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Was rurouni kenshin ever on adault swim?

  • Avatar of GK-37

    GK-37

    [41]Aug 26, 2007
    • member since: 07/28/06
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 35
    ensatsu-ken wrote:
    GK-37 wrote:

    First off, thanks, this argument was getting repetitive. I'm only going to mention one point (and please don't expect me to reply if you reply) I just think that under the basis that Rurouni Kenshin is so heavily based in relationship development it would have been nice to have a little more complexity within the dialog which i found to be somewhat static.


    Many animes such as FLCL, FMA, Eureka Seven, and Cowboy Bebop are also very focussed on characters and their relationships. Each of these shows have had very entertaining dialog. This is because the dialog in these series is very character oriented. Also, the characters in these series are far more abstract than those in Rurouni Kenshin. Also, character relationships aren't very tight in Rurouni Kenshin. Even in FMA, which has the least character interaction of the aforementioned animes, all of the characters are laced together in a complex web in which no character is beyond weakness, immaturity, or uncertainty. As a result, the conflicts in the show give life to the dialog. In Rurouni Kenshin, the dialog never reaches this level. Rather, they take a very simple minded approach to dialog. Flawed characters are simply presented to us, and their problems are then dealt with. It is simply a matter of question and answer. There is no true interactivity or immersion in the dramatic dialog, it is just a morality lesson.

    But that is exactly where you are wrong. The dialouge in Rurouni Kenshin is done very well in the manga and the English dubs. However, if all you have watched are the mediocre subs, then of course the dialouge will seem static. No offense, but I have seen the subs, and the people subbing it don't do a very good job of translating the dialouge into English standards/equivalents of speaking (equivalent to what the characters sound like to Japanese speaking audiences). The English dubs which you have clearly not listened to very much of, does a much better job at this. And BTW, it is indeed Steven Jay Blum who performs Shishio's voice in the TV dub (he is the same guy who does Spike's voice in Cowboy Bebop, and Mugen's voice in Samurai Champloo). Of course if you're comparing it to Cowboy Bebop, then even FMA feels lackluster in its dialouge, in comparison. The only other anime that has a dub of great dialouge quality, is Yu Yu Hakusho (arguable the second best; second being that it comes to be the best, right after Cowboy Bebop, which is the best dub that I have ever heard). So therefore, if you have not seen more than a few episodes of the dub (and the editted version does not count), or if you have not read the manga, then you are in no position to be calling RK's dub lackluster in its dialouge (or the Japanese version for that matter; because it just so happens to be a fact that the subs are not done that well). Like I said, the manga and dub of the anime have very brilliant scripting, and the dialouge is even above that of FMA's (which has great voice acting, but mediocre dialouge/scripting for most of the characters, aside from Ed, Roy Mustang, and Scar).

    First off, i watched all of the episodes in the uncut dub. And I was very bored by it. Characters often repeat themselves, saying phrases that mean the same thing consecutively. Also, there is too little meaning in the dialog. In FLCL the dialog is filled with meanings and implications that change with every seperate line. I have seen some of Yu Yu Hakusho and i also thought that dub was quite thin and blunt. The dialog in Rurouni Kenshin and Yu Yu Hakusho is always geared towards getting the point accross, it is all quite preachy and one sided. It seems the writers are unable to present us with the facts of a world, they just want to push their own point. It makes it feel as though they don't respect me enough, or they think that i am some sort of idiot that needs to be spoon fed. It's aggravating. In FLCL and FMA they present us with a world and let us figure out our own interpretation. They don't push points, they just tell a story.

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  • Avatar of ensatsu-ken

    ensatsu-ken

    [42]Aug 26, 2007
    • member since: 10/24/06
    • level: 19
    • rank: Fall Guy
    • posts: 6,686
    GK-37 wrote:
    ensatsu-ken wrote:
    GK-37 wrote:

    First off, thanks, this argument was getting repetitive. I'm only going to mention one point (and please don't expect me to reply if you reply) I just think that under the basis that Rurouni Kenshin is so heavily based in relationship development it would have been nice to have a little more complexity within the dialog which i found to be somewhat static.


    Many animes such as FLCL, FMA, Eureka Seven, and Cowboy Bebop are also very focussed on characters and their relationships. Each of these shows have had very entertaining dialog. This is because the dialog in these series is very character oriented. Also, the characters in these series are far more abstract than those in Rurouni Kenshin. Also, character relationships aren't very tight in Rurouni Kenshin. Even in FMA, which has the least character interaction of the aforementioned animes, all of the characters are laced together in a complex web in which no character is beyond weakness, immaturity, or uncertainty. As a result, the conflicts in the show give life to the dialog. In Rurouni Kenshin, the dialog never reaches this level. Rather, they take a very simple minded approach to dialog. Flawed characters are simply presented to us, and their problems are then dealt with. It is simply a matter of question and answer. There is no true interactivity or immersion in the dramatic dialog, it is just a morality lesson.

    But that is exactly where you are wrong. The dialouge in Rurouni Kenshin is done very well in the manga and the English dubs. However, if all you have watched are the mediocre subs, then of course the dialouge will seem static. No offense, but I have seen the subs, and the people subbing it don't do a very good job of translating the dialouge into English standards/equivalents of speaking (equivalent to what the characters sound like to Japanese speaking audiences). The English dubs which you have clearly not listened to very much of, does a much better job at this. And BTW, it is indeed Steven Jay Blum who performs Shishio's voice in the TV dub (he is the same guy who does Spike's voice in Cowboy Bebop, and Mugen's voice in Samurai Champloo). Of course if you're comparing it to Cowboy Bebop, then even FMA feels lackluster in its dialouge, in comparison. The only other anime that has a dub of great dialouge quality, is Yu Yu Hakusho (arguable the second best; second being that it comes to be the best, right after Cowboy Bebop, which is the best dub that I have ever heard). So therefore, if you have not seen more than a few episodes of the dub (and the editted version does not count), or if you have not read the manga, then you are in no position to be calling RK's dub lackluster in its dialouge (or the Japanese version for that matter; because it just so happens to be a fact that the subs are not done that well). Like I said, the manga and dub of the anime have very brilliant scripting, and the dialouge is even above that of FMA's (which has great voice acting, but mediocre dialouge/scripting for most of the characters, aside from Ed, Roy Mustang, and Scar).

    First off, i watched all of the episodes in the uncut dub. And I was very bored by it. Characters often repeat themselves, saying phrases that mean the same thing consecutively. Also, there is too little meaning in the dialog. In FLCL the dialog is filled with meanings and implications that change with every seperate line. I have seen some of Yu Yu Hakusho and i also thought that dub was quite thin and blunt. The dialog in Rurouni Kenshin and Yu Yu Hakusho is always geared towards getting the point accross, it is all quite preachy and one sided. It seems the writers are unable to present us with the facts of a world, they just want to push their own point. It makes it feel as though they don't respect me enough, or they think that i am some sort of idiot that needs to be spoon fed. It's aggravating. In FLCL and FMA they present us with a world and let us figure out our own interpretation. They don't push points, they just tell a story.

    OK, putting Rurouni Kenshin aside for a second, you have just proven to me that you know VERY LITTLE about dubbing, and have seen very little of the YYH dub. No offense, but now I know that you are only trying to be "right." First of all, the quality of a dub is PURELY opinion, so there is no right or wrong (I hope you realize that). However, you say that YYH only tries to get the point across ? First off, it just so happens that many voice actors of the FMA dub, have participated in various roles of the YYH dub as well (Shura had Al's VA, Russel Tringum's VA played Yusuke, Armstrong's VA was Raizen, etc.). Yusuke uses a brilliant dialogue scheme of sarcasm and humor, while still holding the same meaning of the Japanese dialogue, and YOU have no argument against that. Do you even know what substance is? Or are you just going by what everybody else says, by saying only the more popular anime with more recognized dubs have good dialogue ? I really know now how very little appreciation you have for a good dub. Tell you what, watch episodes 72-74, as well as episode 96 of Yu Yu Hakusho (since these are the only ones that I can find online at the moment; and they can be found at www.myspace.com, if you search for the episode). Watch 1 or 2 of those episodes, and then give me your argument for saying that YYH's English dialogue is thin ?Also, go to any YYH fan, and ask them what they think, and I guarantee you that any of them who actually HAVE seen the English dub (a sufficient amount anyways, will back up exactly what I am saying).

    Now don't take this offensives, but if you can't see the beauty of the YYH dub, then you do sort of need to be spoon-fed. Answer me this, How is Sensui or Koenma's dialogue one-sided ? With Sensui, his voice is very calm, and humane, and this is very fitting of his character, since he is similar to Light, in that his goal does not necessarily have to be seen as evil. Things he sais about how humans can be the worst of all creatures, is quite true, even in our moder day world, and the dub does a very exceptional job of relaying this point across to the viewer. On top of that, the YYH dubs add in lots of additional humor and puns, which is something that the FMA dubs have NEVER done. I feel very hesitant to believe that you have seen every episode of the uncut Rurouni Kenshin dub, and it forces me to ask you this: Why would you watch EVERY EPISODE of a dub that you say you do not like ? You're entire argument is one-sided, IMO. You have provided no supporting examples from the dialogue of either series, and told me how it is one-sided to you. I will provide you with my example for how FMA has limited dialogue:

    Ed will always have something clear and concise to say, without the viewer having to ponder his words. Now, this is not necessarily a bad thing, but at the same time, his speech lacks depth. Whenever Yusuke sais something, whether it be sarcasm, or serious speech, he will not come right out and explain everything on his mind, but rather he will cleverly word his speech (and I appreciate his humor, especially in the dub), and leave the viewer with something to think or ponder about, in that his speech will have some suggestion of a deeper meaning (sometimes obvious, but it has a meaning beyond what he sais himself, which can also be heard by the brilliantly crafted tone of his voice). Another thing is that all of the voices for the main YYH cast, fit their respective characters, whereas I disagree with the VA choices for a few VAs in other dubs (for example, Winry sounds as though she's in her 20's, and Luci Christian's voice just does not fit Wrath, IMO; although that may have to do with the fact that I am used to her voicing Kaname Chidori in the Full Metal Panic! English dub).

    All in all, you have no supporting points in your argument which I agree with. At the very least, do what I said, and watch those said episodes of YYH in English on myspace, and then come to me with an argument of how it is blunt. At any rate, you cannot claim it has no substance when you see those episodes. Substance, in terms of voice acting, is the ability of the VAs to bring that character to life. If the voice acting is bad, I don't feel like the character is alive, but rather what's literally going on, in that I just feel that some guy or girl is cheaply doing some voice over for a character's lip movements. In the YYH dub, there is ltos of substance to it, and I forget that I'm watching an anime show for a second, and am immersed into the characters, and the episode, as the voice acting and dialogueare brilliantly crafted. In fact, YYH has one of the best dubs has I have ever seen. The only dub that is better, and the only one that I seem to completely agree with you on so far, is Cowboy Bebop, which has the most substance from its voice actors (although that's mainly thanks to the participation of Steven Jay Blum). I also have a thread on the YYH forum that I will link you to, and it will further explain my points, by having actual favorite lines from the dub, written down for you to view. I will find the link to it later.

    BTW, whatever happened to not replying ?

    Also, if you are going to respond to this post (which only pertains to YYH; and I know its off-topic, my apologies, but I decided to reply to you here), please post it in the YYH forum (you can create a new thread if you need to), because I no longer wish to stray off-topic on this thread. I would appreciate it if you could do that, even if this is a forum that is hardly used anymore (the YYH forum isn't much more active than this one, but at least it will be more on-topic there).

    Edited on 08/27/2007 12:39pm
    Edited 3 total times.
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  • Avatar of vampireXhunter

    vampireXhunter

    [43]Aug 27, 2007
    • member since: 08/27/07
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 77
    GK-37 wrote:
    ensatsu-ken wrote:
    GK-37 wrote:

    First off, thanks, this argument was getting repetitive. I'm only going to mention one point (and please don't expect me to reply if you reply) I just think that under the basis that Rurouni Kenshin is so heavily based in relationship development it would have been nice to have a little more complexity within the dialog which i found to be somewhat static.


    Many animes such as FLCL, FMA, Eureka Seven, and Cowboy Bebop are also very focussed on characters and their relationships. Each of these shows have had very entertaining dialog. This is because the dialog in these series is very character oriented. Also, the characters in these series are far more abstract than those in Rurouni Kenshin. Also, character relationships aren't very tight in Rurouni Kenshin. Even in FMA, which has the least character interaction of the aforementioned animes, all of the characters are laced together in a complex web in which no character is beyond weakness, immaturity, or uncertainty. As a result, the conflicts in the show give life to the dialog. In Rurouni Kenshin, the dialog never reaches this level. Rather, they take a very simple minded approach to dialog. Flawed characters are simply presented to us, and their problems are then dealt with. It is simply a matter of question and answer. There is no true interactivity or immersion in the dramatic dialog, it is just a morality lesson.

    But that is exactly where you are wrong. The dialouge in Rurouni Kenshin is done very well in the manga and the English dubs. However, if all you have watched are the mediocre subs, then of course the dialouge will seem static. No offense, but I have seen the subs, and the people subbing it don't do a very good job of translating the dialouge into English standards/equivalents of speaking (equivalent to what the characters sound like to Japanese speaking audiences). The English dubs which you have clearly not listened to very much of, does a much better job at this. And BTW, it is indeed Steven Jay Blum who performs Shishio's voice in the TV dub (he is the same guy who does Spike's voice in Cowboy Bebop, and Mugen's voice in Samurai Champloo). Of course if you're comparing it to Cowboy Bebop, then even FMA feels lackluster in its dialouge, in comparison. The only other anime that has a dub of great dialouge quality, is Yu Yu Hakusho (arguable the second best; second being that it comes to be the best, right after Cowboy Bebop, which is the best dub that I have ever heard). So therefore, if you have not seen more than a few episodes of the dub (and the editted version does not count), or if you have not read the manga, then you are in no position to be calling RK's dub lackluster in its dialouge (or the Japanese version for that matter; because it just so happens to be a fact that the subs are not done that well). Like I said, the manga and dub of the anime have very brilliant scripting, and the dialouge is even above that of FMA's (which has great voice acting, but mediocre dialouge/scripting for most of the characters, aside from Ed, Roy Mustang, and Scar).

    First off, i watched all of the episodes in the uncut dub. And I was very bored by it. Characters often repeat themselves, saying phrases that mean the same thing consecutively. Also, there is too little meaning in the dialog. In FLCL the dialog is filled with meanings and implications that change with every seperate line. I have seen some of Yu Yu Hakusho and i also thought that dub was quite thin and blunt. The dialog in Rurouni Kenshin and Yu Yu Hakusho is always geared towards getting the point accross, it is all quite preachy and one sided. It seems the writers are unable to present us with the facts of a world, they just want to push their own point. It makes it feel as though they don't respect me enough, or they think that i am some sort of idiot that needs to be spoon fed. It's aggravating. In FLCL and FMA they present us with a world and let us figure out our own interpretation. They don't push points, they just tell a story.



    wow this is some argument that u guys have been havin . anyways i think that this is entirely up to your opinions on whois right or wrong. however if you don't mind a 3rd party perspective, then i would like to join in by giving an unbiased opinion on what i think.

    as for teh fma dubs not bein that good, im sorry esatsuken, but i got to go with GK on this one. the fma dubs are some of the best english dubbs that ive heard, but i agree with u enstsu that teh ppl who did winry's and wrath's voices didn't do too good of a job and that really pissed me off. i think that those were the only 2 voices holding the dub back though.

    as for rurouni kenshin dubs, im kinda inbetween here. i agree with GK that the dialouge was somewhat lackluster, however i have to ask what ensatsu asked as well: how exactly were they repetetive? i saw every episode to and i did not thik it was reppeative. now a for the voice acting, i gotta agree with ensatsu taht the VAs did a good job fitting the voices of teh characters, and how can u not like a dub with steven jay blum in it ? i agree that cowboy bebop is the best dub evahhh, and its all thaks to SBJ, and he did a great job with shishio's voice in RK as well, like ek said.

    as for rk not being mature, i have to agree with ensatsuken wholeheartedly on this one. GK, read the manga, and ull see that rk is prolly one of the most mature shounen series out there. the plot is actuall moving unlike in bleach, naruto, and inuyasha (and no offense, but i really hate bleach, i don't even see how someone can compare it to RK because its just the most overrated anime that ive seen, and it completely rips off ideas from yyh, even plot).

    and going into yyh, sorry GK, but i have to agree with EK on this one as well. YYH has one of teh best dubs taht ive heard along side fma and cowboy bebop and that is because of all of the reasons which ensastsu specified above, and good job EK, u summed up all of the best points . i also recomend that you do what he sugested, and watch 1 or 2 of those episodes. i personally recomend ep 74 because its a personal favorite of mine .

    also i also have to ask why u would watch all of the episodes of a dub u don't like. if it was 20 or something eps, then i could understand that u gave it a try and did no like it but why would u watch more if you already decided u don't like it ?

    anyways, i kind of inbetween both u guys arguments. u guys both have some strong points, and im saying this as an unbiased 3rd person opinion. so thats just my commentation on it.
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  • Avatar of ensatsu-ken

    ensatsu-ken

    [44]Aug 27, 2007
    • member since: 10/24/06
    • level: 19
    • rank: Fall Guy
    • posts: 6,686

    vampireXhunter wrote:
    wow this is some argument that u guys have been havin . anyways i think that this is entirely up to your opinions on whois right or wrong. however if you don't mind a 3rd party perspective, then i would like to join in by giving an unbiased opinion on what i think. as for teh fma dubs not bein that good, im sorry esatsuken, but i got to go with GK on this one. the fma dubs are some of the best english dubbs that ive heard, but i agree with u enstsu that teh ppl who did winry's and wrath's voices didn't do too good of a job and that really pissed me off. i think that those were the only 2 voices holding the dub back though. as for rurouni kenshin dubs, im kinda inbetween here. i agree with GK that the dialouge was somewhat lackluster, however i have to ask what ensatsu asked as well: how exactly were they repetetive? i saw every episode to and i did not thik it was reppeative. now a for the voice acting, i gotta agree with ensatsu taht the VAs did a good job fitting the voices of teh characters, and how can u not like a dub with steven jay blum in it ? i agree that cowboy bebop is the best dub evahhh, and its all thaks to SBJ, and he did a great job with shishio's voice in RK as well, like ek said. as for rk not being mature, i have to agree with ensatsuken wholeheartedly on this one. GK, read the manga, and ull see that rk is prolly one of the most mature shounen series out there. the plot is actuall moving unlike in bleach, naruto, and inuyasha (and no offense, but i really hate bleach, i don't even see how someone can compare it to RK because its just the most overrated anime that ive seen, and it completely rips off ideas from yyh, even plot). and going into yyh, sorry GK, but i have to agree with EK on this one as well. YYH has one of teh best dubs taht ive heard along side fma and cowboy bebop and that is because of all of the reasons which ensastsu specified above, and good job EK, u summed up all of the best points . i also recomend that you do what he sugested, and watch 1 or 2 of those episodes. i personally recomend ep 74 because its a personal favorite of mine . also i also have to ask why u would watch all of the episodes of a dub u don't like. if it was 20 or something eps, then i could understand that u gave it a try and did no like it but why would u watch more if you already decided u don't like it ? anyways, i kind of inbetween both u guys arguments. u guys both have some strong points, and im saying this as an unbiased 3rd person opinion. so thats just my commentation on it.

    Its not like I said that the FMA dubs were bad. I just said that they weren't the best, and lacked the substance of less recognized dubs. Its good to see that you have some appreciation for well-done dubs, rather than just the well-done ones for more popular anime. I personally feel that he dialouge of the English dub for Rurouni Kenshin, was much better than what the online subs had to offer (although I heard that the DVDs have much better subbing). The manga of course, had much better dialouge than either dub of the anime (IMO anyways). Speaking of Yu Yu Hakusho, I agree with you about episode 74; its a personal favorite of mine as well . The animation in that episode was great, and has held up well, and it gave you an idea of Sensui's motive. I personally think that most anime fans will only go by what other say about English dubs, even though those people (as I have seen from people I know personally), hardly know anything about dubs, and make lots of assumptions.

    Part of the beauty of the dubs for Cowboy Bebop and Yu Yu Hakusho, as well as Rurouni Kenshin, is that I really felt the impact of the characters emotions and actions. FMA did a good job of that too, its just not as good as every else praises it to be, IMO. At any rate, we weren't even supposed to be talking about dubbing. This is about whether Rurouni Kenshin is mature or not, and its simple, at the very least, to see that its far more mature that overrated anime series like Bleach and Inu-Yasha. I don't really have that much of a problem with Bleach, but it does take quite a few of its concepts/ideas from Yu Yu Hakusho, as so many other people have noticed and pointed out; but Inu-Yasha is the anime that I cannot stand. To me, it has to be the most overrated anime of all time, and I never liked it (not to say that I have a problem with people who do like it, as long as they aren't those annoyingly obssesive otakus/fanboys/fangirls ). It is extremely reppetative, as any common viewer can see. Hell, even if it was more mature that Rurouni Kenshin (and I have seen an adequate amount of IY, in both dubbed and subbed form, and aside from the annoying characters, the story just drags on, and their is nothing special about this anime that I can see, what so ever), which I do not feel that it is, I would rather have something good and less mature, than something more mature that's just plain garbage. Either way, I have found that pretty much every anime that has aired on AS within the last 1 to 2 years, with the exception of FMA, is overrated, and either extremely average, or complete crap.

    Still, I think its the fact that RK has attraced so many older readers and viewers, whereas you usually get a younger group of fans/audiences for other series, that kind of proves that its not really very appealing to children. And I know, because I never used to like it when I watched it on Toonami a few years ago as a kid. It was more appealing to me when I watched it a year ago. I have been into anime for over 5 years (technically I started watching anime almost 10 years ago on TV), but I didn't start getting into downloading (well, now I can only watch online) subbed anime that didn't air on common channels, or that didn't even air on North American television at all, until a few years ago. And I can say that most of the newer anime fans (who have probably gotten into anime through series like Naruto and Bleach) will usually prefer the more popular anime, rather than more classic ones like Rurouni Kenshin, in which story goes above just having good animation, and having everything else be mediocre. Most of the older anime fans will support me on this claim as well. Well, I suppose I got out of hand with that post, but I needed to get that off of my mind, because its been bugging me on a lot of other forums that I have gone to .

    Edited on 08/27/2007 4:28pm
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  • Avatar of GK-37

    GK-37

    [45]Aug 27, 2007
    • member since: 07/28/06
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 35

    I Just want to clarify my opinions on each of these points:

    Maturity: I was wrong if i said anything about Bleach being mature, but i Still think Rurouni Kenshin is immature for lack of general ambiguity. This lack is evident in many areas. For example, the dialog always seems to support the ideas of the episode they are in, rather than simply creating a story. I have watched many of the dubs recently to get a better perspective and while i can see how the show is fairly good at dialog and voice acting, it still seems as though everything was set up to support the themes of the episode, not creating a beleivable world. Also, Rurouni Kenshin isn't morally ambiguous. This limits the viewers ability to think about the content and draw their own interpertations. For example, the most motivation given to the two primary antagonists (fake batossai and second batossai) is revenge/power, both of which are extremely antagonized within the series (as ideas). Due to this lack of ambiguity, i cannot consider this a mature show.

    Dialog: Though the dialog was actually very serviceable, and the voice actors matched well, icannot consider it good dialog. The dialog in Rurouni Kenshin is consistantly and obviously oriented towards a concept and not to characters or setting. The characters are readilly treated as tools used to push a point through dialog. I do not like this kind of dialog because it seems amateur and simpleminded. It is easy to prove a point through the mouths of your characters, even the worst shows manage to do that all the time.

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  • Avatar of ensatsu-ken

    ensatsu-ken

    [46]Aug 27, 2007
    • member since: 10/24/06
    • level: 19
    • rank: Fall Guy
    • posts: 6,686
    GK-37 wrote:

    I Just want to clarify my opinions on each of these points:

    Maturity: I was wrong if i said anything about Bleach being mature, but i Still think Rurouni Kenshin is immature for lack of general ambiguity. This lack is evident in many areas. For example, the dialog always seems to support the ideas of the episode they are in, rather than simply creating a story. I have watched many of the dubs recently to get a better perspective and while i can see how the show is fairly good at dialog and voice acting, it still seems as though everything was set up to support the themes of the episode, not creating a beleivable world. Also, Rurouni Kenshin isn't morally ambiguous. This limits the viewers ability to think about the content and draw their own interpertations. For example, the most motivation given to the two primary antagonists (fake batossai and second batossai) is revenge/power, both of which are extremely antagonized within the series (as ideas). Due to this lack of ambiguity, i cannot consider this a mature show.

    Dialog: Though the dialog was actually very serviceable, and the voice actors matched well, icannot consider it good dialog. The dialog in Rurouni Kenshin is consistantly and obviously oriented towards a concept and not to characters or setting. The characters are readilly treated as tools used to push a point through dialog. I do not like this kind of dialog because it seems amateur and simpleminded. It is easy to prove a point through the mouths of your characters, even the worst shows manage to do that all the time.



    And that is pretty much what you said the last time, and the time before that. And then I would basically end up replying with my same argument against that. Basically, I think you get the idea that my opinion on RK in terms of maturity, are completely opposite from everything that you have stated. All of the stuff that you have said that make RK an immature series, are things that I disagree with you on, in the sense that while I agree those are qualities that make a series less mature, I see none of the negatives of what you mentioned to be contained in RK. Therefore, I think it is wise that we keep to our own opinions on this matter, rather than to needlessy, and senselessly argue on this issue, since it is clear that neither of us will reach an agreement.

    However, I hope that you realize that your views of being RK being an immature series, is PURELY based on your opinion (not to say that there may not be others who would agree with you, but at the same time it is only opinion, and not fact). In the same sense, I admit, even though most people would back me up on Ruoruni Kenshin being a much more mature series than what you would find out of most shounen, or any other manga/anime series for that matter, that is also opinion. If what we are arguing on is based on nothing more than opinion, and has nothing to do with actual facts that can be proven or disproven, then it makes no sense to continue arguing. So, in other words, I suppose we should just do what I said earlier, and agree to disagree.
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  • Avatar of GK-37

    GK-37

    [47]Aug 28, 2007
    • member since: 07/28/06
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 35
    ensatsu-ken wrote:
    GK-37 wrote:

    I Just want to clarify my opinions on each of these points:

    Maturity: I was wrong if i said anything about Bleach being mature, but i Still think Rurouni Kenshin is immature for lack of general ambiguity. This lack is evident in many areas. For example, the dialog always seems to support the ideas of the episode they are in, rather than simply creating a story. I have watched many of the dubs recently to get a better perspective and while i can see how the show is fairly good at dialog and voice acting, it still seems as though everything was set up to support the themes of the episode, not creating a beleivable world. Also, Rurouni Kenshin isn't morally ambiguous. This limits the viewers ability to think about the content and draw their own interpertations. For example, the most motivation given to the two primary antagonists (fake batossai and second batossai) is revenge/power, both of which are extremely antagonized within the series (as ideas). Due to this lack of ambiguity, i cannot consider this a mature show.

    Dialog: Though the dialog was actually very serviceable, and the voice actors matched well, icannot consider it good dialog. The dialog in Rurouni Kenshin is consistantly and obviously oriented towards a concept and not to characters or setting. The characters are readilly treated as tools used to push a point through dialog. I do not like this kind of dialog because it seems amateur and simpleminded. It is easy to prove a point through the mouths of your characters, even the worst shows manage to do that all the time.

    And that is pretty much what you said the last time, and the time before that. And then I would basically end up replying with my same argument against that. Basically, I think you get the idea that my opinion on RK in terms of maturity, are completely opposite from everything that you have stated. All of the stuff that you have said that make RK an immature series, are things that I disagree with you on, in the sense that while I agree those are qualities that make a series less mature, I see none of the negatives of what you mentioned to be contained in RK. Therefore, I think it is wise that we keep to our own opinions on this matter, rather than to needlessy, and senselessly argue on this issue, since it is clear that neither of us will reach an agreement. However, I hope that you realize that your views of being RK being an immature series, is PURELY based on your opinion (not to say that there may not be others who would agree with you, but at the same time it is only opinion, and not fact). In the same sense, I admit, even though most people would back me up on Ruoruni Kenshin being a much more mature series than what you would find out of most shounen, or any other manga/anime series for that matter, that is also opinion. If what we are arguing on is based on nothing more than opinion, and has nothing to do with actual facts that can be proven or disproven, then it makes no sense to continue arguing. So, in other words, I suppose we should just do what I said earlier, and agree to disagree.

    Thank you, i agree.

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  • Avatar of Darkknight313

    Darkknight313

    [48]Dec 1, 2007
    • member since: 11/19/07
    • level: 28
    • rank: Disco Stu
    • posts: 3,119
    I wish it could but it will never happen.
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  • Avatar of crzza

    crzza

    [49]Jul 11, 2008
    • member since: 05/28/07
    • level: 49
    • rank: Snufflupugus
    • posts: 12,122

    It used to be on Toonami.

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