective liar at that. Danger, danger.


    I feel for Lee though. What a big secret to keep to himself.

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  • Avatar of jaboulka

    jaboulka

    [8]Mar 8, 2010
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    I do understand all the above points, however letting his brother being killed it's just as "killing" him.


    No matter how dangerous his brother was, I believe Lee had no right to do that, especially not as a cop.


    His brother was a rapist, Lee in this episode turns into a "murderer" ...


    I didn't particularly appreciate this ending, it's a pity, Lee is my favourite caracter, and I liked the fact that he is tough but always on the right side.


    I hope in the next episodes they're going to show more of him but less in the dark side.

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  • Avatar of neokid0298

    neokid0298

    [9]Mar 9, 2010
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    I loved Lee's character development in this episode. They are certainly fleshing out his character.

    Too bad we had to see Allison kick ass, we should've gotten to see her get the crap beat out of her
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  • Avatar of katkepin

    katkepin

    [10]Mar 9, 2010
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    Lee wasn't a murderer... the girl Kira was. He stepped back and allowed the night's events to play off as they would have if Allison hadn't had her dreams. Besides, when an actual sexual predator gets killed (as opposed to Henry Manard) by a murderer (who's also going to pay for her crimes) there's no fingers left to point. I loved this episode. One of the best plot twists EVER.

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  • Avatar of ummhaniyyah

    ummhaniyyah

    [11]Mar 10, 2010
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    Yep, I second that this was one of the greatest plot twists ever and harsh as it was I agree that it doesn't count as murder. He simply let things play out as they would have without Allison's information. He would not have put any surveillance on Kira without Allison's say-so and they would not even have known about Kira without Allison - e.g. there is no proof that Kira is/was involved except what Allison told them. He lets Kira go into his brother's building but he doesn't know for sure what she will do there - we've seen Allison's vision. Officially there can be no case against her just as officially there is none against his brother. I underline again that I think Lee thought he was protecting his daughter as well as the public in letting things happen as they did. He did lie to Allison, which is a breach of confidence, but not a crime.

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  • Avatar of PutU2REM

    PutU2REM

    [12]Mar 10, 2010
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    ummhaniyyah wrote:


    He did lie to Allison, which is a breach of confidence, but not a crime.


    Oh, it was definitely a crime. I think Scanlon acted ethically, too, but in real life he'd at least be charged with negligent homicide or the like. He might even be charged as an accomplice, since he actively assisted Kira by sending the other cop away.


    Ethical or not, legal or not, I'll definitely third the opinion that it was a marvelous twist. Kudos to the writers!

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  • Avatar of jaboulka

    jaboulka

    [14]Mar 11, 2010
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    Hi everybody


    I know, and I agree with you, when you say that Lee did not physically kill his brother. This is why I put the word "murderer" and "killing" into brackets.


    What I am saying is that by not moving, or by sending the other cop away, he decided that his brother had to die, and this is not for him to decide.


    His job is exactly the opposite, preventing people to kill other people, not to judge who is to be protected and who is not.


    Anyway, I liked this episode, I liked the plot, and I also agree that I would love to discover in the next episode that it was a dream ... but I know it is probably not going to happen.


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  • Avatar of mediumfanatic

    mediumfanatic

    [15]Mar 18, 2010
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    I thought this was one of the most well-written episodes of the series so far. The twist at the end was a mind-blower, and the best one ever on Medium (with the possible exception of the season 5 finale). It is arguable that Lee's inaction could be viewed as complicity in his brother's murder. It's a sticky area, because if he saves his brother, then chances are that he lets both a murderer and a serial rapist go free, but by allowing things to take their course, he in effect solves both problems at once. And yes, it was unethical for sure, and illegal, but was there any other way to stop them both? Was there any guarantee that they would be able to gather enough evidence to get both of them off of the streets for good? Who knows? And I loved the opening scene when Allison kicked the living $h!t out of those punks!! That was badass!
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  • Avatar of netgoddess

    netgoddess

    [16]Mar 26, 2010
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    This was a really fantastic episode, excellent writing.

    I loved the plot twist at the first where Allison beat up the muggers, too bad it didn't actually happen that way.

    After that it seemed like it would be predictable, where I figured out pretty early on that the martial arts instructor was the one who murdered the undercover cop. However I really was not expecting the ending at all. That was pretty mindblowing. I think Lee felt justified in his actions and I can't really blame him for doing what he did, however I do think it is crossing a line that shouldn't be crossed. And it is both unethical and illegal to knowingly allow someone to kill someone else. That is why therapists and attorneys have loopholes in their confidentiality agreements with their clients to allow them to report potential crimes they're aware of before they happen.

    So I do think Lee could be charged, I am not sure how I feel about if I think it was a moral or immoral decision or not. But I do hope that if Allison happens to dream about it then she doesn't give him too hard of a time about it, she has walked a fine line with vigilante justice herself.

    I do feel bad about an undercover cop getting killed by a vigilante who assumed he was a sex offender.
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  • Avatar of agent_0042

    agent_0042

    [17]Mar 30, 2010
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    netgoddess -- I totally agree with you on your point there about Allison. Given all of the vigilante stuff that she's done, she really wouldn't be within her rights to complain about Scanlon doing something like that.
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