Monk Forums

USA (ended 2009)

Anyone else think Monk is starting to go downhill?

  • Avatar of jbj4ever

    jbj4ever

    [21]Aug 18, 2007
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    I agree that it's going downhill. Most of the time I don't even remember to watch it...

    It's becoming more and more detached from reality with every new episode. The plots are unbelievable, way too "out there" even for Monk. The characters appear & disappear for no reason (does Julie even live with Natalie anymore??).

    I still watch once in a while because I love Tony Shalhoub and the character that is Adrian Monk - but the detective part of the show is just plain ridiculous these days.

    Edited on 08/18/2007 1:45pm
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  • Avatar of Phoenix911983

    Phoenix911983

    [22]Aug 18, 2007
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    Yea last nights episode wasn't good at all...The part where Monk kept saying the door was locked and went hysterical had me begging that Monk wouldn't get saved rather than laughing
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  • Avatar of dman_dustin

    dman_dustin

    [23]Aug 18, 2007
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    ixmattxi wrote:
    PikeBishop wrote:

    Another Aye vote here.

    I almost turned off last night's episode in the first ten minutes. Buried Treasure? Like Monk would ever fall for any story concocted by those three stoner idiots? I think I actually cringed.

    Oh yeah and the tenuous unbelievable tie in to a supporting cast member that they have been over playing recently (Captain's girlfriend, Julie's beau, Shrink's son etc.).

    And lets add another to last week's show, the incredibly unbelievabley barely possible let alone plausible tie-in to the secondary plot. Julie's tee shirt just happens to have caught the one in a ninteen billion chance image that needs to be destroyed by the villain? Puh-leez!

    Yeah, stuff like that is getting really old, really fast. Next week Harold Krenshaw is somehow tied to a murder. Last year it was Randy's uncle (despite the fact that the show previously stated Randy does not have an uncle). Its sad to see what once was a great show stoop so low. The shark is getting nearer and nearer.

    If randy had an Aunt any man she marries automatically becomes Randy's uncle. Look at the on where Randy's mom's Husband murdered that guy. Randy was already calling the guy his step-father

    I don't think next week's previewhad anything to do with Harold being tied to a murder. It's possible he's just there just to make Monk upset and blame Harold for a murder even though, he doesn't even think about it.

    And Mr. Monk and the buried treasure wasfine. The point of Monk listening to the "stoners" was becauseMonk wanted to help out his psychiatrist.

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  • Avatar of ixmattxi

    ixmattxi

    [24]Aug 21, 2007
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    dman_dustin wrote:
    If randy had an Aunt any man she marries automatically becomes Randy's uncle. Look at the on where Randy's mom's Husband murdered that guy. Randy was already calling the guy his step-father
    If I remember right, Randy said he spent summers on his uncle's farm as a child in that episode. And doesn't it seem strange if Randy's "uncle" was the guy his aunt recently married between Seasons 3 and 4, that the guy would leave Randy everything he owns in his will?
    Edited on 08/21/2007 2:43pm
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  • Avatar of dman_dustin

    dman_dustin

    [25]Aug 21, 2007
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    ixmattxi wrote:
    dman_dustin wrote:
    If randy had an Aunt any man she marries automatically becomes Randy's uncle. Look at the on where Randy's mom's Husband murdered that guy. Randy was already calling the guy his step-father
    If I remember right, Randy said he spent summers on his uncle's farm as a child in that episode. And doesn't it seem strange if Randy's "uncle" was the guy his aunt recently married between Seasons 3 and 4, that the guy would leave Randy everything he owns in his will?

    A couple of possibilites: Randy's Uncle was sort of a black sheep, no one like to talk about him (until recently)or Randy's Uncle wasn't a direct uncle and could've been a great uncle or something like that. Or the final possibility if Randy did say he didn't have an uncle in a previous episode then it could've been a scripting error; well as long as he didn't dwell on the fact he didn't have an uncle

    Or the least likely: The writers didn't care what the previous episode said and decided to go on with it. Writers make mistakes.

    Edited on 08/21/2007 7:19pm
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  • Avatar of hsimpson44

    hsimpson44

    [26]Aug 21, 2007
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    I dont think its going downhill but basically my opinion means nothing because I just started watching the day Season 6 started therefore I've only seen like four episodes from Season 5 and all so far from 6 (Except "and the Rapper") but the episodes I've seen I really like even thow the solutions are kinda easy to figure out, unlike Psych.
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  • Avatar of Kaze_no_Mirai

    Kaze_no_Mirai

    [27]Aug 22, 2007
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    If people think the show is horrible why post here or watch it. I know that you can dislike it but why bother if you don't like it. A few times is okay, but jeez some people are overboard. There are other shows I dislike or used to like but don't watch, but I don't go to their forums and start bashing them. Someone here mentions Monk as a "caricature" of himself but praises Psych. Have you seen his Psychic "episodes"? Talk about a "caricature"!
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  • Avatar of ixmattxi

    ixmattxi

    [28]Aug 22, 2007
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    The difference is context. Monk has become a caricature of himself. Watch seasons 1-3.0. Monk was a man first, an obsessive compulsive patient second. That has changed. He is driven only by his fears. The writers have taken all reality and relatability from the character in order to add a few more gags.

    Psych on the other hand, intentionally makes Shawn act as a cariacture of psychic as the character...well, fakes to be a psychic, doesn't take his job seriously at all, and just does it to have fun.

    Do you see the difference in context?

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  • Avatar of mistyann21

    mistyann21

    [29]Aug 23, 2007
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    The show is still one of my favorites on tv. The only thing that annoys me about it is half the time they show you who did it at the very beganning so there IS no real mystry to it, you just have to wait till they figure it out.
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  • Avatar of MrsLopsided

    MrsLopsided

    [30]Aug 23, 2007
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    Monk is still a much watch in our house but this season is, so far, a disappointment. Plots are thin, Monk fixates on his newest phobia for 50 minutes and gets around to focusing and solving the crime in the last 10 minutes. Randy Disher and Stottlemeyer are now background characters with little to contribute to the plot and Natalie puts it all together.
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  • Avatar of Kaze_no_Mirai

    Kaze_no_Mirai

    [31]Aug 24, 2007
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    ixmattxi wrote:

    The difference is context. Monk has become a caricature of himself. Watch seasons 1-3.0. Monk was a man first, an obsessive compulsive patient second. That has changed. He is driven only by his fears. The writers have taken all reality and relatability from the character in order to add a few more gags.

    Psych on the other hand, intentionally makes Shawn act as a cariacture of psychic as the character...well, fakes to be a psychic, doesn't take his job seriously at all, and just does it to have fun.

    Do you see the difference in context?



    The show's context doesn't take away Shaun's ridiculous acting and his "caricature". Have you ever seen any people who really have a number of strong phobias? Monk isn't that far off, sure it's exaggerated but not by that much.

    How can you say that Monk is only driven by his fears? almost as if you didn't see today's episodes. He got over his fear of heights for a while and was driven to go fight to protect Natalie.
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  • Avatar of BTRAV

    BTRAV

    [32]Aug 25, 2007
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    He always gets over it at least momentarily to help someone (usually Natalie).
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  • Avatar of Avivaldi72

    Avivaldi72

    [33]Aug 26, 2007
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    The only thing I don't care for this season is how stupid they are making Randy. Granted, he's not a genius, but, how did he make it to Liuetenant if he is this stupid? The soft-drink thing just ticked me off - that was inane.
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  • Avatar of rockon1215

    rockon1215

    [34]Sep 7, 2007
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    I actually like the new episodes, though I agree they have taken a more comical turn than mystery lately. That will probably change come the winter episodes.
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  • Avatar of dman_dustin

    dman_dustin

    [35]Sep 8, 2007
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    rockon1215 wrote:
    I actually like the new episodes, though I agree they have taken a more comical turn than mystery lately. That will probably change come the winter episodes.

    When USA said that next friday's episode was the season finale, didn't they mean mid season or did they actually mean season season. Because it confuses me sometimes that they call it that.

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  • Avatar of BruceRM

    BruceRM

    [36]Sep 8, 2007
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    Beginning with Season 5, Monk has clearly, blatantly began declining in quality. The plots are thin, bordering on asinine, and as pointed out previously the characters have become caricatures of themselves. Disher is the best example. His role has become nothing more than saying or doing something stupid each episode in a lame attempt at creating quirky comic relief. Suddenly Disher drinks dozens of huge 20 oz. sodas every day and has to urinate all the time? Suddenly Disher has to read off words while listing letters in which those letters are silent ("T as in tsunami"). And they've turned Monk into a joke. He remembers his birth and is scared of nakedness because the doctor slapped him when he was born? What the hell. Go watch an episode from Season 1 or particularly Season 2, when the show really came into its own, and you can't honestly say the show has not seriously declined in quality.

    So far every single episode of Season 6 has been utterly worthless. Tonight's episode, Mr. Monk and the Wrong Man, was almost painful to watch. From the very beginning, was there ANY doubt whatsoever that the guy freed based on DNA evidence really did do it and Monk was right all along? Plus, the real Monk wouldn't have been groveling to apologize to the guy; rather, he would have spent the whole episode trying to prove that he had been right all along. Plus it was clear that the guy was convicted on evidence other than blood, so why would the fact that the blood wasn't his be exculpatory at all? I'm a lawyer, and I assure you that in real life, it wouldn't be. The Rapper episode was miserable. The "Birds and the Bees" episode with Julie's t-shirt was equally terrible (and as pointed out, the same plot M.O. behind the millionare mugger episode). Monk would fall for the teenager's story in the "Buried Treasure" episode? If so, then Monk is a moron and the show no longer has purpose. The mysteries have become lame and unoriginal. The solutions are not clever in the least and are for the most part coincidental (that is, the case is solved due to some improbable concidence, not Monk's power of thought or brilliant observation).

    Unless things turn around real quick, I hope this is the last season of Monk. They should go out before it gets considerably worse.

    And whether Monk is declining has absolutely nothing to do with Psych or Shawn Spencer. Incidentally, I think Psych is declining in quality as well. The first half of season 1 was great, ever since then it's become boring and derivative of itself. Zero character development, and no continuing explanation as to why Shawn needs to keep up the psychic front with the police. He's proven himself, he could be a paid consultant (like Monk is). But that's another post for another forum.
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  • Avatar of ixmattxi

    ixmattxi

    [37]Sep 9, 2007
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    BruceRM wrote:
    And whether Monk is declining has absolutely nothing to do with Psych or Shawn Spencer. Incidentally, I think Psych is declining in quality as well. The first half of season 1 was great, ever since then it's become boring and derivative of itself. Zero character development, and no continuing explanation as to why Shawn needs to keep up the psychic front with the police. He's proven himself, he could be a paid consultant (like Monk is). But that's another post for another forum.


    Bruce, we've had this discussion. Its already been established that if he revealed himself to be a fake psychic, every person who was convicted on evidence he found would be subject to mistrial. Any private client Shawn took would be able to sue him and collect damages for misleading them (regardless of results). And Shawn would be liable to face criminal charges for fraud (and trust me, no matter how much Chief Vick is in his corner, if dozens of murders suddenly got mistrials because of Shawn's act...the D.A. would be forced to charge Shawn for political reasons).
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  • Avatar of BruceRM

    BruceRM

    [38]Sep 9, 2007
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    Actually it's quite the other way around. Shawns "psychic visions" are unreliable as a matter of law for purposes of establishing probable cause. For example, the police could NEVER have gotten a search warrant for the chop shop in "zero to murder in 60 seconds" based on shawn's vision. However, if he told them the actual clues he found, the deductions made from those actual clues, and the conclusions established, probable cause could be established. As it stands, everyone in prison based on shawns' psychic visions alone has had their fourth, fifth, and sixth amendment rights violated (you can't confront psychic visions). If Shawn came out and said he was a real detective, he would not be in trouble, and nobody would get out of prison.

    As for those people who paid for him as a psychic to handle their private cases, you can't sue someone for fraud because they're not really a psycic. It's understood that paranormal services are for entertainment purposes only. It's like suing a horoscope writer for giving a false reading. Come on. You can't do it. Anyone who did would be thrown out of court.

    And yes, I am a lawyer.
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  • Avatar of BruceRM

    BruceRM

    [39]Sep 9, 2007
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    As an aside, if you watch the Psych pilot, at the very beginning, shawn is calling in reports to the police. He is watching the news and "solving" crimes by noticing that someone is shifty-eyed. He doesn't even say that, he just says "It was the stereo salesman." If a person called such a report in to the police, without corroboration or explanation, or even admitting it is based on the mere appearance of guilt/lying, it would not amount to probable cause. They sometimes got around this by saying the guy confessed as soon as he was asked about his involvement. If there is a (voluntary) confession, then the rest typically doesn't matter.

    If any of the people Shawn Spencer has caught actually went to trial, shawn's testimony would be inadmissible as a matter of law. As a lawyer, I'd love to get to cross examine shawn in a "daubert hearing" to establish his psychic credentials, the reliability of his psychic visions, the method he employs, and the scientific basis behind it. I'd get shawn and everything he offered during the entire investigation thrown out of court as it's completely inadmissible (exactly like lie detector test results -- total junk science). To the extent the police relied upon any of it, their deductions would also be inadmissible (for the most part). Most of the people Shawn caught, unless the admitted to the crime, would get off with a half-decent lawyer.

    However, if Shawn were merely a Monk-like consultant not relying on paranormal, unscientific devices, his testimony would be permitted and criminals would not be going free.

    What about the police departments who occasionally use psychics in real life? They are only used to locate things (missing people, missing gun, dead body, etc.). Not to deduce the guilt of specific individuals.
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  • Avatar of lovemj

    lovemj

    [40]Sep 10, 2007
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    First off, to the people who are upset at some of the critical posts, there's nothing wrong with fans expressing an opinion. While I have a problem with people who are NOT fans of a show coming to a fan forum and posting (usually inflammatory) posts, I don't have a problem with fans posting their concerns and criticisms.

    As to the underlying message - is Monk declining...I think it is. Last season I stopped watching all together. It wasn't so much because I 'hated' the show, but more that I was really busy, and it was no longer a show I 'had' to watch. I saved them on my TiVo and had a little mini marathon this summer before the new season started. When the season started, I watched the first episode live (I always TiVo them). Then the next week came, and I had been really busy so I had a lot built up on my TiVo, and decided to watch other things. I built up about 4 episodes (i.e. a month's worth) before I had another little mini-marathon.

    What's my point: Monk used to be the type of show I couldn't wait for - the type that I looked forward to every friday. Starting about 2 years ago, I wouldn't watch it live, and I'd usually watch it two days later, on Sunday, when I was doing some work around the house. Last season, I didn't say to myself 'wow, I don't like Monk.' But I didn't have a drive to watch it. I stopped watching with about five episodes left in the season. Now, I still 'liked' Monk, so I didn't delete them from my TiVo, and eventually (3 months later) I sat down and enjoyed them. But I'm starting the trend again - loading up on episodes and then watching them all at once.

    What it comes down to is I still LIKE the show, and am still a FAN of the show. But, whereas before it was so well written that I couldn't wait to watch it, now, I don't feel the need to watch it right away and, often times, I don't get around to watching it for several weeks. That doesn't mean I don't like it, it just means that it's not AS GOOD as it once was.

    Feel free to tell me I have no business posting here, and should just die in a fire.
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