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BBC (ended 2012)

Episode 5x02 'Arthur's Bane Part 2' discussion thread.

  • Avatar of boom-moo

    boom-moo

    [1]Oct 12, 2012
    • member since: 02/05/07
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    Please post your opinions/comments/discussion topics on episode 5x02 "Arthur's Bane Part 2" here.

    -Spoilers are not allowed.
    -Bashing ships/characters is not allowed.
    -Discussion is welcome, arguing is not.
    -Trolls won't be fed, ignore and report it is.
    -Be respecful, keep it cool.



    Thank you

    (As per usual, I'll open a discussion thread for every new episode every Friday and keep it locked until Saturday. Past experience shows that comments posted before the episode airs tend to spoil the episode for spoiler free people and also, episode discussion threads that are opened days before their airing date tend to end up buried and reopened by different users which leads to confusion and clutter. Any comments regarding this episode should be done in the Spoilers thread until the episode has aired. Thank you.)

    __________________

    5x02 Masterlists:

    Episode 5x02 magic and spells:
    -The Euchdag covers Gwaine in darkness so the Saxons don’t find him.
    -Merlin dismounts one of Ragnor’s men using a spell.
    -Merlin makes the edge of the ice ledge fall using a spell.
    -Ruadan opens Sefa’s cell using a spell.
    -Ruadan unlocks a door using a spell.
    -Ruadan conjures fire using a spell.
    -Ruadan turns water into ink using magic.
    -Ruadan summons a raven using a spell.
    -Merlin stops Aithusa’s fire using magic and speaks to her in Dragonlord language twice.
    -Morgana throws a flying dagger at Arthur using a spell and hurts him several times with it using magic.
    -Morgana throws Merlin up in the air and knocks him out against a wall using magic.
    -The Euchdag heals Merlin.

    Episode 5x02 RIP list:
    -Some of Ragnor’s men killed by Arthur.
    -Several Camelot knights killed by Ruadan.
    -Ruadan, killed by a Camelot knight.
    -Several Saxons killed by Percival and the other slaves.

    Episode 5x02 Lives Saved list:
    -Arthur saves Merlin’s life by preventing Ragnor from killing him.
    -Mordred saves Arthur’s life by preventing Morgana from killing him.

    What Arthur calls Merlin:
    -Stupid.

    What Merlin calls Arthur:
    -Nothing.

    Times Sir Leon says “Sire”:
    -0.

    Liar, liar:
    -Gwen lies to Sefa about her being executed.
    -Gaius lies to Gwen about not being an expert in the Druidic runes.

    Arthur's attributes to being the great king of legend:
    -He is able to come up with a plan to escape from Ragnor.
    -He spares Mordred’s life in return for the kindness he’s shown him and Merlin while being Ragnor’s captives.
    -He is able to come up with a way to get inside the fortress of Ismere.
    -He tells Percival that he wouldn’t leave them there and the first thing he asks upon finding him is about Gwaine and the rest of his men.
    -Arthur pulls Merlin and places him behind him so Arthur is bringing the rear when they turn back and escape from Aithusa’s attack.
    -He goes after Merlin when Merlin decides to go after Aithusa.
    -He tells Morgana that he has gone to Ismere to free his men, that he is sorry for what Uther did to her and that despite everything they remain brother and sister.
    -He is upset that Morgana is using her power “to do nothing but hate”.
    -He rewards Mordred for saving his life by making him a Knight of Camelot.

    Arthur is knocked unconscious or prevented from knowing about Merlin's magic:
    -Arthur is sleeping when Mordred and Merlin talk about magic.
    -Arthur is distracted fighting when Merlin dismounts one of the Saxons using magic.
    -Merlin blocks Arthur’s view as he breaks the edge of ice ledge using magic.

    What Arthur says about magic:
    -Nothing.

    Potions made by Gaius:
    -A potions so Sefa’s execution would be easier to bear.

    Gaius's smacks:
    -None.

    'I have faith Arthur makes a great king' statements:
    -None.

    Merlin and Great Dragon meetings:
    -None.

    Great Dragon's riddles:
    -None.

    Aithusa meetings:
    -Morgana (2 so far) after her nightmare she keeps Aithusa close and reassures her that everything is going to be alright.
    -Arthur, Merlin and Gwaine (1 so far) are attacked by Aithusa.
    -Merlin (2 so far) where he stops Aithusa’s attack, commands her in Dragonlord, cares about her state and tells her to hide from Arthur. -Morgana (3 so far) when they leave Ismere together.

    Morgana's premonitory dreams:
    -(Non-premonitory dream: Morgana dreams of her and Aithusa's imprisonment in a deep hole in the ground).

    Morgana's smirks of doom:
    -

    Arthur and Gwen moments:
    -Gwen refers to Arthur as ‘my husband’.

    Chestporns/Bodyporns:
    -Sir Gwaine’s and Sir Percival’s (along with the other captive men’s) chestporns.

    Dungeon time:
    -(Morgana) (Sir Gwaine, Sir Percival), Sefa.

    Fashion:

    Merlin:
    -Blue shirt, red scarf and brown jacket (day 1, 2, 3).
    -Saxon outfit (day 3).

    -Blue shirt, red scarf and brown jacket.

    Arthur:
    -Red padded shirt and chainmail (day 1, 2, 3)
    -Saxon outfit (day 3).

    -Red padded shirt and chainmail with Camelot cloak.

    Morgana:
    -Black dress (day 1 and 2).
    -Black dress and fur cloak (day 3).
    -Black dress.
    -Black dress and fur cloak.

    -Black dress and fur cloak.

    Gwen:
    -Off the shoulders red velvet dress (day 2).
    -Purple dress (day 2).
    -Blue dress (day 3).

    -Off the shoulders red velvet dress.

    Gaius:
    -Maroon robe (day 1, 2, 3).

    -Green robe.

    Edited on 10/21/2012 5:26am
    Edited 3 total times.
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  • Avatar of ACDiNosey

    ACDiNosey

    [2]Oct 13, 2012
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    Interesting episode. I can't say that I was grabbed by it or found it particularly interesting, but it was very interesting nonetheless...

    Alexander Vlahos is doing a sterling job as Mordred. He's got the stern, creepy look of young Mordred nailed but also a strong personality without having to say much. And good for Mordred that he's capable of thinking for himself and deciding what he judges to be best. I'd still like to know how this is all going to play out... It occurs to me that the vision Merlin had of the battle at Calaan doesn't look that dissimilar to the scene where Mordred strikes against Morgana... I can't help but thinking we are missing something. Arthur may well be about to kill someone else (maybe Morgana or Merlin if he's found about his magic maybe) and that Mordred intervenes... Ah well, we'll see.

    I'm not thrilled by the whole Morgana and Aithusa plot... I'd really like to know how she learnt her name The whole thing seems a bit weird, as we don't know why Aithusa decided to side with Morgana. I hope that gets adressed at some point...

    On a different note, the trailer for next week's episode looks amazing I'm really excited about that
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    boom-moo

    [3]Oct 13, 2012
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    Not as engaging as last week's indeed but still a nice watch.

    I agree that Alexander Vlahos is doing a fantastic job as Mordred, he can't be fully read which is gonna play great for the character Wow at stabbing Morgana and being knighted all in one episode

    I am quite amazed that Arthur has seen two creatures of magic in one episode! Pretty sure he won't ever mention them again though

    We were right about Gwen not going through with the plan to execute Sefa. I hope the actress returns, I think she was really good.

    I still think the Euchdag looks very out of place in Merlin, too sci-fi for my taste. I think that Aithusa might have been able to talk before. She looked pretty miserable and sickly
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  • Avatar of xfairylightx

    xfairylightx

    [4]Oct 13, 2012
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    Not sure if I really enjoyed this episode.


    I don't like the fact that Mordred have stabbed Morgana on the back... I mean, if I didn't knew because of the spoilers, I would have been surprised but not any less dissapointed. It's good if he's not another Agravaine, but she was so happy to see him again. It feels wrong and I'm almost sorry for her for once...


    It's really look like he will be playing on both side this year, and even if it might be interesting to have Mordred and not knowing where his allegiance lay, I'm still not sure if I've much interested to watch that.


    I hope it wil not be all center around Mordred and what he will do next... What do he really want.


    Really happy with the tactic of Queen Gwen. It makes a lot of sense that she will act like that. It was obvious that Ruadan would die this episode, but how many characters have died in 5 seasons? Not surprise at all


    A bit dissapointed that Merlin is so willing to kill people now. So much for a character who is supposed to be only gold-hearted. It's really of the dark side of him.


    Love this scene with Arthur and Morgana. It was a little sad, because Arthur really wants to know... and there is nothing he can say to make her change her mind. She's gone too far, and I can't believe we wil see a redemption eventually for her. It would not be believable.


    The scene with Aithusa and Morgana at the beginning was good. Morgana seems to care a great deal for the dragon but it's this really genuine ? I mean, the dragon did save her but did she do that for her own gain so she the dragon will stay on her side or did she really care for Aithusa ?! Not sure... Same thing about Mordred when she saw him. The bond was obviously still there as she recognised him really quickly and all, she seems to be happy he survived but because she still care or because it give her another ally ? Yet, when he told her he had Arthur in his grace, she really go crazy so maybe it's was not genuine -_- ...


    Love the fact that Arthur's bane is Arthur himself.


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  • Avatar of ACDiNosey

    ACDiNosey

    [5]Oct 13, 2012
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    xfairylightx wrote:

    A bit dissapointed that Merlin is so willing to kill people now. So much for a character who is supposed to be only gold-hearted. It's really of the dark side of him.

    I don't think Merlin is particularly keen to kill people. However, he is really really scared of Mordred, because of what Kilgarrah and the visions told him. As I said above, I think we're missing something, but I guess I can understand his point of view... By not killing him, he's running the risk of his fears becoming reality. However, it's clear to me that now Mordred is a knight, there's no chance Merlin is going to try and murder him...

    I see what you mean about feeling sorry for Morgana. For once, I'm going to compliment Katie and say she did a good job looking totally demented in that dinner table scene.
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  • Avatar of Connor91

    Connor91

    [6]Oct 13, 2012
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    I was a bit underwhelmed by the episode, Merlin does this great job of building up these epic life-or-death situations but then the 'climax' is always completely underwhelming ala


    a) Merlin hides behind something and uses magic or


    b) Someone turns on Morgana at the last minute


    Ireally liked the scenes between Ruardon and Sefa, its nice to see people who aren't necessarily 'evil' but have chosen their sides and have retained humanity. Also loved the Arthur/Morgana scene.


    Katie's acting has also improved a LOT. Watching her play a manic Morgana would have been painful duing s1 or 2.


    Edited on 10/13/2012 2:15pm
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    PenguinSuzie

    [7]Oct 13, 2012
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    What a wonderful episode. I loved it!


    Mordred is brilliant! I really liked how they rounded out all of the bad guys. Rauden was likable in that his goal was more about peace than revenge. Sefa is not going to be pleased with Camelot now. I thought it was all very well done, the scene where he died was very emotional, realistic and moving.


    The Euchdag does look a bit too sci-fi for a setting like Merlin, but I like her (I think it's a her anyway).


    I think something bad may have happened to Aithusa's throat, maybe there's some physical reason why she can breath fire but not speak. Maybe a damaged voice box or something. I really enjoyed her this episode, I was pleasantly surprised at the lack of malicious intent towards Merlin and that was quite a nice scene. They really did make Morgana a bit less of a one dimensional villain this ep, though she's still completely gone. It was nice to see her emotional and that scene where she saw Mordred and welcomed him was great.


    Just like we thought Gwen wasn't really planning to kill Sefa. It was nice to see Gwen taking a sympathetic view towards magic users and what they've been through. I really liked that Gwaine didn't try to hurt the Euchdag and what she said about him was nice. I do hope there's some talk of the dragon in the next episode, but I don't think there will be, I guess we'll probably be expected to assume that those worries happened off screen. Lots of great Arthur and Merlin scenes.


    I don't think that Merlin is eager to kill, he let Mordred go several times and is getting scared that what he fears is about to happen soon.

    Edited on 10/13/2012 2:28pm
    Edited 3 total times.
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  • Avatar of boom-moo

    boom-moo

    [8]Oct 13, 2012
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    Connor91 wrote:
    I really liked the scenes between Ruardon and Sefa, its nice to see people who aren't necessarily 'evil' but have chosen their sides and have retained humanity.
    Me too, they kind of stole the episode for me. They are far more interesting characters than 100% evil ones or 100% good ones.
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  • Avatar of Connor91

    Connor91

    [9]Oct 13, 2012
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    boom-moo wrote:
    Connor91 wrote:
    I really liked the scenes between Ruardon and Sefa, its nice to see people who aren't necessarily 'evil' but have chosen their sides and have retained humanity.
    Me too, they kind of stole the episode for me. They are far more interesting characters than 100% evil ones or 100% good ones.

    I agree, I do love Darth Morgana destroying/hating/screaming at everything but part of me wishes she had been more like Ruardon/Sefa, at least in s3/4.
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    PenguinSuzie

    [10]Oct 13, 2012
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    That scene with a caged Morgana and Aithusa. Was anyone else reminded of that scene in 'Interview with a Vampire' with Claudia and that woman in the hole with the light coming down?
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    dinamo

    [11]Oct 13, 2012
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    Even though I thought it was quite sad I was glad to see that scene at the beginning with Aithusa and Morgana.It makes a bit more sense of the bond that they were there together. They could have been captured together somehow, and spent two years down there together keeping each other going. It was nice to show a bit of Morgana's humanity with aithusa in the bedroom before she went totally manic with Mordred about what she wanted to see happen to Arthur. It might mean she'll finally get back to having more to her personality than just evil kill stab evil evil all the time.


    Overall I quite enjoyed the episode I was glad that for once Merlin wasn't able to colapse a ceiling on someone to stop them hurting Arthur. I don't know how I feel about the Mordred stabbing Morgana bit, if he does unite in the future with Morgana how is he ever going to get her to forgive him for that, given thats probably the closest she's got all along to actually killing Arthur?

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  • Avatar of boom-moo

    boom-moo

    [12]Oct 13, 2012
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    dinamo wrote:

    They could have been captured together somehow, and spent two years down there together keeping each other going.

    I had the same feeling watching the episode (before I had always thought that maybe Aithusa rescued her). I hope they go back to that time and give us a bit more info. I guess that being confined in a prison hasn't given Aithusa the chance to properly grow up and develop. That would explain her pityful state.
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    dpebbleson

    [13]Oct 13, 2012
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    I actually liked this episode better than the previous one. High points:

    - Exactly demented Morgana at the table as AC noticed: at one moment I was really stunned at her reaction. Excellently played, and yes, shows a person who is definitely "losing it". And no, no redemption on the way.

    - The scene with Mordred stabbing her was so much like Darth Vader turning on the Emperor, very similar.

    - On the other hand, Arthur and Merlin reminded me of Frodo and Sam masked in Orc attires, going through Mordor

    - I also didn't like the alien creature, not only because it's Sci-Fi, but because the creature was unsuccessful CGI.

    - Mordred is a grand new (old) character, brilliantly played. There's definitely an ulterior motive in his decision to stab Morgana in the back. He prevented her from killing Arthur but didn't kill her. And the sight of her going with Aithusa reminds me of those beaten villains escaping only to recuperate. I guess Mordred will witness some of Arthur's trials for magic users and increasingly come to believe that magic must be made legal. At the same time he'll probably differ about the way in which to bring it. He might end up as yet another Morgana...

    - I also suspect that Mordred might be the death of Arthur, while Morgana may be the death of Mordred. She will not forget what he did to her. And one of the last scenes might as well be only Morgana and Merlin on the battlefield, both defeated in a way.

    All in all an excellent episode, and the next one seems even more exciting!!!
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    boom-moo

    [14]Oct 13, 2012
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    Are you gonna take care of Morgana's dreams and smirks of doom this season, DaNko? We are doing episodic lists again
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    dpebbleson

    [15]Oct 13, 2012
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    boom-moo wrote:
    Are you gonna take care of Morgana's dreams and smirks of doom this season, DaNko? We are doing episodic lists again


    Ah yes, I forgot! Of course!

    Morgana's dreams in this episode:

    - Morgana dreams of her and Aithusa's imprisonment in a deep hole in the ground.

    ---

    Lmao at raven mail! Also, the scene with raven coming to Morgana reminded me of a similar scene in 'The Curse of Cornelius Sigan'.
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    boom-moo

    [16]Oct 13, 2012
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    Thank you

    Morgana wasn't just all cray about Arthur, she didn't give a toss about Sefa's life, how insensitive was that? I wished that Ruadan would have stood up for his daughter in front of Morgana.
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    dpebbleson

    [17]Oct 13, 2012
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    boom-moo wrote:
    Thank you

    Morgana wasn't just all cray about Arthur, she didn't give a toss about Sefa's life, how insensitive was that? I wished that Ruadan would have stood up for his daughter in front of Morgana.


    She's even worse than Uther I suppose. I seriously can't see a redemption, but who knows, Morgana is known by the swift and unexpected personality twists...
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    dinamo

    [18]Oct 13, 2012
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    boom-moo wrote:
    dinamo wrote:


    They could have been captured together somehow, and spent two years down there together keeping each other going.


    I had the same feeling watching the episode (before I had always thought that maybe Aithusa rescued her). I hope they go back to that time and give us a bit more info. I guess that being confined in a prison hasn't given Aithusa the chance to properly grow up and develop. That would explain her pityful state.


    Yes, I thought initially that Aithusa might rescue Morgana. But after watching the episode that's clealy not what happened. I wonder if they'd been seeing a lot of each other, perhaps Aithusa went back to see if morgana was okay after she healed her and so on. Maybe when Morgana was being captured by whoever took her prisoners Aithusa came to try and help but was just too young to be able to do anything about it. I think with enough armed men a little dragon could have been taken (especially as she'd be smaller than she is now if she was taken with Morgana two years ago, andI can't imagaine anyone trying to capture someone like Morgana without at least asmall army of armed men).


    Plus being kept down there all that time in that small space without sunlight and probably being tortured or knowing Morgana was being tortured must have damaged her. Also no one came for her so its possible that she also sticks with Morgana because at least Morgana was there and they clearly must have got out together. It would also explain her decision to stay with Morgana perhaps if it was morgana who managed to break them out of there.


    One thing I really liked about this episode was that Ruadan died. Not because I wanted him to or anything but it wss nice to see someone who's magic couldn't do everything it seperates them from people like Morgana, Merlin, Nimueh, Morgause, who seemd to be able to do most things. I wish they could show more of that, where people have specific skills with magic. We've seen some of it but not anything explicit like that to say he doesn't have such powers.

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    boom-moo

    [19]Oct 13, 2012
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    My guess is that they were captured together. When they met each other they both seemed in great need of company and affection so I think that they stuck together.
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    yafu2

    [20]Oct 13, 2012
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    I liked the episode, but I don't see why Arthur made him a Knight and it makes no sense that he did so based just on the fact he saved his life. Also I'm a bit frustrated at how they seem to like to rewrite things that happened in past seasons. "Remember what the dragon said Arthur would meet his end at the hands of a Druid." No, the dragon said Arthur would meet his end at the hands of Mordred.


    I liked how they did the Athusia story as it seems there is a strong bond there and them being held captive together explains that. I think it will be interesting to see how Athusia and Merlin work around that since it appears he still has dragon lord powers over her.


    This wasn't the best episode, but it was pretty good.


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