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Official Discussion Thread: Like a Virgin (RESCHEDULED - possible spoilers)

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    yutg25

    [61]Feb 5, 2011
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    This explains a lot. I was expecting a filler episode not THE big Reveal of the season.


    I love what dean did to the sword and now both brothers have one/shiv. I think the dragons will be more important.


    Warning spoiler!


    This explains everything.


    At first I thought Raphael would be the big bad then Crowely and the Alphas were either preping themselves to march up to hell or protect themselves from Raph.


    The entire Angel civil war is to keep Cas busy to keep Cas from helping fully.


    Crowley's search for purgatory was to stop this and keep himself topdog.


    The Alpha's are building up their people for this and keep the hunters busy but only the dragons are in charge of waking her.


    Now its clear.


    With the hell and heaven in chaos with the angel civil war and Lucifer loyalist and Crowley folk going at it its time to stake a claim at Earth.


    So this is female Lucy?


    I thought Lilith was mother of the monsters/freaks; but maybe Lucifer and Mom made Lilith together and Lucy put mom down in purgatory.


    Meg and Balthazar will come in soon.

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    sinjaceheroes

    [62]Feb 5, 2011
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    Ooh! Finally Mom is here! xD I'd like to find all the dumba$$es who told me there was no mother and that was just something big daddy vamp said.


    This was a very awesome episode, funnier than I thought the return of the soul would be. I did expect the dragon to "pop" out of his skin. I mean, a little actual dragon would have been nice, but, oh well.


    The special effects used in the Mother's arrival made it up for me.


    That scene with Cas and Sam was freaking hilarious. xD Poor Cas, I wanted to give him a hug after he made that face.


    I'm guessing that the virgins are for a second ritual or most likely for a new host after this one burns through--I am pretty sure Big Momma will make Lucy look like a pissy child in terms of power and awesomeness.


    But what draco #3 said bothered me. He said "have enough" which means, they will most likely be used all for a ritual. I mean, unless Big Momma wanted two dozen hosts at once or wrath would fall!!!!!! ...I think capturing more along the way would have been easier and softer on the ears.


    P.S. I will address Mother Of All as Big Momma from now on. xD


    P.P.S. Since its too long ago to bother looking for, I would like to bring back my past point about what Big Momma is; the first thing God made in order to satisfy his loneliness or whatever God would feel. Then when he got bored, he tossed her aside and made everything else. He made angels and blah blah blah and then we humans and then blah blah. Big Momma got pissed of being dissed--as any woman would do, of course--and created monsters to prey on God's favorites. Because of that God banished her to Purgatory--or made it for her the same way he made the Cage--and then tossed all of the monsters after they kicked the bucket. And now she's back and pissed.


    P.P.P.S. I think that because of the dragons we can agree that monsters have magic to hide as humans, quite possibly by using human skin--I mean, If a man can become a beast by taking the beast's skin...why can't the beasts do the same? ... ... I think this should be noted and I repeat: If a man can become a beast by wearing the beast's skin, why can't the beast do the same? Because of this, we can agree that the pagan gods, dragons (as we saw), lepreacharuns, big daddy vamp (and quite possibly every other Alpha) are not really humanoid, but wearing human skin to best hide amongst us. I mean, it is the most perfect theory as to explain why monsters look human. and most surely not for budgetary reasons.... (charmed hint hint).

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  • Avatar of libra113

    libra113

    [63]Feb 5, 2011
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    Well, I always thought that Momma as you're calling her was something as old as God (or older) but independant of Him. Kinda like the fallen gods but not really fallen because the alphas at least still worship her and she still has power (perhaps why she was trapped in Purgatory in the first place).

    As for the skin thing, that COULD work. Always figured it was because some monsters (such as vamps and ghosts) used to be human while others (such as demons) were possessing people or perhaps even using some sort of magic to alter perceptions of humans around them.

    In fact there's a magic called a Glamour that allows the caster to appear to change their form (they don't actually change they make it look like the do). Witches are said to use it to hide their age or uglyness (old school witches not wicca kind). Others are said to use it to hide deformity or injury and so on. Just what I always suspected but the skin thing works to, in fact it could be both.
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    yutg25

    [64]Feb 5, 2011
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    libra113 wrote:
    Well, I always thought that Momma as you're calling her was something as old as God (or older) but independant of Him. Kinda like the fallen gods but not really fallen because the alphas at least still worship her and she still has power (perhaps why she was trapped in Purgatory in the first place). As for the skin thing, that COULD work. Always figured it was because some monsters (such as vamps and ghosts) used to be human while others (such as demons) were possessing people or perhaps even using some sort of magic to alter perceptions of humans around them. In fact there's a magic called a Glamour that allows the caster to appear to change their form (they don't actually change they make it look like the do). Witches are said to use it to hide their age or uglyness (old school witches not wicca kind). Others are said to use it to hide deformity or injury and so on. Just what I always suspected but the skin thing works to, in fact it could be both.



    Its possible she was there before the void when God created man and cast her down to Purgatory in creation.

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  • Avatar of libra113

    libra113

    [65]Feb 5, 2011
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    I always had the impression she was either on par with the fallen gods (thoes pre-Christianity) who lost power to Him OR that she was of the same age and perhaps origin but instead of creating man she created monsters.

    Hopefully, we will find out more as the season goes on.
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    Canogaparkcindy

    [66]Feb 5, 2011
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    Just watched the episode. What is the mother of all things?
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  • Avatar of libra113

    libra113

    [67]Feb 5, 2011
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    Canogaparkcindy wrote:
    Just watched the episode. What is the mother of all things?
    Persumably she's the mother of all monsters the vamp alpha mentioned awhile back. The one who created/birthed the alphas of all the monsters we know now.
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    Canogaparkcindy

    [68]Feb 5, 2011
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    libra113 wrote:
    Canogaparkcindy wrote:
    Just watched the episode. What is the mother of all things?
    Persumably she's the mother of all monsters the vamp alpha mentioned awhile back. The one who created/birthed the alphas of all the monsters we know now.
    Ohh, okay thanks, I was a little confused in the end. So she created like all the monsters... ever?
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    DegrassiFan619

    [69]Feb 5, 2011
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    I lmao'd when Dean was reading the diary of the virgin girl and said "I'm going to give Dan my most precious gift..."

    Sam: ..."That sounded so creepy coming out of your mouth"
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    RachelleMcAdams

    [70]Feb 5, 2011
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    Since this is the CW I am not suprised they cast and young pretty girl for the role mother of monsters but her dialogue is a bit mundane and she doesn't seem scary so much as creepy
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    dpebbleson

    [71]Feb 6, 2011
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    libra113 wrote:
    dpebbleson wrote:
    A solid episode. Anyone noticed the parallel with Lucifer - a woman was used to communicate with the Mother. They could have picked a better actress for the Mother, some more recognizable face, rather than a typical SPN damsel in distress (they all look same to me).

    I guess we were right when we speculated about the Mother of All (Monsters). I wonder what her agenda is. Now that she's released they might have to kill her or send her back to Purgatory.

    I told ya, Libs, it's gonna be an anthropomorphic dragon. Okay, a some kind of mix, but it's okay with the legends. They took the occidental dragon, however, the one that likes gold and is greedy. Together with references to Middle Earth Yeah, I agree, the broken sword looking like a knife is more in line with SPN, I thought the exact same thing when I saw it. I'm not sure I liked the entire pulling the sword out of stone music, it seemed like SPN crossed to sitcom area with that.
    yeah I thought that was cheesy too until Dean fell and they did that skipped record effect. At that point it was clear they were playing it for laughs. That was actually the best part (that and the hints at Bobby's past), other than that the whole thing with the professor seems flat and just designed to get Sam and Dean apart so he can trick Cas into telling him what Dean didn't want him to know (note to Dean conspiricies only work if all parties are informed).

    I liked the dragons, IF you're going to do dragons on this show that's far better than the alternatives, although still not sure they needed to do dragons in the first place but hey whatever.

    One thing that kind of bugged me is they're fighting two dragons, they kill one and the other runs off and they just go home and don't bother trying to track it or anything? Okay they saved that group of virgins but the others... well outta luck ladies. Seems odd but I guess they HAD to get the mother out and if Sam and Dean had tracked the other dragon and saved the ladies then that would have ruined the story (still they could've tried or could have managed to save all but one or something).

    In any case it was good for a return episode and set the stage for the home streach and you gotta love the old magical book made out of human skin bit (I've even used that one myself once or twice). All and all good job.


    I also think that the whole scene with the professor was a bit too long, but it was interesting, and I hope the professor returns in the future.

    I agree with Rachelle, Mother of All wasn't scary. Yeah, it's the CW's policy to employ young & beautiful women (nothing against it), but they all seem pretty bland, and not very good actresses. All Lilith actresses managed to convey a lot of creepy feeling, I just hope they sort it out for Mother of All.
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    WCSU1987

    [72]Feb 6, 2011
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    Thought it was an awesome episode. Ending was a surprise forgot all about the "Mother" storyline after the previous episode and Dean's conversation with Death. Be much to go from this. Completely new enemy looks to perplex the boys on how to deal with this. How will this play into the Civil War up above, and with Crowley not in charge down below what does this mean? With Sam now wanting to be apologetic for the past year and the wall in the head will this affect the fight coming up? Lot of scenarios to play out will make this an interesting season.

    Edited on 02/06/2011 9:29am
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    basenji529

    [73]Feb 6, 2011
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    libra113 wrote:
    Guess they have to be virgins by choice not due to lack of options. Alternative, they don't want Mother in a fugly body.


    Also, the Latin virgo originally meant a young single woman.


    Look at it this way: Do you really think Muhammad Atta would have killed himself if he thought "72 virgins" meant going to some Star Trek convention?

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    basenji529

    [74]Feb 6, 2011
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    sinjaceheroes wrote:


    P.P.P.S. I think that because of the dragons we can agree that monsters have magic to hide as humans, quite possibly by using human skin--I mean, If a man can become a beast by taking the beast's skin...why can't the beasts do the same? ... ... I think this should be noted and I repeat: If a man can become a beast by wearing the beast's skin, why can't the beast do the same? Because of this, we can agree that the pagan gods, dragons (as we saw), lepreacharuns, big daddy vamp (and quite possibly every other Alpha) are not really humanoid, but wearing human skin to best hide amongst us. I mean, it is the most perfect theory as to explain why monsters look human. and most surely not for budgetary reasons.... (charmed hint hint).



    No reason not to. Actually, if you're using the example of skinwalkers, in many American Indian stories, supernatural creatures have henshin power.

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    DudeDeansMyBoy

    [75]Feb 6, 2011
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    Yes!, the sweet Sammy is back!, (for now anyway) oh how I've missed him, (for some strange reason) and the original feel of supernatural is back too, sweet!!, and of course Dean and Cass are as awesome as they always are!. Which brings me to my next point poor Cass dismissed then deceived by Sammy all in a thirty second stretch WTF?... Okay now the only thing I found strange was at the end when 'The Mother of All' was being summoned it reminded of Charmed I had to push info just to be sure it was Supernatural, I was thinking jeez I hope the episode was interrupted again. But I guess the special-effects just made me think of that show lol.

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    AnimeMadness

    [76]Feb 6, 2011
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    I really like the episode, especially the part with Dean and the professor. I'm glad Sammy's back too. It finally felt normal. The dragons were really cool. They didn't come off as cheesy to me. Supernatual was always good at portraying monsters in a modern view. Dean stealing their gold made me smile.

    Mother of All is pretty interesting. I did a little research and there's a Greek myth about Echidna, the Mother of all Monsters who is a drakaina, which is a female dragon with human-like features. So now that dragons were introduced and released Mother, it all makes sense. But I doubt Supernatural will follow the myth word-for-word since they like to do their own things.
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    libra113

    [77]Feb 6, 2011
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    Canogaparkcindy wrote:
    libra113 wrote:
    Canogaparkcindy wrote:
    Just watched the episode. What is the mother of all things?
    Persumably she's the mother of all monsters the vamp alpha mentioned awhile back. The one who created/birthed the alphas of all the monsters we know now.
    Ohh, okay thanks, I was a little confused in the end. So she created like all the monsters... ever?
    Presumbaly so, at least that's what has been said so far.

    She made the alphas and the alphas in turn spawned the rest of their race.
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    libra113

    [78]Feb 6, 2011
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    RachelleMcAdams wrote:
    Since this is the CW I am not suprised they cast and young pretty girl for the role mother of monsters but her dialogue is a bit mundane and she doesn't seem scary so much as creepy
    Well, give it time, it's been one appearance and I'm betting they come up with some creepy, blink and you miss it, facial effect to give us a peak at her true visage.
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    libra113

    [79]Feb 6, 2011
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    basenji529 wrote:

    libra113 wrote:
    Guess they have to be virgins by choice not due to lack of options. Alternative, they don't want Mother in a fugly body.


    Also, the Latin virgo originally meant a young single woman.


    Look at it this way: Do you really think Muhammad Atta would have killed himself if he thought "72 virgins" meant going to some Star Trek convention?

    Reminds me of a bit on "Family Guy" where a sucide bomer went to Heaven and his 72 virgins were a bunch of geeks playing magic the gathering on their laptops.
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    Roz7

    [80]Feb 6, 2011
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    Slightly off-topic and really nerdy, but if Dr Visyak's a specialist in Medieval Studies, why is her house full of Classical/Neo-Classical stuff and paintings from a much later date? Apart from the sword obviously, but isn't Brunswic more of an Anglo Saxon name than medieval?


    Sorry, I'm an archaeologist and nit-picking is a habit I can't break...

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