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BBC (ended 2012)

Rewatching Merlin Week 19 - Episode 1x02 Valiant

  • Avatar of dpebbleson

    dpebbleson

    [1]May 7, 2010
    • member since: 11/06/09
    • level: 24
    • rank: Golden Girl
    • posts: 5,655

    Seeing as we had a 9 long month hiatus ahead, rewatching Merlin seemed like a great idea to deal with the withdrawal. Everyone is most welcome to join and leave their comments on the episode that is currently being rewatched. I think it is interesting how perspectives change once the show has progressed and we've gotten the chance to know the characters better. It is also funny to realize how we are able to catch up on new things when we watch the episodes over again.



    People who found interesting to put their views in common so far are:



    Episode Rewatching Thread wrote:
    boom-moo.
    illegalferret.
    ericsprau.
    merlinrules09.
    dpebbleson.
    TheCloser4eva.





    Episodes Rewatched so far wrote:
    Week 1. 1x01 The Dragon's Call (boom-moo).
    Week 2. 1x11 The Labyrinth of Gedref (illegalferret).
    Week 3. 1x09 Excalibur (dpebbleson).
    Week 4. 1x10 The Moment of Truth (ericsprau).
    Week 5. 2X10 Sweet Dreams (TheCloser4eva).
    Week 6. 1x13 Le Morte D'Arthur (boom-moo) .
    Week 7. 2x07 The Curse of Cornelius Sigan (ericsprau). .
    Week 8. 1x04 The Poisoned Chalice (illegalferret). .
    Week 9. 2x08 The Sins of the Father (dpebbleson). .
    Week 10. 1x08 The Beginning of the End (boom-moo).
    Week 11. 1x12 To Kill the King (illegalferret).
    Week 12. 2x09 The Lady of the Lake (ericsprau).
    Week 13. 1X06 A Remedy to Cure All Ills (dpebbleson).
    Week 14. 2x03 The Nightmare Begins (merlinrules09).
    Week 15. 1x07 The Gates of Avalon (TheCloser4eva).
    Week 16. 2x02 The Once and Future Queen (boom-moo),
    Week 17 2x12 The Fires of Idirsholas (ericsprau)
    Week 18 2x07 The Witchfinder (illegalferret)





    Rules are as follows:

    1. We got started on the first Saturday of 2010 and a new thread with a new episode choice will be open every Saturday. We are following the order in the list above to open threads and we are selecting the episodes in a random order, so all 26 episodes of both series are up to be picked anytime.

    2. Everyone should copy and paste the information in this entry (Introduction and Rules) when opening a new thread. Make sure to add the episode of your choice in the list above. Keeping track of the turns and our progress will be useful when we have rewatched a bunch of episodes already and having the rules at hand will be useful for those who join us half way through.

    3. Agreed that we all sometimes just don't have the time or the inclination to leave comments, we'd like to make clear that it's not compulsory to rewatch and/or comment on every single episode.

    4. Anyone is most welcome to join at any time. The Moderator (boom-moo) will make sure to add new members to the list so they have their chance to choose an episode.

    5. If you don't own the DVDs or the episodes, don't let that stop you from joining. Feel free to pm boom-moo so she can give you a link to a site where to watch them online

    6. Should anyone have any doubt, do not hesitate to pm boom-mo.



    This week, we are rewatching Season 1 Episode 02

    Valiant

















    (Disclaimer: No copyright infringement intended when posting these pictures. Merlin is property of BBC and Shine Ltd.)


    Here it goes, my summary for this episode. It isn't exactly my favourite, but hey, there aren't many left. If I had to choose what made sense with my previous choices, I would have chosen the previous choice, done by Sarah. But now I tried to choose something at the very beginning so as we could see how much the friendship between Arthur and Merlin evolved over the episodes.


    1) From loathing to true friendship


    2) From mistrust to distrust


    Just a few, you name the others. In fact, that's what I am asking from you, fellow 'forumers', to note what has changed in the friendship between Arthur and Merlin, from the smallest to the largest things. This is not obligatory, of course Just a matter of free will and a little time


    The meeting between Merlin and the Dragon - the first one, I guess. Much has changed since then as well. Bear in mind Kilgarrah's grand plan was in production since day one of their meeting, so it's interesting to see how the Dragon started all the manipulation.


    Also, in this episode we had one of those interactions between Arthur and Morgana, which later on disappeared.


    And while I don't like the episode as much as I like some other, I must note it has some sort of medieval atmosphere together with a specific music that is used for the depiction of the period in films and other series. We had another tournament in Season 2, but here it was done more seriously sort-of. We could also argue how much Arthur's swordmanship developed ever since.


    Once again, after the overture in 'The Dragon's Call', this is really in many ways the first episode, in which the development of the characters and their mutual relationships starts. By the time we got to the last episode of season 2 (which I suggested be re-watched the last), a lot changed.


    And if that change feels natural then the writers+cast were successful. I could say they were. All in all, things weren't so rushed from these first moments to those last we are struggling to get through our re-watches. I can think of only one relationship that was rushed, but that belongs to another thread, and a lot of discussion has been about that.


    And that would be that!


    Enjoy!






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  • Avatar of boom-moo

    boom-moo

    [2]May 8, 2010
    • member since: 02/05/07
    • level: 75
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    *scratches episode from her list of next choices* Oh well, we are twins for a reason, I guess

    Sadly I have a super busy weekend ahead (I'm leaving in a few hours and won't be back until Sunday night) so I'll do my best to rewatch and comment as soon as possible.
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  • Avatar of pcdsa

    pcdsa

    [3]May 8, 2010
    • member since: 01/03/10
    • level: 12
    • rank: Evil Bert
    • posts: 1,558

    I really enjoyed this episode mainly because after episode one Arthur is arrogant and a prat and though he continues to be so in this episode he listens to and believes his new servant. As opposed to Uther who wouldn't believe a servant even after many years of loyal service. Arthur must have known this but he stood up in front of everyone. Yes he thought he had Ewan as a witness and when he heard he hadn't he did look worried but he still said he believed Merlin. He was humiliated and he apologised which was a big thing to do. I completely understood his anger at Merlin and "It didn't go exactly to plan" was a bit of an understatment but Merlin is always the optimist. Loved the dejected Arthur sitting on the table after he sacked Merlin. And Arthur admitted he still believed Merlin but he had to fight just to prove he was worthy to be a future king.


    We got the brilliant line from the Great Dragon "a half cannot truly hate that what makes it whole." Shared destiny...love it!!!


    Enjoyed all the comic touches thoughout the episode - too numerous to mention but I'm sure Esther will cover most of them.

    Hated the snake when it was listening in at Arthur and Merlin's conversation - just too creepy. When it struck Ewan in Gaius' chamber was also horrible.


    Also it was good they changed Gaius' wig - the first one just doesn't look right now that I'm used to Martin...


    ----


    (Yes I don't mind being added to the list for another rewatch though I don't think you will get to me. I originally declined because I wasn't sure if I would be always available for my turn. I now realise that the list is very flexible in that you can miss a turn or swap with someone else.)

    Edited on 05/08/2010 4:40am
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  • Avatar of boom-moo

    boom-moo

    [4]May 8, 2010
    • member since: 02/05/07
    • level: 75
    • rank: Rowdy Roddy Piper
    • posts: 135,683

    pcdsa wrote:
    Enjoyed all the comic touches thoughout the episode - too numerous to mention but I'm sure Esther will cover most of them.
    Lol



    pcdsa wrote:
    (Yes I don't mind being added to the list for another rewatch though I don't think you will get to me. I originally declined because I wasn't sure if I would be always available for my turn. I now realise that the list is very flexible in that you can miss a turn or swap with someone else.)



    The new schedule is as follows:



    Episode Rewatching Thread wrote:
    illegalferret - May 1st (week 18 ).
    dpebbleson - May 8th (week 19).
    TheCloser4eva – May 15nd (week 20)
    pcdsa – May 22th (week 21).
    boom-moo – May 29th (week 22).
    Illegalferret – June 5th (week 23).
    Ericsprau – June 12th (week 24).
    Merlinrules09 – June 19th (week 25).
    dpebbleson - June 26th (week 26)
    (Follow up in case we need to skip people)
    TheCloser4eva.
    pcdsa.
    boom-moo.
    illegalferret.
    ericsprau.
    merlinrules09.
    dpebbleson.
    TheCloser4eva.
    pcdsa.

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  • Avatar of pcdsa

    pcdsa

    [5]May 9, 2010
    • member since: 01/03/10
    • level: 12
    • rank: Evil Bert
    • posts: 1,558

    Some superficial differences and similarities:


    Arthur wouldn't be seen buying Merlin a drink so he had to go to another kingdom in 2.13 for that to happen.


    Merlin hated 'the armour' here but has 'grown to care for it a lot' in 2.13.


    Morgana found Arthur annoying here but obnoxious in 2.10.


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  • Avatar of dpebbleson

    dpebbleson

    [6]May 9, 2010
    • member since: 11/06/09
    • level: 24
    • rank: Golden Girl
    • posts: 5,655
    Thanks, pcdsa for your notes!

    I've been like an irresponsible father to this thread - making it, and not attending to it

    Is this the last episode where someone actually tried to woo Morgana? Correct me if I'm wrong.

    @ Esther: Heh, it's becoming really hard picking the right episode, with so few left. And it's even harder when you have a forum-twin

    @pcdsa: I forgot - yeah, it seems that Arthur is more trusting to his servants in his really young age, compared to Uther who knows Gaius for who knows how many years... Now, Arthur may be a bit gullible, but Uther is way too cautios...
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  • Avatar of illegalferret

    illegalferret

    [7]May 10, 2010
    • member since: 05/16/07
    • level: 25
    • rank: Coconut Phone
    • posts: 4,912

    Yay, old school Merlin, well sort of! Like the rest of you this isn't one of my faves, sorry Danko for picking your choice last week but Eric nicked my choice the week before!


    There's a couple of nice points in this episode which i spotted on the rewatch, there's the first flash of real friendship between them just for a second after they've been talking to Valiant and Merlin calls him a "creep" as he walks off, both boys laugh and just for a second you can see the friendship before Arthur becomes all lord and master again. Also noticed a link between this episode and last week's rewatch in this one Merlin just wants to prove his point but by 2x07 he's learnt about the importance of having Proof! We also get a little peak at Morgana's gift, she sees Arthur die whilst fighting Valiant, i never spotted this before and i just thought it was quite interesting!


    It was fun watching this old one again, and thinking about how much everything has changed between this one and where we are now with all the characters.

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  • Avatar of boom-moo

    boom-moo

    [8]May 12, 2010
    • member since: 02/05/07
    • level: 75
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    Super late here, sorry about that But I'm adding pics and all to make up for it

    I like the teaser in this episode a lot. A knight with no qualms whatsoever joins a tournament that is held in Camelot. Can you tell exciting? The music as Valiant approaches Camelot and pretty much through the episode is magnificent!

    One random thing I like is the small shields that the tournament participants hand over to take part and that will appear in the panel to schedule the fights. I dunno if it was actually done like that but it's a nice idea.

    Does Valiant wear Arthur's hunting vest when he is not in his chainmail? I've seen an extra wear it before Arthur does, and the one Valiant wears looks really similar as well.

    Do you hear clanging? Lol, poor Merlin. Arthur has a lot of fun messing with him in that training scene but if I were Arthur, I'd train fighting some Camelot knight so my swordfighting skills don't go rusty. Lol at Gaius smacking Merlin at the back of the head. He is really cute stretching his arms though. And lol at the stretching sound, so farfetched.

    Oh lookie! There was a time when Merlin's pants used to semi-fit him! I like it that he goes to Gwen for help and aww at Gwen saying it's sad that she knows everything about armour. Anyone thinks that's meant to make her all pure and innocent in the light of the future Arthur/Gwen romance? Although wait, Lancelot is her first love. Meh.

    Yeah Arthur, you don't get nervous, we can tell

    I love Uther's cloak shot as he enters the arena, awesome photography bit.

    Alright, Uther's speech starts "Knights of the realm, bla, bla..." Now, which realm? Camelot? There are 24 participants in the ring, does Camelot have so many noble families somewhere? Now, did I get it wrong of Knight Valiant says he is from the Western Isles? Does Camelot have islands as part of the kingdom too?

    1,000 gold pieces sounds like an awesome reward, by the way!

    Lol, Valiant is such a flirt. He doesn't lose a second to flirt with Morgana, and she is so pleased about it. Guess Uther's ward doesn't get much of a chance to do some flirting after all, unless it's with Arthur who wouldn't openly reckon he does too.

    dpebbleson wrote:
    Is this the last episode where someone actually tried to woo Morgana? Correct me if I'm wrong.
    I think it is. Unless you count freaky Alvarr Not sure Valiant does it for the right reasons either, he seems to love wealth and fame more than anything.

    Uther's speech is pretty cool and at the same time pretty harsh. Not an exact quote but something like: "It is in combat the nature of a true knight is revealed, whether if he is a coward or a warrior." Gaius was right in that Arthur has his duties, obligations and responsibilities too. Mucking out horses is not fun, but risking your life in combat once and again, always trying to make Uther proud and setting an example is not much funnier. "I trust you will make me proud." Way to add pressure, Uther

    I love it that Arthur looks worried and scared as opposed to Valiant, who counts on his shield to give him confidence.

    Photobucket



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    Merlin rooting for Arthur is so cute!

    Lol at Valiant defeating Andreas Petrides.

    illegalferret wrote:
    there's the first flash of real friendship between them just for a second after they've been talking to Valiant and Merlin calls him a "creep" as he walks off, both boys laugh and just for a second you can see the friendship before Arthur becomes all lord and master again.
    I love that to bits too! Arthur gets off his high horse and shares a nice friendship glimpse with his servant for a bit. If they wouldn't have done the reset after series 1...

    Photobucket

    I have to ask Merlin how to wash clothes without water, pretty handy in winter when laundry takes a while to dry off The trick never gets old for me though, makes me smile everyt time.

    "To lose is to be disgraced." "I couldn't agree more." Oi, I really feel sympathetic towards Arthur and his role as a prince in this episode.

    Lol at Arthur being jealous of Valiant and Morgana's flirt, I love the faces he pulls as he is waiting in the line and their little exchange afterwards. And Uther is so sharp acknowledging him with a cold "Arthur" and even looking away as he says it. He should be more supportive of his son.

    I wonder why Arthur's armour is kept in the armoury (other than for Merlin to realize there's something odd about Valiant's shield) if he is competing the next day. We usually see Merlin cleaning it and fixing it in Arthur's room. I thought that maybe all the contestants had to leave their armours in the same place so they could check each other's sets and make sure they fit whatever standards there could be. However, it would be easy to savotage them too if anyone has easy access. And then we see Valiant keeping his shield inside his locked room. Just another random thought.

    I like it that Arthur is impressed at Merlin's ability to clean and fix the armour and clothes on his own (I am unobservant like this, but I thought that the hoodie thing was part of the chainmail). It's nice of him to voice it up, even if it's more a genuine sign of astonishment than a complement. But then of course, he goes on to tease Merlin "let's see if you could get me into it without forgetting anything" "that was much better, not that it could get any worse" or something like that. It's too early yet but we see glimpses that Arthur can be on and off his self righteous position, unlike Uther. And Merlin seems to be getting to see Arthur right because he doesn't look annoyed and still he says a "god luck" and roots for him most happily "it isn't totally horrible all the time." Slashy much?

    I can't get over how absolutely adorable a meatier Colin was.

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    I love it that Merlin's first thought after he finds out about Valiant's shield is to go and warn Arthur. And I love it too that Arthur trusts the word of a servant (again unlike Uther) and that Merlin beams when Arthur says so. It turns out a bit of a fiasco since Ewan dies but still Arthur's true nature shows.

    "I wouldn't lie to you." Oi Merlin. You would soon enough, for the greater good and the right reasons but still.

    Shallow bit here but the lighting in this episode is pretty cool, Arthur looks so fair and gorgeous when he summons the court to reveal Valiant's trick.

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    I can't imagine how tough and embarrassing must it be for Arthur to apologize in front of everyone. I can't think of anything that would hurt his pride more than looking like a coward. I love it how Morgana feels for him as he leaves with his head down and of course, Merlin's look to Valiant.

    "We can still expose Valiant." Whoa, Merlin is stubborn and optimistic, isn't he? He's just been yelled at by a super pissed off Arthur and he never gets a straight answer from the dragon but still he carries on seeing some light at the end of the tunnel.

    "You've got the wrong person!" I love it how Colin delivers that line and also the dragon's "if only it were so easy to escape one's destiny" and of course "a half can not truly hate that which makes it whole."

    dpebbleson wrote:
    The meeting between Merlin and the Dragon - the first one, I guess. Much has changed since then as well. Bear in mind Kilgarrah's grand plan was in production since day one of their meeting, so it's interesting to see how the Dragon started all the manipulation.
    Now, had the dragon planned it all long ago so he is finally released and can get his revenge on Uther (not giving a darn about Arthur, Merlin and land where magic is not banned any longer) or does he truly care about the kingdom's destiny?

    No, I didn't stare at Merlin's bum when he carts the dog sculpture into his bedroom, no.



    Photobucket

    illegalferret wrote:
    We also get a little peak at Morgana's gift, she sees Arthur die whilst fighting Valiant, i never spotted this before and i just thought it was quite interesting!
    Morgana's dream is really interesting indeed but it is not premonitory though. What she sees isn't part of the Valiant/Arthur swordfight footage that happens afterwards. Is it just a common nightmare or her premonitory skills are still in the making and not fully accurate yet?

    I think it is kind of sad to see Arthur training at night and charging at thin air. He has more resons than ever to win this tournament, and he looks so alone.

    But he is not alone. Merlin already cares a big deal about Arthur and goes to him again even though Arthur has sacked him and told him to get out of his sight. I mean, not everyone would have worked up the nerve to do what Merlin did. Go Merlin!

    "I can't withdraw or lead men into battle if they think that I am a coward." It is Arthur's duty to fight and lose his life if required, even knowing that Valiant is cheating.

    I love the scene where Arthur goes to arena, looks around and ends up staring at his father's empty seat. The pressure on him is huge, the support and understanding almost none and Valiant creepily sharpening his word and watching him makes the scene really powerful. It's a great and really intense build up to the final fight.

    I also love that Morgana, despite her flirting with Valiant, shows genuine worry about Arthur throughout the episode. She is the only one to openly do so aside from Merlin. I love it how she goes help him get dressed, which is actually an excuse to be there for him and let him know he is loved and cared about. I guess that Arthur needs some concentration before the battle, but he looks really alone which is really sad.

    Another random bit: I had noticed Morgana's woolen lavender gloves before but not Gwen's. Gwen's are that warm, they looks like the same fabric her white undertunic things is made of, but still she has some. Which also sets the action of the episode around winter time. 1x11 looks like winter time too. I guess a series is more or less a year in real life or something.

    Wow at Arthur's look up to the sky and to his father after defeating Valiant. Intense.

    "Like I needed any help." Lol, Morgana and Arthur teasing/flirting were too cute together.
    dpebbleson wrote:
    Also, in this episode we had one of those interactions between Arthur and Morgana, which later on disappeared.
    Yeah, I can live without the flirting but the brother/sister teasing was too cute to have dropped it. Only similar scene that comes to mind is in 2x11 when Morgana tries to prevent Arthur from finding Alvarr's camp, when they pull a face at each other.

    And something else I really love is Arthur telling Merlin that he made a mistake and that it was unfair to sack him. Uther would never recognize that much or apologize, let alone to a servant (well, he does apologize to Uther in 2x09 and I think he kinda apologizes some other time I can't quite remember right now), which again shows Arthur is already a better man and would make a better and more fair King.

    I think I am forgetting something though...

    Oh yes, does anyone spot anything familiar here? :

    Photobucket

    Oh, and lookie at Colin's ear piece thingy (not that he has much text to deliver in that scene but hey):

    Photobucket

    That wasn't what I think I'm forgetting though...

    __________

    (Disclaimer: No copyright infringement intended when posting these pictures. Merlin is property of BBC and Shine Ltd.)
    Edited on 05/12/2010 4:40am
    Edited 2 total times.
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  • Avatar of pcdsa

    pcdsa

    [9]May 12, 2010
    • member since: 01/03/10
    • level: 12
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    • posts: 1,558

    I remember in 2.05 that Uther only wanted knights from noble stock - and considering they have an endless supply of them because they are always getting killed off, having 24 participants sounds reasonable. I wonder why he is called Knight Valiant and not Sir Valiant (as too Lord Bayard of Mercia in 2.04 and not King Bayard)?


    The Dragon, without self interest, has warned Merlin of Mordred killing Arthur when he is king and Morgana turning to evil. Yes he is manipulative but he didn't have to say anything on those occasions. So it isn't black and white with him.


    Esther do not understand what you mean about last two pics.


    Edited on 05/12/2010 11:52am
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  • Avatar of boom-moo

    boom-moo

    [10]May 12, 2010
    • member since: 02/05/07
    • level: 75
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    pcdsa wrote:
    I remember in 2.05 that Uther only wanted knights from noble stock - and considering they have an endless supply of them because they are always getting killed off, having 24 participants sounds reasonable.
    Lol, that's true. We never hear of them though. They should have helped defend Camelot in 2x13.

    pcdsa wrote:
    I wonder why he is called Knight Valiant and not Sir Valiant (as too Lord Bayard of Mercia in 2.04 and not King Bayard)?
    Yeah, guess he is not noble or something *shrugs* Here is something interesting, a map taken from the Merlin stickers album. Apparently Mercia is not a kingdom, but there's a Caerleon one. The Western Isles are nowhere in sight though.

    pcdsa wrote:
    The Dragon, without self interest, has warned Merlin of Mordred killing Arthur when he is king and Morgana turning to evil. Yes he is manipulative but he didn't have to say anything on those occasions. So it isn't black and white with him.
    I think it's almost impossible not to have an agenda after having been kept prisoner for over 20 years. I would too be manipulative, even if for the right reason. And I do see myself sending all to hell and just seeking revenge once the agenda has been fulfilled.

    pcdsa wrote:
    Esther do not understand what you mean about last two pics.
    In the pic with Gaius we can see the erm... what is that called? The thingy Merlin uses to pour Morgana's poison into in 2x12. And in the pic with Merlin, he is wearing one of those little earbuds they use to get their lines or whatever they listen to through them.
    Edited on 05/12/2010 1:36pm
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  • Avatar of illegalferret

    illegalferret

    [11]May 12, 2010
    • member since: 05/16/07
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    That map iss nice that it shows where everything is in relatation to everything else. Maybe the Western Ilse are like attached to someone elses land a bit like Britain's got the Falkland Islands? It also makes Camelot look pretty big, but we must also remember that you can get to any of those places in less than 2 days


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    boom-moo

    [12]May 12, 2010
    • member since: 02/05/07
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    It's pretty neat indeed to get a picture of where those locations are. I'm not sure if the show and the sticker album share any kind of resemblance but hey, it is official Merlin stuff so I guess continuation should be in order, although I wouldn't be my money on it.
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  • Avatar of pcdsa

    pcdsa

    [13]May 13, 2010
    • member since: 01/03/10
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    Agree the map is very nice. Regarding Mercia, it probably explains why Bayard is a lord and not a king. Do you think the Western Isles is the one above The Isle of the Blessed? There is a picture of excalibur covering the name.


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    dpebbleson

    [14]May 13, 2010
    • member since: 11/06/09
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    I like the map very much! Camelot is not so small, yet it's not a very big kingdom yet. It has potential which Arthur will use to conquer everything around him!

    Uhm, I meant to say, unite everything around him...
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    boom-moo

    [15]May 13, 2010
    • member since: 02/05/07
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    pcdsa wrote:

    Agree the map is very nice. Regarding Mercia, it probably explains why Bayard is a lord and not a king. Do you think the Western Isles is the one above The Isle of the Blessed? There is a picture of excalibur covering the name.


    I think so, well spotted, thank you

    I still wonder who and where from those other 3 kings who met in Camelot in 2x10 were, what King Odin's kingdom is called and who rules the Kingdom of Caerleon. Cenred's kingdom seems to be called just Kingdom of Cenred. No sign of the border town of Engerd, the Forest of Merendra or the Feorre Mountain in Cenred's kingdom where Balinor dwelled. Or the Tunnels of Andor.

    But it looks like there is still enough land around to bring new people (and or threats) to Camelot.
    Edited on 05/13/2010 12:39pm
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  • Avatar of illegalferret

    illegalferret

    [16]May 13, 2010
    • member since: 05/16/07
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    dpebbleson wrote:
    I like the map very much! Camelot is not so small, yet it's not a very big kingdom yet. It has potential which Arthur will use to conquer everything around him! Uhm, I meant to say, unite everything around him...


    Haha!!


    You're so right though, Camelot is really well positioned to just conquer everyone else, or get conquered!

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  • Avatar of pcdsa

    pcdsa

    [17]May 13, 2010
    • member since: 01/03/10
    • level: 12
    • rank: Evil Bert
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    dpebbleson wrote:
    It has potential which Arthur will use to conquer everything around him! Uhm, I meant to say, unite everything around him...


    I'm sure that was deliberate - stirring again! Conquer, Conquer???? Unite is more like it considering this version of Merlin is more pc!!!


    boom-moo wrote:
    I still wonder who and where from those other 3 kings who met in Camelot in 2x10 were, what King Odin's kingdom is called and who rules the Kingdom of Caerleon. Cenred's kingdom seems to be called just Kingdom of Cenred. No sign of the border town of Engerd, the Forest of Merendra or the Feorre Mountain in Cenred's kingdom where Balinor dwelled.


    I too wonder about the other kings and whether we will see the King of Caerleon. Didn't Aulfric and Sophia say they were travelling from Tirmawr to Caerleon? Wasn't Balinor hiding deep in Cendred's kingdom? So the places you mention may be off the map. Also the map seems to be for series 1.

    Edited on 05/13/2010 1:26pm
    Edited 2 total times.
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    dpebbleson

    [18]May 13, 2010
    • member since: 11/06/09
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    Well, I haven't stirred in a long, long time, and missed my 'PCDSA calls me The Big Stirrer' time


    Although, Arthur IS warrior! Of course, by some negotiations he will unite with another kingdom... through some alliance he will also be united... by some marriage to a princess it is also very viable for Arthur to unite two kingdoms...


    I guess it's a Camelot-centric map, with other kingdoms being out of sight, but very important, since it's all sort of a peninsula of something, reminds me of the Shire in the Lord of the Rings - the Sea is to the west, and the landmass to the east.


    I'm just expecting them to introduce Morrrdorrr!


    And yeah, I noticed about Cendred's kingdom being kingdom of Cendred, like the man has a kingdom after his own name!


    Edit: @ illegalferret - the kingdom either conquers or is conquered by other. Nice catch! No wonder Uther is so paranoid. Camelot has, like, a dozen of different neighbours, including bordering kingdoms, magical fortresses, enchanted forests, druids - Uther must keep it all together, because if some alliance was formed, Camelot would be under attack from all directions! Yeah, it's easier this way for Camelot to become the central capitol of Albion, but it's also much easier to attack, besiege and whatnot.


    I expect that under a serious offensive, Arthur would just have to accept the hand of the neighbouring state's princess... Poor Guinevere!

    Edited on 05/13/2010 1:53pm
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    boom-moo

    [19]May 13, 2010
    • member since: 02/05/07
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    pcdsa wrote:
    Didn't Aulfric and Sophia say they were travelling from Tirmawr to Caerleon?
    Yeah, I think they said they had relatives there. Makes sense because the route makes them cross Camelot.

    pcdsa wrote:
    Wasn't Balinor hiding deep in Cendred's kingdom? So the places you mention may be off the map. Also the map seems to be for series 1.
    They said it was a bordering town, I assumed it was bordering with Camelot. But yeah, it reflects series 1 so that could be why so many places are lacking. Even the Isle of Mora is mentioned, which I guess is a reference to Lady Helen of Mora.

    dpebbleson wrote:
    I guess it's a Camelot-centric map, with other kingdoms being out of sight
    I thought so, they just made it the center of the map because it is the main focus but not getting the full picture we can't really tell how well or bad positioned it is. Having bordering kingdoms can be both a bless and a curse though: easy to have some control, hard to defend it.
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    pcdsa

    [20]May 14, 2010
    • member since: 01/03/10
    • level: 12
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    dpebbleson wrote:
    Although, Arthur IS warrior! Of course, by some negotiations he will unite with another kingdom... through some alliance he will also be united... by some marriage to a princess it is also very viable for Arthur to unite two kingdoms... ... Poor Guinevere!


    Sniff, sniff, where's the foot-tapper?


    I think that there could be an invader like the Saxons and the kingdoms unite to defend their land and then they decide one king / leader will make the land stronger - sword in the stone to decide - King Arthur - united Albion. I know a bit similar to movie Tristan and Isolde (2006), whose story I understand influenced the Arthurian love triangle.

    Edited on 05/14/2010 9:17am
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