The Mentalist Forums

Sunday 10:00 PM on CBSBetween Seasons

Which of the 7 is Red John?

  • Avatar of meigner

    meigner

    [1]May 5, 2013
    • member since: 04/14/06
    • level: 1
    • rank: Weatherman
    • posts: 3

    Bret Stiles, Gale Bertram, Raymond Haffner, Reede Smith, Bob Kirkland, Sheriff Thomas McAllister, Brett Partridge

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of remann810

    remann810

    [2]May 6, 2013
    • member since: 04/14/13
    • level: 1
    • rank: Weatherman
    • posts: 1

    brett partridge

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Abo_Malek

    Abo_Malek

    [3]May 6, 2013
    • member since: 09/15/12
    • level: 2
    • rank: Sweat Hog
    • posts: 5

    Gale Bertram, Raymond Haffner, Thomas McAllister: one of this three is red john probably Raymond


    - Bret Stiles: is probably an old friend


    - Reede Smith: i don't think he is connected to red john


    - Bob Kirkland: i don't think he is red john but his right hand man


    - Sheriff Thomas McAllister: i don't think that he related to RJ at all, he only appeared in the first episode and wasn't that special(but who knows, there is no evidence that he isn't RJ, but if he was it will really be a bad decision from the writer)


    - Brett Partridge: i don't think he is red john but maybe a one of his minions, besides he is to young to be in the red john(The Red Barn 1980 Incident ), and Bruno Heller stats in an interview that red john isn't a basement kind of serial killer(which Brett seems to be, as remarked by Jane in S01E01) and he also doesn't seem to have the money red john seems to have, he also isn't that high in the society or work as Red John seems to be


    - Gale Bertram: i just don't think he is red john, for a lot of tiny details that don't add up


    - Raymond Haffner: He fits all the criteria so fa, he is high ranking member of the CBI,a Visualize member, and after the evidence from "The Red Barn" it seems possible he was at the farm in 1988 when one of the first Red John smiley faces was drawn. He fits the age, description, seems to have money, and mental intelligence, he is also interested in Lisbon and tries to befriend her (if he was red john that is probably what he would do), and most of all he is called ray, and we know that red john nickname is Roy !!


    - None of the above (His father, someone else): i don't think that he is none of the above because if he wasn't i think he would probably mocked Jane about it in the video at the end (also he said, that because of what Lorelei said to Jane, the game rules is going to change, so if what she said was wrong he wouldn't really bother), and it isn't Jane's father because he was a fraud and didn't have a problem with it, unlike red john who seems to be a man of honor in a way (S01E01, the note he leave's to Jane about killing his family) but i think that his father may be one of red john's minions


    - JANE HIMSELF !!:that''s not possible for a thousand reason:


    1- he isn't a Visualize member


    2- he doesn't have the fucking time(he was awake for a whole weak during this episode he couldn't have killed the victim


    3- he can't possibly handshake himself


    4- Lorelei wouldn't lie to him (about handshaking RJ) and in the same time plan to kill his alter ego "RJ" for killing her sister


    5- 6- 7- 8- 9- (i am just tired of writing)



    And about how he did know about the "Happy Memory", i think at some point red john hypnotized Jane(He was with alone for some time in one of the episodes) into telling him god knows what, Or Jane's father Alex maybe one of RJ's minions or at least his related to him somehow and he spoke with RJ about that "Happy Moment" in Jane's life


    but what is really wired how did he know the list, there is a few explanation:


    1- he is watching him all the time or making someone watch him and he deducted the 7 names from what he learned


    2- the video is edited and is made/edited after Bob Kirkland(who is related or is RJ) saw what Jane was working on in his secret hideout, and deducted the names from what he gathered and edited the video that he made of Lorelei and put the names in it


    3- something else (But certainly Not PSYCHIC related)

    Edited on 05/06/2013 8:36am
    Edited 5 total times.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Tibor_Hu

    Tibor_Hu

    [4]May 14, 2013
    • member since: 05/14/13
    • level: 1
    • rank: Weatherman
    • posts: 2

    Hi, I think Abo_Malek made some good points. I actually don't remember who Thomas McAllister, this FBI Reed guy were, till I didn't look it up now. Still, I think the writers and producers managed to make this season 5 very exciting, and they have confused the audience. I think I have figured a few things out, but I have no idea who Red John is. This is how it goes. How the hell does Red John know the 7 people on Jane's list? well, this is - in my opinion quite simple. Kirkland organized the break in in to Jane's CBI "base". He put everything together Jane had - then it was quite simple to deduce everything Jane has deduced. This is where all becomes quite interesting. Jane had a toothpick put up on the door when he left - Jane knew that Lisbon will have coffee with Kirkland, since he asked Lisbon afterwards, what did Kirkland want?- and when he came back after the new case they had, he saw that the toothpick was moved, so he knew there was a break in. He wasn't surprised, he didn't freak out, he smiled. He did not alert Lisbon, that oh my god somebody broke in ... That makes me believe that he expected the break in, and he was happy about it. After that he worked even harder on his "list" or whatever he was working on, we don't know that anymore. he did have his 1 week radio silence, and when he was done he burned everything. What was the reason for burning everything down, if Kirkland has already stolen his information. If he did burn down everything, that means that he he had something new there, and THAT he did not want anybody to see. That with killing a memory from Jane's head, that's weird. I can't explain that. So what Abo_Malek is saying about Jane's father knowing Red John, seems a possibility, but this was rather a private memory, so the hypnosis is also a theory, but I'm not sure about that, seems somehow wrong, after Heller and co. is putting everything so beautifully down for us, they wouldn't have (shouldn't have) kept that from us. On the other hand, what I can deduce from this whole thing is, Jane showed on purpose to Red John what he had. That was faked, so Red John thinks he has given yet another huge blow to Jane. Jane on the other hand is for the first time really the man with the upper hand, because he faked the information. Lisbon is not in the loop, she also thinks Jane was tricked/fooled by Red John. So, that means Jane is planning something unknown for us so far, and this is what's going to make the next season ever more exciting. Guys, what do you think how far off am I ?

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Colin_Rob_Rock

    Colin_Rob_Rock

    [5]Oct 6, 2013
    • member since: 01/27/13
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 738

    If some one could please tell me if i'm right about who theses people are I don't remember who Reede Smith is at all


    Bret Stiles is the head of Visualize


    Gale Bertram Is the head of CBI


    Raymond Haffner Is the guy that offered Lisbon a Job a few episodes ago


    Reede Smith?????????


    Bob Kirkland Is an FBI Agent


    Sheriff Thomas McAllister Is the Sheriff from the first Episode


    Brett Partridge Is the Forensic Tech he was in the season 5 finale.


    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of michalisthiou

    michalisthiou

    [6]Oct 7, 2013
    • member since: 09/09/07
    • level: 5
    • rank: Caveman Lawyer
    • posts: 40

    errrr



    didnt partridge die in the last episode?



    anyway it seems pretty clear now from last nights episode that the theory that red john is many people is most likely the case

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of q666

    q666

    [7]Oct 10, 2013
    • member since: 06/05/09
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 21
    After the meeting of Bertram, McAllister and Reede it seems pretty clear, that those 3 are working with Red John, but are not him. Especialy the favorite suspect Bertram is disqualified, because non of RJ's followers would dare to talk to him like Reede Smith did. I hope Bret Styles turns out to be Red John, because Malclom McDowell would make a very good RJ. Unfortunatly i think Ray Haffner has better chances. In any case i suspect once Red Johns is made we will also learn that he is a real psychic and relative (brother, father, oncle) of Jane. Alex is not his biological father. Thus the theme of the psychic gift that has been lingering since the RJ murder of Jane's wife and daughter will be back taking center stage.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Boozwaa

    Boozwaa

    [8]Oct 10, 2013
    • member since: 10/10/07
    • level: 6
    • rank: Small Wonder
    • posts: 60

    I think Red John is Ray Hafner........, Why? Because he whistled "Jimmy Crack Corn" on the way out after visiting Lisbon.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of ChicksHateMe

    ChicksHateMe

    [9]Oct 14, 2013
    • member since: 05/27/06
    • level: 8
    • rank: Super-Friend
    • posts: 381

    I think I know who it is, but I don't want to say. I personally hate spoilers, but I think I figured it out from something I saw in S06E01.


    I really love this show, but now that (I think) I know who it is, everything is clearer, but less suspenseful. Sort of like when you see a movie the 2nd time around after knowing the ending.


    Hopefully I am wrong and there's a twist that even surprises me.


    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Morlunnis

    Morlunnis

    [10]Oct 24, 2013
    • member since: 11/10/06
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 105

    SPOILERS for up to episode 6x04!


    .


    .


    .


    .


    .


    .


    .


    .


    Okay, down to 5.



    I think we'll see Kevin Corrigan again, as Bob Kirkland's brother Michael and a Red John lackey. The whole "no body found" is pretty much a given.



    I believe Bret Stiles to be too old to be Red John, and in particular, he wouldn't be "some kid" in the Visualize farm back in 88, but "the boss". I do believe he knows who Red John is but is not a subordinate. I don't think he's that easy to be bossed around. Therefore I believe that the reveal episode later this season will have a twist making us think it's Stiles, and a double-twist when the real Red John murders Stiles in front of Jane.



    I think Brett Partridge was part of the "Tyger Tyger Conspiracy", and freaked out when Jane confronted him in episode 6x01. He was killed because he was a weak link.



    I think that Gale Bertram and Thomas MacAllister are part of the Tyger Tyger conspiracy, as per their meeting with Reede Smith (confirmed in 6x04) in 6x02. Reede spoke to Bertram as an equal or superior:



    MacAllister: "What the hell was that about?"


    Smith: "Exactly how much does Jane know?"


    Bertram: "Well that is the question."


    Smith: "Yes, and it's your job to know the answer."


    Bertram: "I'm doing my best."



    Now, if one of these men is Red John, then the other two do not know it. I don't think the conversation would have been the same had any of the other two known they were speaking to Red John.



    Now, I don't think Reede Smith is Red John. My reasons are assumptions, not based on any clue given by the show:


    - the actor does not inspire the fear and awe someone like Red John would


    - I believe that if Smith had a Visualize connection in his past, Kirkland would never have recruited him for his anti-Tyger Tyger group


    - most importantly, knowing how Red John likes to torment his victims, were Reed Smith Red John he wouldn't have passed the chance to reveal that to Kirkland before he shot him.



    That leaves 3 men.



    I do not think Bertram is Red John. He may be acting submissive to play a role and divert suspicions, but from what we've seen of Red John's vindictive nature, Reede Smith would probably have ended with his throat slit after 6x02.



    I do not think MacAllister is Red John. Though I believe it would be fun if he were, that meeting in 6x02 seemed too much like a meeting between peers.



    This leaves Ray Haffner. At this point, I believe him to be Red John, and I believe he's the most logic option. That said, the way things twist and turn, anything is possible.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Starwarder

    Starwarder

    [11]Oct 24, 2013
    • member since: 09/30/06
    • level: 11
    • rank: Red Shirted Lt.
    • posts: 128

    The twin thing is interesting... What if the first time Jane shook Kirkland's hand, it was actually Michael and not Bob? Occasionally impersonating a Homeland Security agent could be quite an advantage Red John would take advantage of. Thus Michael was not a lackey but Red John himself, and he therefore could be both on and off the "list" at the same time...

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Morlunnis

    Morlunnis

    [12]Oct 25, 2013
    • member since: 11/10/06
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 105
    I thought about it, but aside from the obvious (Red John recruited Michael), Kirkland's second meeting with Lisbon would have given it away if he had never met her before.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of wyndsayl

    wyndsayl

    [13]Oct 28, 2013
    • member since: 08/31/08
    • level: 2
    • rank: Sweat Hog
    • posts: 8

    Well, I never forgot the episode "Red John's Friends" were at the end the guy who is killed by Red John tried to right something on the shower wall. It was something like "man..."


    Now we here of a secret organization in law enforcement full of some really bad people. And several of the suspects seem to be in cahoots with each other.


    I think it's going to turn out that Red John is "many". The group has used the idea of "Red John" to cover up their many crimes. Several of the suspects will be Red John. So the question will be, who was the actual one to kill Jayne's family.


    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of q666

    q666

    [14]Oct 28, 2013
    • member since: 06/05/09
    • level: 3
    • rank: Soup Nazi
    • posts: 21
    I am pretty confident that McAllister is RJ. The disapointment Heller mentioned with regard to RJ will not be who of the suspects Red John is. The disapointment will be that Red John is not the puppetmaster he is made up to be but that he himself answers to a superior.

    I've written a pretty detailed RJ Theory. I would post it here but i feel it would be to long of a post. I think i have discovered a few clues i have never read anywhere else. So if u wanna take a look u'll find it here:

    http://www.whoisredjohn.com/See-a-theory-Red-John/7600#comments
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of TylerA46

    TylerA46

    [15]Oct 31, 2013
    • member since: 01/26/07
    • level: 11
    • rank: Red Shirted Lt.
    • posts: 391

    Well guys, why do you think it will make sense? Do you really think clues from season 1 are valid? I bet the writers did not make up their minds that long ago... I wish it could be figured out, but at this point the writers can pull anything out of their hats... I just hope, it won't be a letdown, like when in CSI, the creepiest serial killer (Jekyll) turned out to be a retard mad at his father for not being allowed to go to college.

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of alikayta7

    alikayta7

    [16]Nov 15, 2013
    • member since: 09/01/10
    • level: 1
    • rank: Weatherman
    • posts: 2

    the three cops with the tree dots on their shoulders are the secret society in the police force or ??? you know Tiger Tiger, anyway thats my thought, I don't know if they are minions or its a dirty society

    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of sesho2022

    sesho2022

    [17]Nov 17, 2013
    • member since: 07/24/05
    • level: 47
    • rank: A-Teamer
    • posts: 5,640
    alikayta7 wrote:

    the three cops with the tree dots on their shoulders are the secret society in the police force or ??? you know Tiger Tiger, anyway thats my thought, I don't know if they are minions or its a dirty society



    I think Red John is Sheriff MacAllister. He smirks too much and gives me the creeps. Also, the other two cops are too obvious. Plus, Reede Smith has already been shown as following orders, so he would not be Red John.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.
  • Avatar of Morlunnis

    Morlunnis

    [20]Nov 18, 2013
    • member since: 11/10/06
    • level: 10
    • rank: Holy Level 10!
    • posts: 105
    Or not.

    McAllister was with Jane, Smith and Bertram. The bomb went off, and Haffner and Stiles died, Jane got knocked out but was otherwise uninjured, and Smith and Bertram were down but conscious and uninjured.

    The bomb was clearly on the couch, and killed those closer to it. So why was McAllister vaporized so that the CBI had to wait for DNA to confirm his death?

    Also, if Red John carried a bomb into that room, wouldn't he have a better plan than blowing it up and hoping for the best?

    I'm guessing McAllister is Red John, and he faked his death in that room somehow. Or that he used a follower / Blake Associate to fake the DNA results.

    Another reason why Bertram is probably not Red John: in the season 3 finale, Red John sent Timothy Carter there to die. Carter might not have known he would die, but Red John probably knew Jane would shoot him. That said, Carter was plan B. Red John heard from O'Loughlin and Bertram two different hotel rooms for Hightower, and he framed Bertram first. A "final lesson in humility", Timothy Carter called it.

    If Jane hadn't made the connection between the assassin's rope and O'Loughlin, he would have believed Bertram was Red John or was working for him. Bertram could even have had instructions to, at some point, do a Carter, confess to being Red John and leave.

    I don't want to believe Lisbon and Cho are stupid enough to have let Partridge fake his death, but Partridge is my runner-up in case McAllister is truly dead. So yeah, the two guys that showed up in the pilot are my guesses for Red John.

    Also, nice detail on knowing that Smith was responsible for letting Red John into the CBI to kill Rebecca Anderson (they remembered Bosco!).

    Finally, my guess on what happened in that room (it will be shown next episode in a flashback, for sure): Jane moved away with the three Red John suspects, leaving Haffner and Stiles on the couch, and the guns on the floor. Haffner dived for the guns. Stiles said "Wait, no!", alerting Jane, who turned back and shot Haffner. Red John took the chance to detonate the bomb.
    You must be registered and logged in to post a message.