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Official Discussion Thread: Beneath (possible spoilers)

  • Avatar of RaizenYusuke

    RaizenYusuke

    [21]May 28, 2012
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    But it is not just because Nightwing that has Batgrl so at ease. She acts so natural around all the girls in this episode. No doubt she knows Dick is considering, but Tim knows Dick out of costume too and he still acts all uptight and by the rules when compared to Babs.
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    ericwashere15

    [22]May 28, 2012
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    RaizenYusuke wrote:
    But it is not just because Nightwing that has Batgrl so at ease. She acts so natural around all the girls in this episode. No doubt she knows Dick is considering, but Tim knows Dick out of costume too and he still acts all uptight and by the rules when compared to Babs.


    Tim's probably only known Dick for a month or so since he was just "getting his feet wet" in the first episode of the season. Barbara grew up alongside Dick, so she knows him a lot better. She was probably one of the first of the new guys (Blue Beetle, Beast Boy, Bumblebee, Tim, etc.) to join the team.

    I wanna guess that the original team didn't begin adding members until about a year and a half to this season.
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  • Avatar of RaizenYusuke

    RaizenYusuke

    [23]May 28, 2012
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    She should know Dick better, but what I am saying is she has probably been Batgirl for a few years now while Tim is probably still a rookie, which would explain why he is so nervous and quiet in the season priemere. Knowing Dick can't be the only reason Babs feels comfortable in YJ, if it was than I think Tim would feel more at ease.
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    kanniballl

    [24]May 29, 2012
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    ericwashere15 wrote:
    Tim's probably only known Dick for a month or so since he was just "getting his feet wet" in the first episode of the season. Barbara grew up alongside Dick, so she knows him a lot better. She was probably one of the first of the new guys (Blue Beetle, Beast Boy, Bumblebee, Tim, etc.) to join the team. I wanna guess that the original team didn't begin adding members until about a year and a half to this season.


    Was he "just getting his feet wet" in general?


    Or as part of a team?



    Recall, that at the beginning of the show that Dick himself was pretty green when it came to working in large groups. His comments MIGHT have been part of that: this was Tim's first real big-team mission where he's a lead... as opposed to running around Gotham with Batman.


    Also, I don't recall Dick hanging out much with Tim back when Tim was starting out While they eventually became like brothers, Dick was elsewhere starting off on his own while Tim was starting out. But it's been a while since I've read those books

    Edited on 05/29/2012 6:08am
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    edmasterchaos

    [25]May 29, 2012
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    How old is Batgirl anyway? She looked older than Robin back in season one, couple of years older, so she should be anywhere between 19 to 22 and in that case, why is she a part of Young Justice? Bats just doesn't trust her to be in the Justice League yet?

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    cryptceeper99

    [26]May 30, 2012
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    Since it seems that they're bringing in Apache Chief at least thats the hint that Blue Beetles friend will become hopefully we'll get to see some other characters that havent been seen yet like Static since he and the other characters of Milestone are now officially part of DC and since they already brought in Icon and Rocket . Personally I'd like to see some of the newer characters like Bombshell , Kid Devil or Black Alice even.

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    kanniballl

    [27]May 30, 2012
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    edmasterchaos wrote:


    How old is Batgirl anyway? She looked older than Robin back in season one, couple of years older, so she should be anywhere between 19 to 22 and in that case, why is she a part of Young Justice? Bats just doesn't trust her to be in the Justice League yet?



    At least in the (pre New52) comics, I believe Barbara and Dick were about the same age (give or take). Like there were in college around the same time. Which would make sense now: being 5 years later they're both young adults (or there-abouts).


    But I believe she also started as a masked-crime-fighter later than Dick.


    Meanwhile it seems the JL is picky about who they let in: that it's not just power and skill, but experience + personality + trust + whatever. So, if say Dick only recently became a member and Babs is a few years behind him in experience then it might make sense for her membership to lag as well.


    Plus I don't recall if she ever really belonged to the JL in the comics.



    Edited on 05/30/2012 5:50am
    Edited 2 total times.
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    kanniballl

    [28]May 30, 2012
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    I got a chuckle out of Batgirl making Dick feel uncomfortable about "justifying" why he picked an all-girl team.


    Though it makes sense, women appear to be the minority the JL and Young Justice... so putting a team together of pretty much your entire minority group might seem odd. It's like if in your office, a quarter of your dept was a certain minority... and you put them all together in a team. Someone might ask (or at least feel) "WTF"



    But the main point was to "remind" viewers of Queen Bee's powers, and to give us a chuckle.

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  • Avatar of RaizenYusuke

    RaizenYusuke

    [29]May 30, 2012
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    edmasterchaos wrote:

    How old is Batgirl anyway? She looked older than Robin back in season one, couple of years older, so she should be anywhere between 19 to 22 and in that case, why is she a part of Young Justice? Bats just doesn't trust her to be in the Justice League yet?

    Roy was 18 at the start of the series and Green Arrow ad the rest of the League did not even think to invite to join despite being a legal adult. They were going to bench him like they did Robin, KF, and Aqualad. I think it comes down to if the JL think the candidate is ready regardless of age. If I was to guess I would say Barbara has been Batgirl for like two years and so Batman and the others do not feel she has enough experienceto join, so they put her on YJ to gain that experience. She may be older, but she doesn't have nearly as much experience as Nightwing, MM, and Superboy at this point, all members who turned down initations to the League.
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  • Avatar of edmasterchaos

    edmasterchaos

    [30]May 30, 2012
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    RaizenYusuke wrote:
    edmasterchaos wrote:


    How old is Batgirl anyway? She looked older than Robin back in season one, couple of years older, so she should be anywhere between 19 to 22 and in that case, why is she a part of Young Justice? Bats just doesn't trust her to be in the Justice League yet?


    Roy was 18 at the start of the series and Green Arrow ad the rest of the League did not even think to invite to join despite being a legal adult. They were going to bench him like they did Robin, KF, and Aqualad. I think it comes down to if the JL think the candidate is ready regardless of age. If I was to guess I would say Barbara has been Batgirl for like two years and so Batman and the others do not feel she has enough experienceto join, so they put her on YJ to gain that experience. She may be older, but she doesn't have nearly as much experience as Nightwing, MM, and Superboy at this point, all members who turned down initations to the League.
    Yes, but there are also a load of new Justice Leagers now, their rules were softened since they let a bunch in last season, and it seems even more people got accepted even beyond the YJ cast.


    Eh, I guess the experience will be, then.


    @Kannibal: I'm pretty sure she was, though of course in her role of Oracle.

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  • Avatar of Geodude

    Geodude

    [31]May 31, 2012
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    Dick and Barbara are about the same age.

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  • Avatar of stevie4eva

    stevie4eva

    [32]Jun 20, 2012
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    This is the first episode of the second season i liked.


    I like all the backround we got on Blue. one of the probloms with this season was the lack of backround knowelage we got. It was great but it got really dark. Not many children tv shows include domestic violance and when they do the boyfriends are half haserd and 2 dimensional. But this guy had so much depth i was scared of him. He was so flushed out even though it was the first and probobly last time we'll se him.The writers did such igood job handeling it. they didnt give him the stereotypical lines like, "hey kidgo get me a bear." he almost had a possesive nature to him. hymi wasn't just intimidated physicaly but mentaly too, He obviously intimidated tys mom aswell. whenevere hes around she had tired excpresions and it was a strange mixture of hate and love. wich alot domestic violances forget. the love part. the women is usually still inlove with the man hurting her. she was constantly appologizing for him.


    I have wanted an all girl teamup for a while. for some reason cartoon producers have it in there heads that ten year old boys wont watch a show that focuses on the femails. they added subtle digs to the idea that girls can do everything a dood can only we can do it in heels. like babs lines were amazing. "now you wouldn't have to justify and all male teem would you" i liked mrs. m as leader. i also liked when the plane went down and cassady tried to stop it. it was a classic superman moment and to see take cassady with that role was amazing. a lot of people are complaning that zatana and rocket werent in this episode. but remember they arent on the team, so it wouldn't make much sence.


    when iciclr jt whent after mgann and mentioned bell reve i clung to that. the little things that tie the two seasons together. like some of the antagonist, and characters.


    the first time mgann fought simon she barely won with superboys help. the second he had a litle hesitence but she performed her first labotomy, now he was scared he only fought as a distraction so the others could kill her in the mortal relm. it ties back to when martian manhunter said that she had a stronger telapathic mind than even him

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  • Avatar of teenj12

    teenj12

    [33]Aug 9, 2012
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    RaizenYusuke wrote:
    edmasterchaos wrote:


    How old is Batgirl anyway? She looked older than Robin back in season one, couple of years older, so she should be anywhere between 19 to 22 and in that case, why is she a part of Young Justice? Bats just doesn't trust her to be in the Justice League yet?


    Roy was 18 at the start of the series and Green Arrow ad the rest of the League did not even think to invite to join despite being a legal adult. They were going to bench him like they did Robin, KF, and Aqualad. I think it comes down to if the JL think the candidate is ready regardless of age. If I was to guess I would say Barbara has been Batgirl for like two years and so Batman and the others do not feel she has enough experienceto join, so they put her on YJ to gain that experience. She may be older, but she doesn't have nearly as much experience as Nightwing, MM, and Superboy at this point, all members who turned down initations to the League.
    Roy was 17. That's why he had to join the team in Insecurity. He had to wait a few weeks till he was 18 to be on the league. Which was somewhere between Insecurity and Usual Suspects.


    As for this episode, the best of the season in my opinion. The girls did extremely well alone. I enjoyed their mission.

    Edited on 08/09/2012 4:32pm
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  • Avatar of Kindredtown

    Kindredtown

    [34]Aug 10, 2012
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    teenj12 wrote:


    RaizenYusuke wrote:
    edmasterchaos wrote:


    How old is Batgirl anyway? She looked older than Robin back in season one, couple of years older, so she should be anywhere between 19 to 22 and in that case, why is she a part of Young Justice? Bats just doesn't trust her to be in the Justice League yet?


    Roy was 18 at the start of the series and Green Arrow ad the rest of the League did not even think to invite to join despite being a legal adult. They were going to bench him like they did Robin, KF, and Aqualad. I think it comes down to if the JL think the candidate is ready regardless of age. If I was to guess I would say Barbara has been Batgirl for like two years and so Batman and the others do not feel she has enough experienceto join, so they put her on YJ to gain that experience. She may be older, but she doesn't have nearly as much experience as Nightwing, MM, and Superboy at this point, all members who turned down initations to the League.
    Roy was 17. That's why he had to join the team in Insecurity. He had to wait a few weeks till he was 18 to be on the league. Which was somewhere between Insecurity and Usual Suspects.


    As for this episode, the best of the season in my opinion. The girls did extremely well alone. I enjoyed their mission.




    Roy was 18. It was stated in the episode when the two different worlds were made. He was in the all adult one. Robin said "Every adult eighteen and older disappeared. Even Roy."


    He had to wait because that was when everyone was going to be brought into the team. He had to join the team because Green Arrow told him to show the team that it's alright to be on the Junior League while waiting to be members of the actual Justice League.

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  • Avatar of kanniballl

    kanniballl

    [35]Aug 23, 2012
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    Kindredtown wrote:


    Roy was 18. It was stated in the episode when the two different worlds were made. He was in the all adult one. Robin said "Every adult eighteen and older disappeared. Even Roy."


    He had to wait because that was when everyone was going to be brought into the team. He had to join the team because Green Arrow told him to show the team that it's alright to be on the Junior League while waiting to be members of the actual Justice League.



    Tough call. Between not me not remembering dialog AND mistakes due happen in TV shows / dialog... plus the fact that "Roy" was really only a couple of years old chronologically (being a clone). But still...



    I don't remember the dialog or the timestamps shown at the intro to the episodes, but I can look at episode numbers.


    I "think" Season 1 took place over what, 6 months? Starting with Independence Day and ending with New Years?


    There were 26 episodes, and "Misplaced" (kid switching) was #19. That's a solid chunk of the 6 months right there, I'm guessing in the fall.


    So... I guess


    - It's possible he was still 17 at "Independence Day" but turned 18 by "Misplaced"


    - Or perhaps he was already 18 by Independence Day, hence his annoyance. And the "Misplaced" line was a mistake.


    - etc.




    Edited on 08/23/2012 7:10am
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