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Official Discussion Thread: Alienated (possible spoilers)

  • Avatar of DiamondHead1830

    DiamondHead1830

    [21]May 13, 2012
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    Quick question after re-watching the episode, is Conner looking to Supes as an older brother now, or a father? Oh, and someone said above, I love the Bat-Family, now all we need is a quick Alfred in one episode. Maybe to come clean the hall of justice for the kids?
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    Flashheat

    [22]May 13, 2012
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    RaizenYusuke wrote:
    macabre6 wrote:
    Disliking Miss M more and more, and yes, that is easily the worst scene yet on the show, really? Batman AND Martian Manhunter approves of her methods? There's no way they didn't notice it, he was drooling and braindamaged and Martian Manhunter was sitting RIGHT IN FRONT OF HIM. Just stupid. I hated that scene, but the rest of the episode was pretty darn awesome, hope we get to see Kid Flash and Artemis soon as well. I'm really digging this new team.
    DCAU had a similar scene where Jon went do deep in a Thanigarian's mind to get information and left him in a similar state. Neither Batman nor Jon cared much. Batman's ethics have always shifted depending on writers. Sometimes he gets super pissed at People altering memories or he can even condone killing in certain situations like when he shot Darkseid or the DCAU where he suggested the JL could only have a chance at beating the Justice Lords if they were willing to kill.


    Well, to be fair, I don't think he meant they had to be willing to kill, just that they had to be willing to cross some line, which was true. Despite being down two members, the Justice Lords were just as powerful as them and completely ruthless. Being unwilling to cross some line puts them at a major disadvantage.



    That said, I honestly think they were referring to Blue Beetle. It would explain why that one base of Kroloteans went bonkers and fled the second they spotted him. And explain how the suit understands them.

    Edited on 05/13/2012 11:19am
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    SpiritOfNabu

    [23]May 13, 2012
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    RaizenYusuke wrote:
    Guardians keep their ears out for GL abusing their power since Sinestro became a dictator on his own planet.[/b[


    We don't know if that has happened in this universe, but still it is odd for a planet to be calling a Green Lantern an enemy and the Guardians never told John Stewart about it. We don;t know if the Guardians did know about it as we weren't there when John talked with the Guardians.

    DiamondHead1830 wrote:
    Quick question after re-watching the episode, is Conner looking to Supes as an older brother now, or a father? Oh, and someone said above, I love the Bat-Family, [b]now all we need is a quick Alfred in one episode. Maybe to come clean the hall of justice for the kids?


    We already saw Alfred back in Season 1. The episode where it showed Robin at Wayne Manor. maybe it was the Thanksgiving episode?
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    edmasterchaos

    [24]May 13, 2012
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    Oh hope they beat these krolotean guys and then the Reach does their thing and Blue Beetle solos the safety of humanity in a page-by-page remake of Vol. 4


    That would be the only way to make it perfect.

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    TranAnh0

    [25]May 13, 2012
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    did it occur to anyone else that no one wondered about why Savage did all this? i mean is it only to gain alien support against the league or battles against aliens is supposed to strengthen humanity and accelerate evolution as he planned? really not sure what he was trying to achieve here... and i cant believe no one in the league questioned his intentions

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    RaizenYusuke

    [26]May 13, 2012
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    SpiritOfNabu wrote:
    RaizenYusuke wrote:
    Guardians keep their ears out for GL abusing their power since Sinestro became a dictator on his own planet.[/b[


    We don't know if that has happened in this universe, but still it is odd for a planet to be calling a Green Lantern an enemy and the Guardians never told John Stewart about it. We don;t know if the Guardians did know about it as we weren't there when John talked with the Guardians.

    DiamondHead1830 wrote:
    Quick question after re-watching the episode, is Conner looking to Supes as an older brother now, or a father? Oh, and someone said above, I love the Bat-Family, [b]now all we need is a quick Alfred in one episode. Maybe to come clean the hall of justice for the kids?


    We already saw Alfred back in Season 1. The episode where it showed Robin at Wayne Manor. maybe it was the Thanksgiving episode?
    If the Guardians knew they would have called John in for abusing his power. Even if Sinsetro incicent did not happen in this universe a Green Lantern attacking a planet for 16 hours is something the Guardians would not approve without some kind of explanation. This incident was not even contained within this planet. A entire sector of space has John Stewart's face plastered on it as an outlaw. Granted the planet was no in sector 2814 (The Earth Green Lantern's sector of space), but a Green Lantern is in that sector. The incident is big throughout that start system the chances of that Green Lantern not going there in 5 years is silm. Five years is just too much time for this incident to be believable. If the League was only outlaws in hat one planet I could buy the Guardians and Corps not finding out. But five years and an entire space sector branding them and all people wearing their symbols (Strange told Conner not to wear the S symbol because it was Superman's symbol) a GL in charge of that sector would have probably been given a lot of backlash which would lead to him or her invesitgating and finding this out. It is just does not hold up if you put too much thought into it, so I think we are just going to have to accept the writers made a plothole and move on.
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  • Avatar of edmasterchaos

    edmasterchaos

    [27]May 13, 2012
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    Just realized. They ruined the Reach. Well, i was going to put on a bunch of paragraphs explaining why i liked this show now, but now that the Reach is secretly in force with The Light... eh.... damn you New 52, you ruin everything you touch.

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    MajLorne

    [28]May 13, 2012
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    RaizenYusuke wrote:
    If the Guardians knew they would have called John in for abusing his power. Even if Sinsetro incicent did not happen in this universe a Green Lantern attacking a planet for 16 hours is something the Guardians would not approve without some kind of explanation. This incident was not even contained within this planet. A entire sector of space has John Stewart's face plastered on it as an outlaw. Granted the planet was not in sector 2814 (The Earth Green Lantern's sector of space), but a Green Lantern is in that sector. The incident is big throughout that start system the chances of that Green Lantern not going there in 5 years is silm. Five years is just too much time for this incident to be believable. If the League was only outlaws in hat one planet I could buy the Guardians and Corps not finding out. But five years and an entire space sector branding them and all people wearing their symbols (Strange told Conner not to wear the S symbol because it was Superman's symbol) a GL in charge of that sector would have probably been given a lot of backlash which would lead to him or her invesitgating and finding this out. It is just does not hold up if you put too much thought into it, so I think we are just going to have to accept the writers made a plothole and move on.
    Exactly, totally agreed. The people of that planet would've either taken their anger out on the GL of the sector or at least demanded reparations. 5 years has passed and no word came back asking for John Stewart to answer for what he did? It doesn't add up here plus him admitting he never thought about being sent into space while under mind control.

    I gave the creators a pass on the 16 hrs and Aqualad stuff while most fans were pissed about the timeskip, but the GL thing needs to be cleared up. I hope for maybe a subplot or explaination rather than to leave such an obvious loose end left unresolved.
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  • Avatar of arom721

    arom721

    [30]May 13, 2012
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    [QUOTE="RaizenYusuke"]


    My problem with the tie-in comics is not everyone can buy them. I dislike how games and tie-comics are going to connect what happened within those 5 years. I would rather stick with learn bits and pieces of the past (possibly flashbacks) to find ou what happened. What made Megan so cut throat now. I thinffk I am in theminority here when I say I like it. Last week most were pissed at her for taking such extreme actions, but I like the grayness. In both cases they needed the information quickly and doing it the safe way would take time they didn't really have a lot of time to do it the right way. I really hope Wally is the Flash now. His treatment in the comics made me sick. As soon as Barry came back DC shoved him aside, which I found disrespectful to a character who had been Flash for 2 decades and rightful earned the name. I can't stand it if Wally was shoved aside in this series as well. At least make him the Flash.


    [/QUOTE I completely agree with you on the treatment of Wally West by DC Comics. He was flash for over 20 years and no mention of him in the new 52. Most websites most fans like Wally better than Barry but dc insist on using Barry. I have boycotted flash comics myself because i cant stand Barry Allen. And i didnt see flash with the others at the end of this episode. Heres hoping that Wally took over as The Flash

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  • Avatar of ericwashere15

    ericwashere15

    [31]May 13, 2012
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    RaizenYusuke wrote:
    If the Guardians knew they would have called John in for abusing his power. Even if Sinsetro incicent did not happen in this universe a Green Lantern attacking a planet for 16 hours is something the Guardians would not approve without some kind of explanation. This incident was not even contained within this planet. A entire sector of space has John Stewart's face plastered on it as an outlaw. Granted the planet was no in sector 2814 (The Earth Green Lantern's sector of space), but a Green Lantern is in that sector. The incident is big throughout that start system the chances of that Green Lantern not going there in 5 years is silm. Five years is just too much time for this incident to be believable. If the League was only outlaws in hat one planet I could buy the Guardians and Corps not finding out. But five years and an entire space sector branding them and all people wearing their symbols (Strange told Conner not to wear the S symbol because it was Superman's symbol) a GL in charge of that sector would have probably been given a lot of backlash which would lead to him or her invesitgating and finding this out. It is just does not hold up if you put too much thought into it, so I think we are just going to have to accept the writers made a plothole and move on.


    I agree wholeheartedly on everything there, but perhaps it isn't a plot hole. Remember, the bad guys are the Light, who began planning out their scheme years in advance. Though we won't know for sure until God knows when, they could have a corrupted Guardian or two on their side, who didn't do anything to deliberately escalate tension between that sector and the League.
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    RaizenYusuke

    [32]May 13, 2012
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    I suppose, but would anyone really want Savage's infulene to reach as far as the Guardians of the Universe? If it reaches that level it means he potentially has corrupted or taken control of a lot major powers in space like High Father and Darksied. I don't want the Ligh to be that powerful.
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    E-Hero21

    [33]May 14, 2012
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    While it seems to be a popular thing that people seem to like what's become of Aqualad, I personally hate it or at least the execution of it. I hate having watched the development of his character from the start only for us to be dropped in the middle of this 5 years later and now he's a villain and we're basically told to just roll with it. For me, this time skip has had its share of trouble since it only tells us this is how things are now without us knowing anything of what lead up to it. And while we were given an explanation for Aqualad, it just comes across as glossing over things rather than guiding us into what happened.I'm hoping that something more comes of this because if this is just gonna be how things are now, I'm kinda pissed.
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    roweantarts

    [34]May 14, 2012
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    I wholeheartedly agree with everything about how the guardians should've known about this.


    As for Aqualad, well, it was certainly already in circulation before this series that his father was black Manta, and it seems a combination of heartache and hatred for the both the team, and especially Aquaman drove him to his father's side. What I'd like to know is how much he knows about what his father's doing, and (assuming it's not everything)would he really agree to it if he did know all?


    Side note: Anyone else love the fact that Superman stayed behind to try and rescue the Kroloteans, whilst everyone else fled?

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    kanniballl

    [35]May 14, 2012
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    TranAnh0 wrote:


    the kroletean who mentioned the competitor was the one shot by bumblebee so i think he referred to blue beetle as the competitor's warrior. so the competitor should be the Reach who were, just like the kroleteans, conquerors of worlds so the competitor shud be a good name for them. but not sure. im not really familiar with the blue beetle comics.



    My guess is the Competitors are the Reach and they were referring to Blue Beetle as the warrior from the night prior.



    The Blue Beetle depicted here is Jaime Reyes wearing the scarab... which in the comics is actually "Reach" battle armor. The Reach are some serious bad dudes, they plant the Scarabs on worlds to pretend to be heroes + saviours. The Scarabs then take over the minds of the host to run through the real plan: preparing the planet for conquest. Weakening defenses and such. Prior to the reboot, the armor itself was SERIOUSLY hard-core: lethal weapons, Weapons of Mass Destruction, etc... AND it was found that there was a device left on the plant that the Beetle could use to pretty much take it over all by itself.


    However, in the comics... on Earth the Scarab was damaged centuries/millenia ago so its take-over programming is glitched. It's not able to 100% take over its host as intended and prior to the reboot its memories were damaged. Eventually, Jaime teaches it to develop its own real personality and it CHOOSES to defy the Reach. But some of that was lost when the Scarab had to reset itself after taking on a whole batallion of other Scarabs in orbit.


    Meanwhile, with the DCNew reboot; conquest == cocooning a planet so their masters can consume the life force of everything on it.


    Both prior to the reboot and afterwards, the Reach are enemies of the Lanterns. And the Oans apparently kept their existence secret, even though they programmed the rings to make the wearers want to destroy and Reach they encountered.


    Even in the comics, the heroes around Jaime think it's weird when he's talking to himself like that... even some years later after they learned that he's just talking to the armor.

    Edited on 05/14/2012 6:47am
    Edited 2 total times.
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    kanniballl

    [36]May 14, 2012
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    Well, they asked the obvious question... if the Justice League's actions were such a big deal in the galaxy... then why didn't any of Earth's Green Lanterns hear about it over the last 5 years. Considering the GLs are a galactic peace-keeping force and the Oans pass on some info back.


    You'd think they Oans would say WTF and ask some GL's to at least bring in the offending GL for questioning.

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    kanniballl

    [37]May 14, 2012
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    roweantarts wrote:


    Side note: Anyone else love the fact that Superman stayed behind to try and rescue the Kroloteans, whilst everyone else fled?



    Yup, a very Superman thing to do. But it makes sense, he's just about Invulnerable AND has super speed. So it only makes sense for him to stay behind and try. While Wonderwoman is hard-core, it's been shown that she's not as invulnerable as him.

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    kanniballl

    [38]May 14, 2012
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    ericwashere15 wrote:
    I agree wholeheartedly on everything there, but perhaps it isn't a plot hole. Remember, the bad guys are the Light, who began planning out their scheme years in advance. Though we won't know for sure until God knows when, they could have a corrupted Guardian or two on their side, who didn't do anything to deliberately escalate tension between that sector and the League.


    Add to that, the Guardians / Oans are kind of jerks all by themselves. They've been jerks since forever, though lately they've just been getting worse and worse (in the comics anyway).


    But having the Light corrupt them? Or at least getting them on their side? I have t oagree with other posts, I really hope not. That would be a bit "much"


    My guess: perhaps they did something to the Lantern of that sector they invaded. In the comics, at least at one point, it was requested that Lanterns try to stay in their own Sector as much as possible... meaning if the Light did something to that Lantern's sector then the other Lanterns (and Oans) might be in the dark about it.

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    antilifecu

    [40]May 14, 2012
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    E-Hero21 wrote:
    While it seems to be a popular thing that people seem to like what's become of Aqualad, I personally hate it or at least the execution of it. I hate having watched the development of his character from the start only for us to be dropped in the middle of this 5 years later and now he's a villain and we're basically told to just roll with it. For me, this time skip has had its share of trouble since it only tells us this is how things are now without us knowing anything of what lead up to it. And while we were given an explanation for Aqualad, it just comes across as glossing over things rather than guiding us into what happened.I'm hoping that something more comes of this because if this is just gonna be how things are now, I'm kinda pissed.


    I am sure the writers will do something about the five years we missed. I kind of like this way of narrative since it keeping us wondering. Of course, as long as they tell us what happened later on.
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