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FOX (ended 2013)

Official discussion thread: "Entanglement" - Spoilers

  • Avatar of phf3947

    phf3947

    [1]Apr 10, 2012
    • member since: 06/06/05
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    Please discuss "Entanglement" in this thread. Thanks.
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  • Avatar of Kartana

    Kartana

    [3]Apr 14, 2012
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    I stopped watching 30 minutes into the episode. It is getting too stupid. Who do the writers think we are? The bad writing reminds me so much of 'Heroes'. I'm done with this show.
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  • Avatar of GoodWillTalking

    GoodWillTalking

    [4]Apr 14, 2012
    • member since: 04/13/12
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    While I liked the pilot, I am disappointed in the show's failure to progress. It's the exact same formulaic writing for each show, and I think something else needs to happen, because it's getting old. Keifer does his requisite panicked, heavy breathing chases, his son is in peril of being taken away from him, due to having to neglect him while he works at breakneck speed to shield his son from pain, which hardly no one else understands except one social worker and his elderly confidant (Danny Glover), who is thought to be crazy, but we all are guessing that he knows much more than anyone else on the planet, and what else....oh, I'm quickly running out of reasons to keep watching.
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  • Avatar of doctorwho747

    doctorwho747

    [5]Apr 14, 2012
    • member since: 02/15/10
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    Damn I never thought that there would be so much nitpicking, actually that's not true I hoped there wouldn't be just like any other new show I watch and like. Enough with the Heroes BS, this is not Heroes so people how about trying to move on? To this day I cannot fathom how many people seem to take the direction of that show as personal insults, acting like Tim Kring himself just walked up to them and punched them in the face.

    Anyway as for Touch it's only been on for 5 episodes and yet people are yelling "We don't we have answers yet, this show sucks it's not moving forward in any way, it reminds me of" Yeah I don't have to finish that part. Well my prospective Touch is an amazing show unlike any other that's just beginning. if you actually pay attention to the show and not sit there and look for things to complain about you would notice that from episode 1 it's been setting up groundwork for what's to come because that's how all shows begin. There are now several story arcs that they can choose from like: 1. Who is Arthur Teller really, what happened in the past that ruined h is life, and can he really be trusted. 2. What was going on with Martin's wife Sarah that last summer before 9/11? There was never any part of her body recovered, and the firefighter wasn't sure if she was alive or not so is it possible she's alive? If so how, and where has she been? 3. Jake's ability, Teller said "He has a higher purpose, and believe me you won't be the only one who notices" to Martin. That could tie in with Teller's past but that line is pretty ominous which leads me to believe that there are people out there, potential recurring villains who would exploit Jake to their own purposes. Yeah it sounds like a cliche, but not if it's done right. And let's not forget the supposed to be empty Room 6 and Jake's connection with whatever is in there. 4.And last but actually the biggest story line the connections themselves. Right now we have had individual episodes with seemingly stand alone stories, but there has also been the recurring firefighter, the Japanese girls who are apparently following the band on tour, the band itself has been referred to in some way in every episode. So really what's up with this band? they could be the villains! lol kidding! My point is by the end of the season we will see that it hasn't been only just stand alone events, the connections these people have are still building and I think that at season's end we will see all of them again to connect in some way for a climactic event.
    So people stop complaining that nothing is happening on this show because there has been so much in these five episodes. Honestly I never liked math in school, in fact I hated it. The only time I had ever heard of "The Fibonacci Sequence" was in The DaVinci Code. Watching Touch has really opened my eyes, I find myself looking at a flower or a tree stump and seeing the patterns that lie in them. I wonder if all these patterns we see aren't just what makes up our universe, but universes themselves. Anyway I'll stop myself there cuz I could write pages. So to anyone reading this please don't just look at this absolutely fantastic show, really WATCH it and you'll notice that nothing that's happened has been random and pointless.
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  • Avatar of MaKTaiL

    MaKTaiL

    [6]Apr 14, 2012
    • member since: 12/18/09
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    doctorwho747 wrote:
    Damn I never thought that there would be so much nitpicking, actually that's not true I hoped there wouldn't be just like any other new show I watch and like. Enough with the Heroes BS, this is not Heroes so people how about trying to move on? To this day I cannot fathom how many people seem to take the direction of that show as personal insults, acting like Tim Kring himself just walked up to them and punched them in the face. Anyway as for Touch it's only been on for 5 episodes and yet people are yelling "We don't we have answers yet, this show sucks it's not moving forward in any way, it reminds me of" Yeah I don't have to finish that part. Well my prospective Touch is an amazing show unlike any other that's just beginning. if you actually pay attention to the show and not sit there and look for things to complain about you would notice that from episode 1 it's been setting up groundwork for what's to come because that's how all shows begin. There are now several story arcs that they can choose from like: 1. Who is Arthur Teller really, what happened in the past that ruined h is life, and can he really be trusted. 2. What was going on with Martin's wife Sarah that last summer before 9/11? There was never any part of her body recovered, and the firefighter wasn't sure if she was alive or not so is it possible she's alive? If so how, and where has she been? 3. Jake's ability, Teller said "He has a higher purpose, and believe me you won't be the only one who notices" to Martin. That could tie in with Teller's past but that line is pretty ominous which leads me to believe that there are people out there, potential recurring villains who would exploit Jake to their own purposes. Yeah it sounds like a cliche, but not if it's done right. And let's not forget the supposed to be empty Room 6 and Jake's connection with whatever is in there. 4.And last but actually the biggest story line the connections themselves. Right now we have had individual episodes with seemingly stand alone stories, but there has also been the recurring firefighter, the Japanese girls who are apparently following the band on tour, the band itself has been referred to in some way in every episode. So really what's up with this band? they could be the villains! lol kidding! My point is by the end of the season we will see that it hasn't been only just stand alone events, the connections these people have are still building and I think that at season's end we will see all of them again to connect in some way for a climactic event. So people stop complaining that nothing is happening on this show because there has been so much in these five episodes. Honestly I never liked math in school, in fact I hated it. The only time I had ever heard of "The Fibonacci Sequence" was in The DaVinci Code. Watching Touch has really opened my eyes, I find myself looking at a flower or a tree stump and seeing the patterns that lie in them. I wonder if all these patterns we see aren't just what makes up our universe, but universes themselves. Anyway I'll stop myself there cuz I could write pages. So to anyone reading this please don't just look at this absolutely fantastic show, really WATCH it and you'll notice that nothing that's happened has been random and pointless.



    I agree 100%. You took the words out of my mouth. I love this show.


    Every episode seems pointless at first but in the end of the season we will see how all characters fit together.

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  • Avatar of phf3947

    phf3947

    [7]Apr 15, 2012
    • member since: 06/06/05
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    I agree with Doctor Who as well

    I've never seen Heroes or for that matter 24, so my opinion isn't colored by comparatives to other shows. Each episode of Touch presents a new set of characters who appear to have completely unconnected lives. By the end of the episode, each character is connected to someone else in the world. It's a fascinating premise that is both enjoyable and mind-expanding. No one is forcing a viewer to watch. If someone doesn't like a show, there is an option to actually change the channel.
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  • Avatar of cross_mr

    cross_mr

    [8]Apr 17, 2012
    • member since: 07/26/05
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    the only thing I can say about this episode is that the connection of the middle eastern girls was pretty weak. They spent a long time developing them, but in the end, the only thing that tied back with them, was the phone call to the guy who ran in front of the bus and the fact that the guy didn't marry her.
    But I felt that their connection seemed a little weak compared to some of the other side connections that have been out there. I really didn't find myself as invested in them as other stories.
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  • Avatar of steheaps

    steheaps

    [9]Apr 19, 2012
    • member since: 01/23/10
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    For me the interest in show has gone from "Amazing, must watch TV", to "OK, better than most new shows but nothing special". And for it to be only 5 episodes in and have that feeling is massively disappointing. Several of the story arcs now seem rather annoying than interesting, such as the constant whining of the social worker, and even Kiefer's repetitive argument about his son that just seems to be the same every week, its like they might aswell just re-show parts from previous episodes where he says basically the same thing, both to the old guy and the social worker.
    Then there's parts of the storylines that seem to be just bad writing, such as the one from last week, where keifer asks that guy to save his son when he could have done the same himself, (just grab him when he fell) and then made out like it was something special, and then this week where keifer was supposed to meet those people to decide on his sons future, but somehow he was already late before he got on the bus anyway, as the social worker, who literally just phoned him as soon as he got on the bus, mentioned she had been delaying them as much as she could - so he'd rather go shopping than be early for a potentially life changing meeting???
    Plus the concept of lives interconnecting, while it seems great and worked massively well in the pilot, if you think about it is as easy and straightforward as writing any other show - its like thinking "that fortune teller is amazing" in a TV show where everything is scripted. This isn't live TV.
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  • Avatar of wwworldclique

    wwworldclique

    [10]Apr 20, 2012
    • member since: 09/15/07
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    Someone earlier said "Stop with the Heroes BS." Sorry-- I have to disagree with that. The reason why Heroes is important is that the guy who developed both shows has a bad history of developing a show chock full of exciting "deep" ideas and concepts but never taking them anywhere. So audiences sit and sit and sit getting sucked in by his writing and likable characters feeling like it's all going to build towards something, only to find 2-3 years too late that they were wasting their time. This is what people are seeing right now in Touch, and they would be right to be. The show has gotten repetitive already, with recycled characters and the same formulaic gimmick every week of having all these various events connect in a synchronous way.


    Another reason why people are mentioning Heroes is that whether you want to admit to it or not,Touch is a lot like it. We have: 1) the pretentious narration summarizing the show's events 2) a show that's basically a ripoff of another concept 3) entire storylines shamelessly "lifted" from other shows and movies ("Knowing", "The Fisher King", etc).


    So with all the similarities, you can't brush off all the comparisons that people are making, because Kring's signature ineptness is all over Touch like it was over Heroes. Unless new writers take over the show or something, I'm telling you guys who are so adamant about defending it now-- you're going to be angry and disappointed in about two years when the writing meanders, grows stale,and gets more insulting to your intelligence.

    Edited on 04/20/2012 2:22am
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  • Avatar of doctorwho747

    doctorwho747

    [11]Apr 21, 2012
    • member since: 02/15/10
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    wwworldclique wrote:

    Someone earlier said "Stop with the Heroes BS." Sorry-- I have to disagree with that. The reason why Heroes is important is that the guy who developed both shows has a bad history of developing a show chock full of exciting "deep" ideas and concepts but never taking them anywhere. So audiences sit and sit and sit getting sucked in by his writing and likable characters feeling like it's all going to build towards something, only to find 2-3 years too late that they were wasting their time. This is what people are seeing right now in Touch, and they would be right to be. The show has gotten repetitive already, with recycled characters and the same formulaic gimmick every week of having all these various events connect in a synchronous way.


    Another reason why people are mentioning Heroes is that whether you want to admit to it or not,Touch is a lot like it. We have: 1) the pretentious narration summarizing the show's events 2) a show that's basically a ripoff of another concept 3) entire storylines shamelessly "lifted" from other shows and movies ("Knowing", "The Fisher King", etc).


    So with all the similarities, you can't brush off all the comparisons that people are making, because Kring's signature ineptness is all over Touch like it was over Heroes. Unless new writers take over the show or something, I'm telling you guys who are so adamant about defending it now-- you're going to be angry and disappointed in about two years when the writing meanders, grows stale,and gets more insulting to your intelligence.



    See but you just really made my point, you are saying that there similarities to Heroes which there are but the similarities are different at the same time, SIMILAR DOES NOT MEAN EQUAL "The reason why Heroes is important is that the guy who developed both shows has a bad history of developing a show chock full of exciting "deep" ideas and concepts but never taking them anywhere.", I'm sorry but last time I checked every season of Heroes was about saving the world in some way, The bomb in NYC, the virus etc were those things not done? Ok so that is your and many people's opinions about Heroes, ONE show, what history do you speak of when this only happened to one show? You than go on to say that is what we are exactly seeing in Touch, and claim you seem to be able to know what will happen in the show for seasons to come? It has only been on for 6 episodes not even a full season so you could say there are similarities, but you CANNOT say what the end result is.
    "Another reason why people are mentioning Heroes is that whether you want to admit to it or not,Touch is a lot like it." Yeah ok so we have the narrative openings and closings, so what? I'll admit Suresh's narratives got derivative, but in Touch we are getting a glimpse into Jake's head which is the most important thing on the show, and just like every episode everything he says ties into the plot, and in episode 4 Jake's opening monologue in a way breaks the fourth wall after saying "The slightest things people do have a much bigger impact and they have no idea, at least that's what it's like from where I am sitting" so Jake is speaking directly to us where as Suresh sounded more like he was writing a journal. Ok so opening and closing monologues still does not make Touch Heroes
    Also saying that the show is repetitive you didn't really read my first comment, NOTHING that happens in the show is random, EVERYTHING is happening for a reason. Sure ok every week we are shown more about the place Jake is in and the possibility Martin could lose him, well that is ONE story arc that is soon coming to a conclusion, the entire series not even the entire season is going to be like that. So other than that nothing else that has happened to the characters is random, like every serialized show the first few episodes are like a game of chess, all the pieces are being put into place. Claiming that it's "shamelessly ripping off another concept" What tv show or movie is not a ripoff or inspired by something else? Heroes was surely not the first or the last show about people with superpowers, but what made it so special was the connections of the people around the world. The film "Knowing" was about man who discovered that in the past a child was given a message from an unknown source in the form of numbers which was a warning about a future event. Touch is about apparently one of many children who through numbers and patterns can see and understand the patterns that make up time itself and therefore can see and understand time, the future, and possibly the universe itself. Again using number sequences as a possible look into the future is a concept mathematicians have debated and argued about for centuries And so what TK decided to do was take the "We are all connected" theory, something that is certainly not anywhere a NEW idea or not been used in shows before, and added the idea of numbers being able to give answers to the unknown and combine them. Lost did it, in fact recurring numbers are a big theme in all of JJ Abrams shows., except Lost took the connected people from around the world and put them in one place. JJ Abrams's shows all have a unique style and all use the same themes like the numbers being representations: Alias, Lost, Fringe, Alcatraz. Besides the numbers what is just one of the big themes all four shows have? The strained relationships between the characters and their fathers: Sidney and Jack Bristow, Jack and Christian Shephard as well as almost every character on Lost, Peter and Walter Bishop, Rebecca Madsen who lost her parents and so her "uncle" raised her as her "father" and hid things from her. That is just one of Abram's themes that he uses and it works. So the "We are all connected" theme is now what Tim Kring has once again decided to use again in Touch, but that still makes it DIFFERENT from Heroes. Whereas in Heroes all the characters had a destiny, they all had a pre appointed path with a beginning that no matter what would lead them to their end, to their destiny. Touch however tells us that these characters all have paths they are meant to be on, but they are not predestined to go down them or even be aware that these paths exist. Touch is really like Robert frost's poem "The Road Less Traveled" combined wit the show "Quantum Leap". There are the optional paths to take, and going down the wrong one leads to dire consequences. So these people are not going down their right paths for some unknown reason and these children like Jake are sent here to put them back on track, "To put right, what once went wrong" that is one of the lines to the opening of Quantum Leap. Ok to finish you might just be wondering " Hey isn't this guy contradicting himself by saying it's not just like one movie or show, but like another one?" well no, as I said every show or movie is an idea of an idea of an idea and so on. My whole point is that again TOUCH IS NOT HEROES. just because there are similarities does not mean it's the same, saying "Well it has a similar style to Heroes and since Heroes ended up sucking as it went on, don't watch Touch because the same exact thing will happen ", sorry but unless you can predict the future to that just ain't right. I'll end with repeating my best line "Don't just sit and "look" at Touch for things to complain about, actually sit down and WATCH what is happening, watch for what happens beneath the surface for nothing that happens is random, and everything has a meaning
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  • Avatar of Ilovepugs

    Ilovepugs

    [12]Apr 25, 2012
    • member since: 04/25/12
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    Great review. Exactly what I've been thinking. Can't wait to see how this all plays out. Let's hope those with no attention span or imagination don't tank this show. I love it! I also love how Jake's opening statements tie into each story. There is so much food for thought! Another point. I never watched Heroes but I get that people were disappointed. However, how can they make the assumption that the same thing will happen again? I saw KS and TK in an interview saying their initial conversation before Keifer signed on, went on for hours, mostly discussing where the show was headed if it went on longer than the initial 13 episodes. I don't think K S would have signed on if he didn't believe the show had a direction. Isn't it more conceivable that one learns from one's mistakes? They also just yesterday had a press showing/discussion about the show and alluded to a very thrilling 2 part finale which will bring back several characters ( the Japanese girls, the guy who won the lottery and the guy who lost his phone ) and tie up all of the loose ends. Gee, could it be that all those supposed inconsistencies were actually part of a grand design?

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  • Avatar of wwworldclique

    wwworldclique

    [13]Apr 26, 2012
    • member since: 09/15/07
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    Ilovepugs wrote:
    Let's hope those with no attention span or imagination don't tank this show.


    There's no attention span or "imagination"required to view this show (it's the same formula every week, with even recycled characters and situations). So it won't be the "ADD-inflicted" or Imagination-impaired who will tank the show; it'll be those smart enough not to be hooked by writing that is not only becoming more contrived by the second, but convoluted.

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    phonzee101

    [14]May 2, 2012
    • member since: 07/14/08
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    Okay as a person who grew up in Montreal it was veryinaccuratewhen that guy was running for the train. The wheels that are on the Metro (french for subway) karts are made of rubber not metal so theirshouldn'tbe any screeching.



    As for the episode it was alright.

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  • Avatar of Ilovepugs

    Ilovepugs

    [15]May 6, 2012
    • member since: 04/25/12
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    I absolutely agree with Dr Who. He said everything I've been thinking. I'm very excited for the 2 part finale and keeping my fingers crossed for season 2!
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  • Avatar of doctorwho747

    doctorwho747

    [16]May 9, 2012
    • member since: 02/15/10
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    Ilovepugs wrote:
    I absolutely agree with Dr Who. He said everything I've been thinking. I'm very excited for the 2 part finale and keeping my fingers crossed for season 2!


    Thank you, you have been one of several people to respond to me with comments something along the lines of "I absolutely agree with you, and you said exactly what I was thinking" just like you said. On this page a shout out to MaKTail, and phf3947 who responded to me along with you.

    However there are the people who just cannot un-bunch their panties bout Heroes, and therefore just sit and look for things to complain about Touch, not actually watching the show, and give bad reviews. wwworldclique is without a doubt one such person. My first comment was a statement for people realize TOUCH IS NOT HEROES! I also still can't fathom the reactions to Heroes as it went on: Thinking that the show went downhill s it went along is one thing, but getting angry to the point of rage and fury, and even threats to NBC and Tim Kring as if Kring himself came to their houses and killed their pet! So why does this person think Touch sucks? well since that since Heroes went downhill as it went on, Touch "WILL", not might, but WILL go down the same path. Touch has similarities: The opening and closing monologues, the same formula every week with recycled characters? Ok if you read my response to that, long comment #2, followed by their response of

    "There's no attention span or "imagination"required to view this show (it's the same formula every week, with even recycled characters and situations). So it won't be the "ADD-inflicted" or Imagination-impaired who will tank the show; it'll be those smart enough not to be hooked by writing that is not only becoming more contrived by the second, but convoluted."
    You will see that they never even read my whole comments re-read my two long comments to see what I m talking about
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